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News Bombs on Planes? Terror hits UK Airports

  1. Aug 10, 2006 #1
    im shour the good old US of A is also going to feel the stress, with no coffee on planes (no liquids) and flights into or out of UK Biged up Security at airports
    my boss was going out today, he aint in a good mood!

    ps it wasnt me o:)
  2. jcsd
  3. Aug 10, 2006 #2
    :rofl: yes that's courage and forebeareance of a level as yet unprecidented in our youth.:wink:

    Thanks for the story, the coverage on the news this morning was vague to say the least, there's like some people been arrested, and like there suspected of planning to bomb something realted to flights? Was about the most I got out of it:smile: if you want to travel expect delays, well duh :smile:

    Good old MI5 and the cops, this is how you win the war on terror with intelligence, not violence:smile:
  4. Aug 10, 2006 #3


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    Hmmmm. I presume that means 'bottled' milk. :biggrin: :rolleyes:

    Ouch! I don't have an iPod, but I do take a laptop computer and cell phone with me when I travel. I suppose one could check the laptop in the luggage, but would it arrive at the destination? Doing a business trip without a laptop is rather difficult these days, especially since we prefer to put presentations on the laptop. Thankfully, we have memory sticks.
  5. Aug 10, 2006 #4

    Ivan Seeking

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    Now here's an interesting twist: The price of crude dropped about $1.50 a barrel, allegedly due to expectations of reduced air travel.

    I love it! Threaten our planes and we'll drop the price of oil. :rofl:
  6. Aug 10, 2006 #5


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    Sounds like the idiots've been watching too much "MacGyver" --- gonna mix the bombs on the plane --- without someone noticing? Without burning holes in themselves? Scotland Yard should've let them go ahead and do the self-mutilations, then, rather than arresting them, just deport them for their friends to see.
  7. Aug 10, 2006 #6
    This isn't intelligent at all! This is absolutely idiotic! It is common knowledge that al-Qaeda hoped to smuggle explosives onboard disguised as harmless liquids - this is exactly what Ramzi Yousef did when planning for the 1995 attempted bombings, hiding nitroglycerin as a bottle of contact-lens solution! (wikipeda)

    And now, eleven years later, they've suddenly decided (NYT) to set up permanent screening of carry-on liquids, only after a repeat of 1995 was attempted. That's idiocy for you. And if they're targeting mothers with babies and milk bottles - well, that's so profoundly moronic and heartless that I will refrain from commenting on it.
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 10, 2006
  8. Aug 10, 2006 #7
    Expanding the second link in my previous post:


    Yes, they're "rushing" to counter this 'new' threat, a full decade after it almost succeeded in a massive act of terrorism (wiki), right after giving the terrorists a second attempt at the exact same plan.

    So remind me - what exactly was our anti-terror strategy for the past five years, again?
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 10, 2006
  9. Aug 10, 2006 #8
    Oh yeah, now I remember! Get Saddam Hussein's nukes.
  10. Aug 10, 2006 #9


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    So are you saying that all liquids, and carry on electronics should have been banned since 1995?

    They're allowing baby formula & medication onboard, although when I traveled, I used the powdered formula as it took up less space and I could mix each bottle fresh and it required no refrigeration.

    I haven't read anywhere that this was a "new" type of threat, they uncovered a plot, which they've been monitorting since December of 2005.
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2006
  11. Aug 10, 2006 #10
    No, merely that some appropriate discrimination should have been implemented that could thwart either the 1995 or 2006 attempts. That's what they're going to implement anyway in response to this, it's in the NYT article I quoted. They list various methods of chemical detection there.

    Except they've waited until two nearly-successful attempts of the same plot, a decade apart, and since they don't have anything ready there'll be a long period of time where they just ban all liquids. They simply haven't prepared anything for this.
  12. Aug 10, 2006 #11
  13. Aug 10, 2006 #12


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    It's because unless there is a crisis shoved in the public's face, people don't want to be inconvenienced. There is no need to take liquids or electronics onboard an airplane, but it is something that people have become used to.

    Heaven forbid someone should take a book to read and drink ther water available on board the plane.

    It's nice for a business person to be able to work with their computer on long flights, but it's not a necessity.

    My concern is that these liquids can be taped to the body, full body searches will be required unless they use those "stripper x-ray machines. But that still won't prevent people from inserting supplies into body cavities. Is there really any way to prevent this? What about those gelled shoe inserts?
  14. Aug 10, 2006 #13
    A while back they said they would use MS to detect those things.


    That source is from 2005, but I remember it being heavily discussed in 2001 and maybe earlier. Not sure what's happened with that - I think it's already used in a few places to screen luggage (not passengers). Anyone know?
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 10, 2006
  15. Aug 10, 2006 #14
    Here's a 2004 report about possibly applying it to passenger screening:

    Opportunities to Improve Airport Passenger Screening with Mass Spectrometry (2004)
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 22, 2017
  16. Aug 10, 2006 #15
  17. Aug 10, 2006 #16


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    Unfortunately the liquids to be used this time would not raise any alarms as they are common substances that can be purchased in grocery and hardware stores, they are harmless alone, it's only when mixed that they form an explosive.
  18. Aug 10, 2006 #17


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    You wanna stand in line behind some dowager while the screeners pull samples from every bottle in her makeup case to run through an FT-IR? Or, you wanna stand in line behind the same dowager while her makeup case gets run through X-ray?


    Explosives detection methods? Look for nitrated organics --- gonna find 'em everywhere --- what's the "trigger" level? What about flash powder and all the non-nitro explosives? There aren't enough people to staff a full analytical laboratory at every airline passenger check-in --- you run X-ray and look for fluoresence fingerprints from a laundry list --- or you "profile."

    Better yet, you go where they come from, and kill 'em all there.
  19. Aug 10, 2006 #18
    Look who's a nationalist... :tongue:
    Surely you do not think the MI5 did it all by themselves. I guarantee you Pakistan did much of the work. Don't think the Americans didn't help either, thank god for http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ECHELON" [Broken] eh?
    Last edited by a moderator: May 2, 2017
  20. Aug 10, 2006 #19


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  21. Aug 10, 2006 #20
    I think the problem is the lack of chemical sniffers in airports, they're quite expensive. The process is rather slow too, difficult to implement for a high volume airport - Ben-Gurion Airport has two and the line can get quite long. They can find and identify traces of gunpowder and certain chemicals in explosives.
    I could be wrong about that though.
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