At community colleges are there any intelligent people, if you consider the following

[land_of_ice]

It would seem that there are not:
Why are people at community colleges who have a 3.0 and 4.0 + in h.s. instead of going to University ?

It makes little sence?

It would seem that only people who have bad grades are at community colleges so they can transfer to a 4 Year college from the community college?

 

[Cyrus]

I would say your generalization does not hold true. Many people I know who started at CC went to top ten graduate schools.

State schools have huge classes and don't care about their students the first two years. On top of that, they are twice as expensive. You do the math.

 

[MotoH]

Hmmm. Do I want to pay 180$ per credit, or 400$ per credit. I will take the 180$ any day of the week. The Profs. still have to be accredited, and the classes are much smaller and the teachers know you by name (unlike some undergrad classes at 4 year schools I have seen).

Do I want to take a biology class with 20 other people in it, or with 250 other people?

 

[BobG]

Provided you live in a state that puts a little teeth into the requirement that state colleges accept credits from community colleges in the state, community colleges are a good deal. And many states are forcing the 4-year colleges to accept CC credits, since voting parents are becoming very concerned about how they're going to get their kids through college.

Most are only teaching freshman and sophomore classes which are cheaper to teach. They don't have to invest in expensive equipment used in the higher level engineering, science, medical classes. Some actually teach the freshman/sophomore classes better since you have professional instructors teaching the classes instead of a TA.

Of course, that's not entirely fair to the 4-year universities. If the community colleges are going to teach the cheap classes, the 4-year universities are going to have to raise tuition, which just widens the divide in cost. They try to fight it by finding ways not to accept credits from community colleges, but that's getting harder all the time.

I could see tuition adding an extra tier where the freshman/sophomore classes at both community colleges and 4-year universities are cheap, with the junior/senior classes being expensive, and the graduate courses being very expensive (currently, part of the tuition paid by undergraduates pays for the resources used in graduate courses - that won't really be an option if 4-year colleges have to compete with community colleges).

Considering the chances of freshman/sophomores dropping out for a while to experience a little bit of life as compared to the chances of juniors/seniors dropping out when they're coming down the home stretch, backloading the cost of college isn't such a bad idea for undergraduates, but it could make it a lot tougher to get a graduate degree.

 

[MotoH]

BobG or Cyrus, one of you are CC teachers right? Is there a PSEO program at your CC? I am only a HS Junior and I will receive my AA when I graduate from high school and college. It is a wicked good deal for anyone who has a CC in their town. The HS pays for your books, materials (art classes) and for all of your credits. You basically go to CC for free.

 

[BobG]

BobG or Cyrus, one of you are CC teachers right? Is there a PSEO program at your CC? I am only a HS Junior and I will receive my AA when I graduate from high school and college. It is a wicked good deal for anyone who has a CC in their town. The HS pays for your books, materials (art classes) and for all of your credits. You basically go to CC for free.

I'm not. But the local community college here is very good and cheap. It supports adults (military adults, in particular) that might need evening classes - something the local state college doesn't do. In fact, the local 4-year college makes it as hard for adults to attend their university as possible and fight tooth and nail to avoid ever having to accept anyone that dared attend the local community college. Considering the local community college actually lists quite a few junior/senior math classes, english classes, etc (i.e. - higher level classes that only require a classroom), I could see them transitioning into a 4-year college just because the current state college is so unresponsive to the local community (a community filled with military retirees). I personally think the city should stop filling potholes on the road that leads to the 4-year college, and quit using city resources like the fire dept and police dept to protect people there.

The community college does have a program for high school students, as does at least one of the local private colleges that offers both 2-year and 4-year degrees. Akron U (Akron being the town I grew up in) used to do the same. In fact, that university was very responsive to the community since it's main purpose was originally to provide engineers for the rubber companies. They had a great work-coop program and still have a good chemical engineering program, even though the rubber companies have mostly moved away.

 

[bcross]

WHOA!
Hey there, I had a 4.0 in HS and tested out (GED) so I could work and support my family. I went to a small CC and got an AS degree then transferred to a 4 year state school, earning a BS in Biology and a MS in Physiology. I am now in a top program in Biochemistry at Johns Hopkins for my PhD.
I really don't like it when people assume poor people are not as intelligent. I am mixed race (Black, Native, Latin and white) and i come from a historically poor background. I made it here and I went to a CC. I have a friend who ended up with a MD/PhD from UCSF who went to the CC with me!
Please don't judge those of us who grew up without. Ususally, our parents didn't go to college so they don't know how we should go about it and we don't know there are scholarships, etc. available.
Thanks! =0)

 

[brainstorm]

Some people might pick a certain school to be close to a job, friends, family, etc.

 

[Topher925]

Lets see here...smaller class size, personal attention, and probably better location, all for half the price (or maybe less) of a large university. It seems to me that smarter people would go to a CC first and the dumber ones would go strait to uni.

 

[KalamMekhar]

Observatory time reserved at large Uni = 4 hours/month

Observatory time reserved at CC= Unlimited.

 

[brainstorm]

Lets see here...smaller class size, personal attention, and probably better location, all for half the price (or maybe less) of a large university. It seems to me that smarter people would go to a CC first and the dumber ones would go strait to uni.

Don't forget that a big part of university for people is social-networking with people who are connected with people who control lucrative businesses. Many students get into universities early to join fraternities, sororities, and other clubs so they can build relationships with people who can gain them favoritism in informal job-selection processes.

 

[Pengwuino]

Universities beign twice as much as community college? Forget about that! In california you pay something like $39 a unit for CC. The 2nd tier public universities, the CSU system, are on average $3000 a semester. The UC's have hit $5000 a semester last I've heard.

Not to imply the CC's are full of financial geniuses, which they aren't, but you'll definitely find people doing their boring general ed courses at community colleges because let's all face it, those courses don't matter.

 

[Math Is Hard]

I met a few different types of students at the CCs. I did my lower division work there before transferring to a "public ivy".

1) The "1810 Rule "Crowd. Their parents basically told them "unless you are working or enrolled in school by the time you are 18, you have 10 minutes to get out the door." These are generally disruptive and immature students whom I love dearly for consistently popping me up to the top of the curve whether I needed it or not.
I don't want to peg all of these folks as bad students, as many were just trying to find themselves. A good hunk of them will be back in group 4. A sliver of them will probably drop out and start companies we'd like to work for.

2) The "close but no banana" crowd. They almost made it into their school of choice, but not quite. Sometimes they can go through a CC program and get in later through a guaranteed admissions program, if they have good transcripts to show.

3) The "martys/sacrificers". These people could have gone straight into a 4 year, but decided to save their parents/themselves some money.

4) The "fogies/water-testers". That's me. These are people with years of work experience who decided to finally go back and get a degree or at least try it out. Not speaking for myself, but sometimes these people have more wisdom/field experience than the instructor, and one can learn a lot from them.

I respect group 3 the most because that takes real perspicacity to save money and delay the fun, social aspects of the freshman and sophomore year and transfer later. There may be other groups than the ones I categorized, but these are just the ones that stood out to me.

 

[Klockan3]

people who have bad grades are at community colleges

Having bad grades do not mean that you are stupid, it means that you are not motivated enough.

 

[BobG]

4) The "fogies/water-testers". That's me. These are people with years of work experience who decided to finally go back and get a degree or at least try it out. Not speaking for myself, but sometimes these people have more wisdom/field experience than the instructor, and one can learn a lot from them.

This was me, too. Except with 4 military bases, I think group 4 may have been the majority, even if some of the 4's were fairly young. The CC was a lot more accomodating of working adults' schedules, besides being a lot cheaper.

 

[Pinu7]

Undergraduate education, at least for the first two years, is fairly uniform regardless of the college/university. Surely, it does not take a fields medalist to explain linear algebra. In addition, community and junior colleges cost prohibitively less.

What makes certain universities prestige is not their undergraduates. Indeed, just about all undergraduates are equally uninteresting. It is their research. Students don't do research in their freshmen or sophomore year.