An oldie

  1. wolram

    wolram 3,781
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    I know that crop circles have been discussed to death but, has all the data
    gleaned from the investigations of these anomalies shown that they are hoaxes
    ie the node explosions?
     
  2. jcsd
  3. arildno

    arildno 12,015
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    Yes, node explosions create hoax circles. :confused:
     
  4. wolram

    wolram 3,781
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    A "node explosion", is explained by the water in the plant stem boiling, by
    some unknown process, which bursts the stem at a node.
     
  5. Here is some research which talks about an 'electromagnetic point (or spherically shaped) radiation source at a height of 4.1 meters above the ground':

    http://archiv.fgk.org/99/Berichte/Hoeven99/index.shtml

     
  6. wolram

    wolram 3,781
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    Thanks PIT2

    A very interesting paper
     
  7. wolram

    wolram 3,781
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  8. Ivan Seeking

    Ivan Seeking 12,538
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    I tend to think that genuine anomalies are found, probably the simple donut shaped impressions that go way, way back, and if in fact strong EM effects were present - in these cases involving the so called exploded nodes - these are probably due to ball lightning, or a close but unrecognized cousin.

    As a seat of the pants notion, one thing has always interested me is the idea that a field of wheat or grass at the peak of its pollen cycle, on a dry day or night, might be capable of generating a fairly high static potential. This struck me while watching a dark cloud of smoke, actually grass pollen, wafting around the valley below our place here in Oregon at the peak of the season. With the billions [?] of prickly protrusions, and the pollen to act as a charge carrier, it seems possible that a signficant local potential might be generated. Note that grain dust is famous for static charge generated explosions. Dust can be an excellent charge carrier.
     
  9. wolram

    wolram 3,781
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    Ivan
    Do you have more on this? your idea is fascinating, does it explain the variety
    of shapes? any more scientific investigations?
     
  10. Chronos

    Chronos 10,134
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    So why don't these hyperadvanced, crop hating aliens give us a gem of knowledge in return? Has anyone explained the concept of school chalkboard to these bug eyed, thin lipped morons? And why haven't they imprinted any fancy equations like e =mc^2? Forgive me for saying .... cowpie. It drops on the ground, is smelly and the best thing you can do is walk away from it.
     
  11. wolram

    wolram 3,781
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    Yes the literature is full of alien rubbish Chronos, but beyond the hoaxes and
    nuttery there may be a small percentage of events that justify scientific
    investigation, an unknown "earthly", explanation is possible, but robust
    scientific evidence seems thin, i thought, "node explosions", worthy of
    investigation, as it may tie in with anomalous atmospheric electromagnetic discharge, obviously this would not create intricate patterns, "they must be
    hoaxes", but a simple circle or shape could be a natural phenomena.
     
  12. Ivan Seeking

    Ivan Seeking 12,538
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    So what do you know about the subject? And why do you insist that aliens are involved?
     
  13. Ivan Seeking

    Ivan Seeking 12,538
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    I don't think that we need to explain a variety of shapes; at least not complex shapes. As far back as the 1940s, meteorologists knew about this circle [donut shaped] phenomenon occuring in fields, and they hypothesized that since these impressions were often found near the bases of a hills, vortices that form along the ridge of the hilltops may rotate down as they cross the valley.

    With the reports of bright, multicolored lights, and other EM effects allegedly associated with some crop circles, I began to wonder if something like ball lightning might be involved. Then then idea of a static potential forming over a field, something that might provide the potential for some static charge event, ultimately resulted from work that I had done with High Voltage. But I have never seriously explored the idea.
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2005
  14. Ivan Seeking

    Ivan Seeking 12,538
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    There was a rather convincing woman interviewed on one of AC Clarke's shows. She claimed that as a child she had seen a circle form in the field right in front of her. She reported hearing a buzzing, electric noise, and this was followed by the sudden formation of a circular impression, about ten meters across IIRC, in the field of grass. She said that it formed all at once as if someone had set down a large, invisible plate.
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2005
  15. There is a guy in Holland who says he sometimes gets attracted towards a field of crops, walks into it, sees a ball of light and goes unconscious. He then wakes up inside a cropcircle. So far there have appeared around 60 circles in the area place.

    Nancy Talbot from BLT research went to investigate and witnessed the forming of a cropcircle by 'tubes of light':

    http://www.bltresearch.com/eyewitness1.html

    The guy actually also videotaped some of these balls of light from his balcony:

    http://www.ufoplaza.nl/~ganzegal/vid/BoLHoeven.RM

    The balls dont just appear near crops, they go whereever the guy goes. His family thought he was crazy at first, untill his sister one night also saw many balls of light appear which scorched a window. His parents have since then also witnessed the events. The guy also sees a whole range of other paranormal phenomena and as a kid saw 'shadows' flowing down his bedroom walls. He has also taken pictures of a 'grey' materialising in his house. A TV crew that went to investigate also took pictures of this thing. All these pics look fake and 2D though, but who knows.
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2005
  16. wolram

    wolram 3,781
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    Thanks guys

    I have been looking for, "events", in my area, the nearest i could find was in
    oxfordshire about 40 miles from me, do you know if "locality", is a factor, ie
    loads of circles in one area but none in an adjacent one?
    What about soil types? my area is mostly lias clay and AFAIK no reported
    circles.
    The only unusual event i can find for this area is, a post wind mill was nocked
    down and several trees uprooted by a "tornado", many years ago.
     
  17. Chronos

    Chronos 10,134
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  18. There can obviously be more explanations than aliens or humans.
    For instance, rainbows arent made by aliens, should we then conclude that they are made by humans?

    Here are some balls of light that were captured by a BBC camera crew:
    http://www.ufoplaza.nl/~ganzegal/vid/bbcufo.rm
     
  19. Ivan Seeking

    Ivan Seeking 12,538
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    I think its important to be clear on what we mean. There are certainly many hoaxes; probably all of the complex designs IMO. I find it very unlikely that any naturally occurring phenomenon could produce any of the complex artwork passed off as crop circles. But, it seems unrealistic to argue that strong wind vortices could not produce circular of donut shaped impressions in a field of grass or wheat. We know that it can. The real question is whether or not EM is or could somehow be present when this happens - as part of some more exotic animal like ball lightning, which might correlate to some crop circle formations. Ball lightning is now considered real by most meteorologists and atmospheric scientists.
     
  20. I just decided to try this microwave thing out. I cut some long grassy stuff growing outside here and put it in the microwave for about 20 seconds. There was a definite sound of popping. When I took the grass out, though, I couldn't find any exploded nodes, or exploded anything. I suppose some of the seeds may have popped and made the noise.
     
  21. What has happened to all the old threads? You remember that guy who posted all the eyewitness accounts of people who had seen dust devils and whirlwinds making crop circles? J. Wilson, I think his name was.
     
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