# Becoming Software Engineer/Network Administrator with 2 minor felonies

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varus
Is it possible to become a software engineer/Developer or network administrator for a descent company with B.Sc in Computer Science 3.5 Gpa with 2 felonies 1 for shop lifting at age of 18 and 1 for document forgery, ID cards to be exact at age of 20 and serving 12 months of probation for each felony?

ludi_srbin
You'll probably have very hard time finding job. The thing that sucks is that you did something most of the teenagers do, but I guess you had bad luck and got caught by the cops. It really, really sucks!

Gold Member
Its going to be a lil hard. Sensitive electronic information and forgery is not a good combonation but you won't know for sure unless you try :D

so-crates
I can't find a job in the tech industry with a B.S. in C.S. so I doubt if you could either with felonies on your record.

varus
I have a friend who is a software developer for a major company, he graduated from my school last year, he says he spoke with somebody within the company and he was told that shop lifting they won't care about and forgery I could say i used forged ID to buy alcohol and got cought, was a stupid teenager. On the other hand, in such competitive field who is even going to want to listen to my excuses. Only 3 semesters left.... yeah I guess I'll never know until I try.

kdinser
Right now, it's rough out there for people with CS degrees, years of experience, solid references, and clean records. I can only guess that it would be even harder with no experience and a record. I would think you would have a slightly easier time as a programmer then a system admin. System administrator is a position of immense trust, your record could disqualify you for many positions like that.

Tony11235
How bad does it look to graduate schools having something on your school record, such as a simple hack gone wrong? Like.....say you forged a classmate's email address, sending it to the teacher having it say that the student wants to drop the course. Will this scare graduate schools away even if it happened your freshmen year?

Manchot
Like.....say you forged a classmate's email address, sending it to the teacher having it say that the student wants to drop the course.

Why did you do that? That's pretty mean.

Tony11235
I couldn't help myself. I thought it was hilarious. I planned to watch it unfold sometime during class, but they didn't talk. But hey I could have done something worse, like forge the teacher's address and send a mass mail to the entire class..."Class is cancelled tomorrow".

Manchot
In that case, I would hope that a grad school takes it into consideration. Whether you thought it was hilarious or not, it was a pretty malicious act.

Tony11235
Yea it probably was. The guy didn't even know his own email password. I eventually told him I did it. He laughed. I learned one thing though, not to let my curiosity run me. Hopefully graduate schools will just ask for an explanation and understand.

Gold Member
Tony11235 said:
I couldn't help myself. I thought it was hilarious. I planned to watch it unfold sometime during class, but they didn't talk. But hey I could have done something worse, like forge the teacher's address and send a mass mail to the entire class..."Class is cancelled tomorrow".

.... that should have been an immediate expulsion from the university.

Tony11235
Pengwuino said:
.... that should have been an immediate expulsion from the university.

You're joking right? For something like that?

Gold Member
Yeah, some things & people should just loosen up, in the big picture pranks are pranks.

rocketboy
Tony11235 said:
I couldn't help myself. I thought it was hilarious. I planned to watch it unfold sometime during class, but they didn't talk. But hey I could have done something worse, like forge the teacher's address and send a mass mail to the entire class..."Class is cancelled tomorrow".

You should have made it a little less...serious...lol...like what I did was I got into my friends email account and I just sent a fake email to a few other friends. All I'll say is they were all pretty confused until I told them what I did...Oh, and I modified his start-up folder so that when he logged in about 60 pop-up windows would appear consecutively...bogged down the computer quite a bit.

Mentor
Large companies are VERY big on ethics. Which is what you're making light of.

Sarbanes-Oxley (SOX) compliance means that if you try to work for a publicly traded company, they will check your background, and they will actually verify everything on your resume. I had a Q-clearance from the department of Energy, and my company still spent two weeks verifying who I was and what I had done.

Any felony will disqualify you from working at a publicly traded company. Period.

jubs
Pardon Services

Hint... I know in Canada we have something called pardon services. A few years after your felony you can approach this government branch and get a pardon, basically they will erase it from your record. Especially since you are getting educated and are on track to a good life I am sure you would have a good chance. They are things you have done at a younger age, and by the time you graduate you will be 24-25 they will have 4 or 5 years behind you. I don't know how the US does this, but it is a very good and real option. John.

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jubs
OK after a quick search not so easy in the US. The president or in some cases governer must grant a pardon. But it is possible if you put some work into it, you have a strong case and would be stupid not to do everything in your power to get this behind you.

Tony11235
jim mcnamara said:
Large companies are VERY big on ethics. Which is what you're making light of.

Sarbanes-Oxley (SOX) compliance means that if you try to work for a publicly traded company, they will check your background, and they will actually verify everything on your resume. I had a Q-clearance from the department of Energy, and my company still spent two weeks verifying who I was and what I had done.

Any felony will disqualify you from working at a publicly traded company. Period.

You're refering to Varus, the one who started this thread, right? Me, I have no record.

Homework Helper
It might be helpful to stop calling them "minor felonies"! A "felony", by definition, is not minor. What you are talking about are "misdemeanors".

jmcgraw
jubs said:
OK after a quick search not so easy in the US. The president or in some cases governer must grant a pardon.

That's because we wouldn't use the word "pardon" for removing felony records. Pardon is a total removal of guilt; you would even be freed from prison, and only a governor or president can do that.

Do a google search for "record expungement" and you will get plenty of information for getting rid of your felonies. The laws are different in each state.

In fact, the reason I know is because the key words in this discussion are triggering a google add for record expungement at the top of the screen.

leright
ludi_srbin said:
You'll probably have very hard time finding job. The thing that sucks is that you did something most of the teenagers do, but I guess you had bad luck and got caught by the cops. It really, really sucks!

Most teenagers don't shoplift over $100 of goods, which is what is required for it to be a felony. In fact, most teenagers don't shoplift at all. As for the ID forgery, I wouldn't say 'most' do that either. To be quite honest, I would be wary about hiring you if I was an employer. However, it depends on how long its been since you've commited the crimes. leright Tony11235 said: I couldn't help myself. I thought it was hilarious. I planned to watch it unfold sometime during class, but they didn't talk. But hey I could have done something worse, like forge the teacher's address and send a mass mail to the entire class..."Class is cancelled tomorrow". It seems to me that ou don't even feel sorry for what you did, and you must completely lack ethic. If I were to decide if you got into grad school, you wouldn't be going. Tony11235 leright said: It seems to me that ou don't even feel sorry for what you did, and you must completely lack ethic. If I were to decide if you got into grad school, you wouldn't be going. I meant at the time I thought it was hilarious. I'm not laughing now am I. Science Advisor Gold Member leright said: It seems to me that ou don't even feel sorry for what you did, and you must completely lack ethic. If I were to decide if you got into grad school, you wouldn't be going. ... moral "branding" on the basis of something like this ... :surprised . A single bit world..... Gold Member leright said: Most teenagers don't shoplift over$100 of goods, which is what is required for it to be a felony. In fact, most teenagers don't shoplift at all.

As for the ID forgery, I wouldn't say 'most' do that either.

To be quite honest, I would be wary about hiring you if I was an employer. However, it depends on how long its been since you've commited the crimes.

pfff, certainly not the idiots i knew in high school! I think they even tried to excuse their criminal acts at times...

Gold Member
PerennialII said:
... moral "branding" on the basis of something like this ... :surprised . A single bit world.....

Ah yes, love the "you arent allowed to say whats moral and whats not moral" crowd. Whats next, you wont be able to say corporate fraud is immoral? Murder? Why can't we call anything immoral or unethical anymore.

Tony11235
Pengwuino said:
Ah yes, love the "you arent allowed to say whats moral and whats not moral" crowd. Whats next, you wont be able to say corporate fraud is immoral? Murder? Why can't we call anything immoral or unethical anymore.

I'm sure PerennialII was refering to the email spoofing, not the shoplifting and ID forgery. Last time I heard, email spoofing is not even illegal. Universities though will treat it like that.

Gold Member
Pengwuino said:
Ah yes, love the "you arent allowed to say whats moral and whats not moral" crowd. Whats next, you wont be able to say corporate fraud is immoral? Murder? Why can't we call anything immoral or unethical anymore.

Good catch Tony .... as far as I'm concerned can say whatever one wants, but linking spoofing like this to ones ability to take on grad school for example .... don't see the correlation. Save judgement to stuff that matter and use common sense what comes to kiddie stuff such as this one (and the ID forgery etc. are close 2nds), it's not like banning people out of society for every little mess is any help even in the big picture (other than a display of PC moral "superiority", which seems to be pretty contagious nowadays).

varus
Well, what I'm curious about is, will employer even give me a chance to explain why I have that record, that just because I used fake id (altered Dob) to buy alcohol when I was under 21 it doesn't mean that I will do a bad job in programming or can't be trusted with sensitive information, or they just disqualify you automatically after being asked about a felony in the questionnaire and you mark "Yes", maybe it's better to mark "No" and then when confronted have a chance to explain?

jubs
No, definitely do not lie. What you have to realize is these people will not hire you, not because of you abilities, but the fact that you may not be trustworthy. If you lie on you application that is another strike against you. Plus you don't fill out applications when you apply for real jobs, this isn't the Mceedees. If they are going to ask they will to your face, or ask you to bring in a criminal background check at which point you could admit you had a record. In any case to not lie. You made the mistake cough up the cash to get a service that will attempt to erase you record.