Anyone watching Game of Thrones? (spoilers)

[Dotini]

I was well amused by this academic criticism of Game of Thrones.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...eligion-is-dead-just-look-at-game-of-thrones/
"We all live in Westeros now"

 

[PapersOwl]

Watching game of thrones? :) I re-watched it few times, can't wait for next season :D

 

[PapersOwl]

I will have to give this show a try.

Watch at least 4 episodes and you won't be able to stop :)

 

[Dotini]

The new season starts Sunday.

HBO and the producers have done an extraordinary job of suppressing any spoilers on the fate of Jon Snow, other than insisting on the obvious.

Shall we tune in and watch for any surprises?

 

[Dotini]

This article from Esquire suggest that Game of Thrones is more science fiction than fantasy, based on Martin's vast sci-fi works published earlier in his career.

http://www.esquire.com/entertainment/tv/news/a44092/game-of-thrones-wall-theory-preston-jacobs/

 

[tobyr65]

Ugh, don't get me started. Each book was about 500 pages. I read each one and after reading them all, George didn't finish the story! I talked with him by accident at the airport one day. When he walked away a coworker told me who he was. I'm thankful I didn't know so I couldn't give him the best dressing down I'd ever regret.

 

[tobyr65]

Dotini, Esquire is 100% wrong.

 

[Ryan_m_b]

Ugh, don't get me started. Each book was about 500 pages. I read each one and after reading them all, George didn't finish the story! I talked with him by accident at the airport one day. When he walked away a coworker told me who he was. I'm thankful I didn't know so I couldn't give him the best dressing down I'd ever regret.

Come on be fair to the guy, he's pushing seventy and has been publishing stories since he was in his late twenties. If you look through his bibliography you'll find that like most moderately successful authors (he didn't become very successful until late in life) he published novels every couple of years with short story collections/novellas in between. Just like the vast majority of authors (the vast majority of workers in fact) his work rate has slowed with age.

 

[Dotini]

I've stumbled across a theory that explains Melisandre in Season 6, Episode 1. It also predicts what's going to happen next to Jon Snow. It coincidentally happens to tally with my reading of Martin's Sci-Fi fiction of the 70's and 80's.

Spoiler: Theory explains Melisandre and predicts Jon

It begins in these two links:
http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-e...ead-a-spoilerific-recap-for-the-a6999191.html
https://www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/com...k_regarding_melisandres_ruby_necklace/cisasro
---------------------

My take on the theory is that the red woman is a quasi-immortal shapeshifter and will reanimate Jon Snow by sacrificing her own longevity. "Only death can pay for life", it is said several times thoughout the books. On the side, I speculate that Jon Snow will lose that name and take on another, perhaps Jon Stark, or some other.

We will know next week!

 

[Rocco the Stiff]

I've stumbled across a theory that explains Melisandre in Season 6, Episode 1. It also predicts what's going to happen next to Jon Snow. It coincidentally happens to tally with my reading of Martin's Sci-Fi fiction of the 70's and 80's.

Spoiler: Theory explains Melisandre and predicts Jon

It begins in these two links:
http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-e...ead-a-spoilerific-recap-for-the-a6999191.html
https://www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/com...k_regarding_melisandres_ruby_necklace/cisasro
---------------------

My take on the theory is that the red woman is a quasi-immortal shapeshifter and will reanimate Jon Snow by sacrificing her own longevity. "Only death can pay for life", it is said several times thoughout the books. On the side, I speculate that Jon Snow will lose that name and take on another, perhaps Jon Stark, or some other.

We will know next week!

Bro, the theories of Melisandre resurrecting Jon Snow are as old as Jon Snow's death...or, well...maybe one week younger.

 

[russ_watters]

http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/...son-6-episode-2-recap-home-jon-snow/83806622/

Can I just say the continuing complaints about the treatment of women I'm seeing in commentaries about the show are starting to get on my nerves? The show spares no creativity in tortures and deaths and most are of men, but it's the less common bad treatment of women (and generally, the popular women) that causes the outrage? Annoying double standard.

 

[Greg Bernhardt]

I can't wait for when Bran meets the white walker king!

 

[russ_watters]

I can't wait for when Bran meets the white walker king!

Erm...is that a spoiler from the books?

 

[JorisL]

Erm...is that a spoiler from the books?

Not as far as I can tell but its quite a reasonable assumption to make although a part that's relevant (to me at least) for such an arc was omitted from the show :-(

 

[Greg Bernhardt]

Erm...is that a spoiler from the books?

It's been in the trailers for season 6

 

[Ryan_m_b]

Erm...is that a spoiler from the books?

There are virtually no spoilers left for the books to give IIRC. The TV show has either caught up/overtaken or disregarded some storylines entirely.

 

[Greg Bernhardt]

There are virtually no spoilers left for the books to give IIRC. The TV show has either caught up/overtaken or disregarded some storylines entirely.

I thought season 6 was basically the second half of feast of crows? There is book 5 dance of dragons. We have caught up with that?

btw, anyone know what will happen for next season? Martin is due to finish book 6 later this year, but HBO has to shoot for the next season.

 

[JorisL]

If what I've read is correct they basically finished up with the shows storyline. (Rumours mostly)
Martin said the stories won't be entirely the same IIRC not to mention he spends too much time on the show, we want books!

 

[Dotini]

I thought season 6 was basically the second half of feast of crows? There is book 5 dance of dragons. We have caught up with that?

btw, anyone know what will happen for next season? Martin is due to finish book 6 later this year, but HBO has to shoot for the next season.

The plans are for a Season 7 of well fewer than the usual 10 episodes, and likewise for an 8th. Although the contracts are yet inked.

I too am looking forward to the meeting between Bran and the whitewalker. Is it the legendary "Night's Kings"? How are the whitewalkers related to the Children of the Forest?

It's true the show has caught up to the books and is now creating its own script and plot points. But the showrunners have always said they knew the ending from working with author Martin, and the show and story eventually end up much the same.

 

[Ryan_m_b]

I thought season 6 was basically the second half of feast of crows? There is book 5 dance of dragons. We have caught up with that?

btw, anyone know what will happen for next season? Martin is due to finish book 6 later this year, but HBO has to shoot for the next season.

Yeah we've caught up with virtually everything (in terms of story lines the show includes) and overtaken in over respects.

This season and the next two are essentially being invented by the show writers but GRRM has apparently told them his plan for how the series will progress and end.

 

[peevemagpie]

Been a fan since season 1, I actually read the book. You got to check it out, you'll get hooked.

 

[cpscdave]

Spoiler: Episode 3 Spoilers !

What is Jon going to do now?!
I'm thinking he is going to head south and go say hi to Ramsay!
But who is going to lead the battle against the white walkers now?!

 

[Dotini]

Spoiler: Episode 3 Spoilers !

But who is going to lead the battle against the white walkers now?!

Sheer guess:

Spoiler

Bran. But he will try to negotiate peace.

 

[axmls]

Spoiler: Episode 3 Spoilers !

What is Jon going to do now?!
I'm thinking he is going to head south and go say hi to Ramsay!
But who is going to lead the battle against the white walkers now?!

Unfortunately...

Spoiler

He has to leave right when Sansa starts making her way to Castle Black! It seems like Sansa's going to pull an Arya and always be a step too late to actually meet up with her family.

 

[cpscdave]

This the first season I've watched as it broadcasts. I usually would wait till the season was over and binge watch it.
The week wait is killing me

 

[Marcus-H]

Was it ever revealed what happened to Jon Snows uncle after he went north of the wall?
Season 6 is torturous to watch on a weekly basis! I just want to see 'the mountain' do something cool!

 

[Dotini]

Was it ever revealed what happened to Jon Snows uncle after he went north of the wall?

No, neither in the books nor in the show.

Spoiler: Book speculation

Speculation has it that he might be "Coldhands"

 

[JorisL]

No, neither in the books nor in the show.

Spoiler: Book speculation

Speculation has it that he might be "Coldhands"

I don't know if its a hoax but reportedly the editor of the books wrote that same question in the margin of a book to which Martin replied "No".

 

[Greg Bernhardt]

I was devastated by the end of this last episode.

 

[Battlemage!]

I was devastated by the end of this last episode.

Spoiler

Hodor.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/...son-6-episode-2-recap-home-jon-snow/83806622/

Can I just say the continuing complaints about the treatment of women I'm seeing in commentaries about the show are starting to get on my nerves? The show spares no creativity in tortures and deaths and most are of men, but it's the less common bad treatment of women (and generally, the popular women) that causes the outrage? Annoying double standard.

The only thing that irks me about that is that Martin has said from day one he wanted to faithfully reflect the brutality of human history, in particular the dark ages/Middle Ages in general. Considering that even today women are treated like goats in parts of the world, I would say he's being somewhat egalitarian the way so many woman characters have so much power in these medieval societies.

But the point is, just because it's high fantasy doesn't mean the human aspect has to be unrealistic given the historical precedents of medieval society experienced in the real world. The dragons and such are only plot devices used to examine the human condition when brutality is left unchecked by an ignorant society. If you want the story to have maximal emotional impact, it needs to be as believable as possible. This is the same reason video game makers keep striving to make games look and feel more and more realistic. A medieval time setting in a fantasy story needs to have the gritty brutality of those times if it's to maximize its emotional impact.

 

[Dr Wu]

I've never knowingly watched Game of Thrones, so I can't possibly comment in any direct way about its treatment of women. All I can say on a general level is that authenticity to a given period's norms and values is one thing: their celebration - or at least a casual indifference towards them - could very well be something else again. A thought experiment: substitute the abuse of women in GOTh for what the Nazis perpetuated against the Jews and see if this distinction still holds (Oh, all right, if one wishes to remain true to to the series' mediaeval setting, apply this substitution to what Genghis Khan and His Golden Horde did to other Eurasians of whatever ethnicity, age and gender). Or am I being slightly OTT here? That's also possible, of course.

 

[Battlemage!]

I've never knowingly watched Game of Thrones, so I can't possibly comment in any direct way about its treatment of women. All I can say on a general level is that authenticity to a given period's norms and values is one thing: their celebration - or at least a casual indifference towards them - could very well be something else again. A thought experiment: substitute the abuse of women in GOTh for what the Nazis perpetuated against the Jews and see if this distinction still holds (Oh, all right, if one wishes to remain true to to the series' mediaeval setting, apply this substitution to what Genghis Khan and His Golden Horde did to other Eurasians of whatever ethnicity, age and gender). Or am I being slightly OTT here? That's also possible, of course.

What would you say of an implied rape that isn't actually shown on screen? I would say they were not celebrating the violence at all if they were to do this, but rather including it because the world the plot is set in requires such brutality.

Would you agree with that or not? If so why or why not?

The reason I ask is because that is exactly what happened with the massively controversial rape scene of last year. They didn't even show it. They panned to the other torture victim who was forced by the psychopath to watch, completely avoiding filming the actual rape (the event in the books goes into extreme disturbing detail, including the use of animals- none of which is shown in the show). I am convinced they did it for two reasons: (1) the book actually has the character Theon being forced to watch his childhood friend endure it (although they replaced the victim with a main character), and (2) they did NOT want to make the scene any worse than it had to be in order to remain faithful to both the world the plot is set in and the story originally written (with the obvious replacement of a minor character with a major one).

It seems to me that this most controversial scene (the one that had many people "swearing off" the show) was consciously filmed in the least "celebratory" way. They appeared to go out of their way to NOT show it without removing the event from the plot.

 

[Dr Wu]

Well, of course, all other things being equal, any representation of a violent act does not have to depend on whether it's depicted visually or implied by some sleight-of-hand way. Both can be equally suggestive. The grisly blinding of Gloucester in 'King Lear', a scene enacted live on stage ("Out, vile jelly!") is certainly one I shall never forget. Sometimes, though, the mind - that is to say the human imagination - can more than compensate for what the eye is not permitted to see. For this reason I find many novels (e.g. 'The Lord of The Rings') far more visually stimulating than their movie versions.

Even so, battlemage!, I take your larger point with regards to Game of Thrones. The 'noises off' mode of presentation as it is applies to this particular rape scene would seem to deny a celebratory enjoyment of violence for its own sake, while at the same time retaining its full horror. Yet even this can play both ways. Kubrick's masterstroke in implicating the viewer with his deft camera positioning during the gangbang rape scene in 'A Clockwork Orange' is a case in point. You see the violence (if glancingly) and you are part of the violence, albeit unwittingly, and for me at least, it's about as uncelebratory an act of violence to be had this side of Tarantino, or dare I suggest Shakespeare? I guess I'll just have to go and watch GOTh myself before spouting off any further about a TV series I've never seen before.

 

[Battlemage!]

Well, of course, all other things being equal, any representation of a violent act does not have to depend on whether it's depicted visually or implied by some sleight-of-hand way. Both can be equally suggestive. The grisly blinding of Gloucester in 'King Lear', a scene enacted live on stage ("Out, vile jelly!") is certainly one I shall never forget. Sometimes, though, the mind - that is to say the human imagination - can more than compensate for what the eye is not permitted to see. For this reason I find many novels (e.g. 'The Lord of The Rings') far more visually stimulating than their movie versions.

Even so, battlemage!, I take your larger point with regards to Game of Thrones. The 'noises off' mode of presentation as it is applies to this particular rape scene would seem to deny a celebratory enjoyment of violence for its own sake, while at the same time retaining its full horror. Yet even this can play both ways. Kubrick's masterstroke in implicating the viewer with his deft camera positioning during the gangbang rape scene in 'A Clockwork Orange' is a case in point. You see the violence (if glancingly) and you are part of the violence, albeit unwittingly, and for me at least, it's about as uncelebratory an act of violence to be had this side of Tarantino, or dare I suggest Shakespeare? I guess I'll just have to go and watch GOTh myself before spouting off any further about a TV series I've never seen before.

Well there is certainly gratuitous violence, horror and sex, so if you do come with a strong stomach.

 

[russ_watters]

Since I wouldn't know Ed Sheeran if I tripped over him, all I kept thinking last night was "Why isn't Arya killing those wussy Lannister soldiers?"

Good start, rest of it slow, way too much poop.