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Be Careful Student Teachers

  1. Dec 7, 2008 #1
    Be Careful Student Teachers!!

    Rather outlandish court decision...
  2. jcsd
  3. Dec 7, 2008 #2
    Re: Be Careful Student Teachers!!

    Supreme court baby.
  4. Dec 8, 2008 #3
    Re: Be Careful Student Teachers!!

    Wow. Yeah, that's pretty outlandish. So they believe that due to the description "Drunken Pirate" she was really drunk; do they also believe that she was really a pirate at the point that photo was taken? Sheesh. If she was promoting underage piracy that's a much more serious thing than promoting underage drunkenness. Perhaps she is the cause of all this stuff that has happened in Somalia recently.

    (Though, the one way I could see it is if what she's claiming is "Yes, I was definitely promoting underage drinking, but it's my First-Amendment right to." That would be dumb on her part and I could actually see that as justification for denying the teaching degree. They ought to be offering her a path to some other degree, though, one that doesn't involve them certifying her fitness to teach underage people.)
  5. Dec 8, 2008 #4
    Re: Be Careful Student Teachers!!

    How the hell could they possibly decide in favor of the school on this one? How is a picture of her drinking at a costume party, presumably entirely with people of legal age promoting underage drinking?
  6. Dec 8, 2008 #5
    Re: Be Careful Student Teachers!!


    I guess none of you bother to read the link posted where the judge clearly stated she failed to perform her tasks necessary to be awarded a teaching degree.

  7. Dec 8, 2008 #6
    Re: Be Careful Student Teachers!!

    Okay, now looking at the original article and the judge's decision, it looks like the photo didn't really have all that much to do with it, failing to get her degree had more to do with her performance in the program.
  8. Dec 8, 2008 #7
    Re: Be Careful Student Teachers!!


    1. Read post
    2. Read Link


    Post response AFTER 1 & 2.


    take foot out of mouth


    sprinf('hello world')
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2008
  9. Dec 8, 2008 #8
    Re: Be Careful Student Teachers!!

    I'm too much in the slashdot paradigm of news stories. I'm slowly transitioning to the new slashdor paradigm which is skip the article, skip the summary, start with the first comment.

    Ok, so now I read it and I've reached the conclusion that the reporter is a hack who should be shot. The article can be read either way. Aside from the oblique reference to 'poor competency' it doesn't mention anything aside the photo.
  10. Dec 8, 2008 #9
    Re: Be Careful Student Teachers!!


    for 1:2

    while i>0




    I'm sorry. I can't read your post as my computer just locked up trying to count to infinity, twice.
  11. Dec 8, 2008 #10
    Re: Be Careful Student Teachers!!

    The news story as I heard it originally was a bit different.
    I am reading the actualy court decision now and it seems that the primary issue arose some personal conflict with the teachers/staff/admin at the school where she was student teaching. She seemed to gain a reputation as being "unprofessional" in her relationships to persons at the school and was unable to shake that reputation off although her evaluations tended to point to her general improvement in these areas even getting marks such as "competent" and "superior".
    It was when a teacher found her myspace page and it's content that she was suspended from her student teacher position. This is shortly before she was to exit the program and her score for professionalism suddenly dropped to "unsatisfactory" in her final evaluation.
    The staff and admin at the school she was teaching at were not the ones who would have decided whether she graduated or not but those at her university. University requires that she complete the program and she was determined not to have graduated based on her failure to complete the program because she was suspended from her position. She was suspended from her position as a direct reaction to her myspace page's content.

    So yes while there were other factors involved the ultimate and deciding factor was her being dropped from her student teacher program which was precipitate from the discovery of the content of her myspace page.
  12. Dec 8, 2008 #11
    Re: Be Careful Student Teachers!!

    Awww, you only need to do that sort of thing if you're afraid of being wrong. Being the super-manly, fearless and testosterone-sweating yet sensitive man that I am, I have no such fear.

  13. Dec 8, 2008 #12
    Re: Be Careful Student Teachers!!

    seems to be a bit of circular reasoning.
  14. Dec 8, 2008 #13
    Re: Be Careful Student Teachers!!

    I think he just said the following, but backwards:

    Myspace Drunken Piracy discovered
    ∴ no more position at the school
    No more position at the school
    ∴ could not complete university program.
    Did not complete university program
    ∴ did not receive degree.​

    No doubling back, so no circular reasoning I can see.
  15. Dec 8, 2008 #14
    Re: Be Careful Student Teachers!!

    In the court decision it repeatedly points to issues of competency in order to form a basis for decision. The problem (in my eyes) is that they never dismissed her for these competency issues. They obvioulsy dismissed her based on the discovery of her myspace page which is plainly stated in the court decision. A teacher found the page, reported it to a superior, and she was immediately removed from the program. This discovery also appears to have had an impact on her final evaluation scores.

    Essentially we have no idea whether or not she could have graduated had she not been dropped from the program and had her scores not been influenced by the discovery of her myspace page. The myspace page, in my opinion, is at the crux of the issue and the judge seems to make it out as being peripheral.
  16. Dec 8, 2008 #15
    Re: Be Careful Student Teachers!!

    Much more simple. Thank you. :-)
  17. Dec 8, 2008 #16
    Re: Be Careful Student Teachers!!

    no, the circularity (maybe i'm not using the term correctly) comes from the assertion that the university staff make the decision on her completion, but then putting a decision that affects her completion in the hands of someone else. they're saying it's our decision, yet we have no control over it. it's as if they're trying to have it both ways and take no responsibility for it. they should say she's either competent, or not, and not let what may mostly be a personal dislike by some outside persons affect the outcome.
  18. Dec 8, 2008 #17
    Re: Be Careful Student Teachers!!

    Oh, I see what you're saying Proton. Yes, if the university staff were to defer to the outcome of her position at the school, whereas her supervisors at the school were deferring to the university staff's decision, that would be circular reasoning.
  19. Dec 8, 2008 #18
    Re: Be Careful Student Teachers!!

    let's just call it "trying to have it both ways", then. or lying.
  20. Dec 8, 2008 #19
    Re: Be Careful Student Teachers!!

    Oh, I see what you mean. I thought you meant my reasoning was circular.

    Ideally they send students to a school whose judgement they value and trust.
    To the university's credit they did shuffle around her credits and allow her a degree in english instead of education. Which is funny considering that one of the issues mentioned numerous times in the courts decision was her lack of proper spelling and grammar in the class room.

    I just went back and read more. It appears that the fatal flaw in her lawsuit strategy was that she sued the wrong people. By law she must complete the student teaching program and receive credit for completion from the school where she participated in the program. By law the University has no authority to grant those credits. Her lawsuit is against the University requesting that they grant her the credits. Why I had to read through twenty pages to find that bit I do not know. :-/
  21. Dec 8, 2008 #20
    Re: Be Careful Student Teachers!!

    oh, i see. that takes it out of the university's hands. maybe she can go back at some later date and get her state certification.
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