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LarryS
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Can two particles be entangled in the energy property/observable? If so, what kind of experiment could verify that the two particles were energy-entangled?
Thanks in advance.
Thanks in advance.
referframe said:Can two particles be entangled in the energy property/observable? If so, what kind of experiment could verify that the two particles were energy-entangled?
newjerseyrunner said:As far as I understand, entanglement has no understood physical mechanism, it just "pops out" of the math. I like to explain entanglement using way simpler algebra.
Say you have a wave function f(x) which describes two particles. Now when you want to split them, you define one of the particles as g(x). You have now automatically defined the other particle as f(x) - g(x), there is nothing else it can be.
That's true. Thus if |ψ⟩ = √½(|00⟩ + |11⟩), which is an entangled state, then |ψ⟩⊗|ψ⟩ is not entangled. Kind of weird.DrChinese said:Entangled systems cannot be described by a Product state.
DrChinese said:Since energy is conserved in entanglement generation (say of photon pairs), I would say there is entanglement on that basis.
hilbert2 said:Suppose we have two replicas of a two-state system with available states ##\left| 1 \right>## and ##\left| 2 \right>## corresponding to energies ##E_1## and ##E_2##. Now the state of the combined system is something like:
##\left| \psi \right> = a \left| 1 \right>\left| 1 \right> + b\left| 1 \right>\left| 2 \right>+c\left| 2 \right>\left| 1 \right>+d\left| 2 \right>\left| 2 \right>## .
An entangled state of this system could be something like ##\frac{1}{\sqrt{2}}\left(\left| 1 \right>\left| 1 \right>+\left| 2 \right>\left| 2 \right>\right)##, where you can be certain that the both subsystems have equal energies.
hilbert2 said:Suppose we have two replicas of a two-state system with available states ##\left| 1 \right>## and ##\left| 2 \right>## corresponding to energies ##E_1## and ##E_2##. Now the state of the combined system is something like:
##\left| \psi \right> = a \left| 1 \right>\left| 1 \right> + b\left| 1 \right>\left| 2 \right>+c\left| 2 \right>\left| 1 \right>+d\left| 2 \right>\left| 2 \right>## .
An entangled state of this system could be something like ##\frac{1}{\sqrt{2}}\left(\left| 1 \right>\left| 1 \right>+\left| 2 \right>\left| 2 \right>\right)##, where you can be certain that the both subsystems have equal energies.
referframe said:In your example, both subsystems would have equal probabilities, but the two energy eigenvalues need not be equal. Right?
That is correct. Even the equal probabilities are not fundamental to entanglement: ##\frac{1}{2}|1\rangle|1\rangle+\frac{\sqrt{3}}{2}|2 \rangle|2\rangle## is an entangled state with different probabilties of the two possible outcomes. The essential property if the entangled state is that it can be written as a superposition of two states such that collapsing the superposition determines the value of both observables. (This can be rephrased to conform to your favorite interpretation, and note that the two observables must have have common eigenfunctions to superimpose).referframe said:In your example, both subsystems would have equal probabilities, but the two energy eigenvalues need not be equal. Right?
|ψ⟩⊗|ψ⟩ is entangled. If we think of |ψ⟩ as a 2-particle state, then |ψ⟩⊗|ψ⟩ is a 4-particle state. It is entangled because it cannot be written as a product of four 1-particle states.Zafa Pi said:That's true. Thus if |ψ⟩ = √½(|00⟩ + |11⟩), which is an entangled state, then |ψ⟩⊗|ψ⟩ is not entangled. Kind of weird.
As far as the math is concerned, there aren't two particles. There is a single quantum system with a single wave function evolving according to Schrodinger's equations. There are various observables on this system, such "the result at instrument A" and "the result at instrument B"; but it's residual classical thinking that leads us to sort these observables into groups and call one of the groups "the properties of particle A" and another "the properties of particle B".referframe said:t's almost as if the central players in entanglement are not individual particles
This is great, some more conflict - a big part of what makes science fun, educational + prizes.Demystifier said:|ψ⟩⊗|ψ⟩ is entangled. If we think of |ψ⟩ as a 2-particle state, then |ψ⟩⊗|ψ⟩ is a 4-particle state. It is entangled because it cannot be written as a product of four 1-particle states.
Nugatory said:As far as the math is concerned, there aren't two particles. There is a single quantum system with a single wave function evolving according to Schrodinger's equations. There are various observables on this system, such "the result at instrument A" and "the result at instrument B"; but it's residual classical thinking that leads us to sort these observables into groups and call one of the groups "the properties of particle A" and another "the properties of particle B".
It doesn't. That equation relates the frequency of an infinite monochromatic plane wave to the energy of the photons associated with it (and be warned that the word "associated" must not be taken too literally - a more accurate but still very simplified picture of the relationship can be found here). You won't find such waves anywhere; we study them because any real waveform can be written and analyzed as a mathematical superposition of these waves.referframe said:How does the Planck energy equation, E=hf, fit into the above picture?
It depends on whether the system is in an energy eigenstate or a superposition of energy eigenstates.Does the "single quantum system with a single wave function" have a single frequency?
Either the sources are sloppy or you are a sloppy reader. Take for example wikipediaZafa Pi said:However, several sources say a state in a tensor product space is entangled if it is not a (tensor) product.
Rather than give definitions by others you might consider sloppy, I'll just admit I like the definition you provided from wikipedia.Demystifier said:Either the sources are sloppy or you are a sloppy reader. Take for example wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_entanglement#Meaning_of_entanglement
which says (my bold):
"An entangled system is defined to be one whose quantum state cannot be factored as a product of states of its local constituents; that is to say, they are not individual particles but are an inseparable whole."
This looks like a fine subtlety of english language. Consider the sentence "Each politician is not honest". Does it mean that all politicians are dishonest? Or does it mean that at least one politician is dishonest? The problem is actually what does the "not" refers to. Does it mean "For each politician it is true that he is not honest"? Or does it mean "It is not true that each politician is honest"?Zafa Pi said:So according to the definition |0⟩⊗|ψ⟩ (|ψ⟩ = √½(|00⟩ + |11⟩)) must be an entangled state.
However, the opening sentence of the very same reference says, "Quantum entanglement is a physical phenomenon that occurs when pairs or groups of particles are generated or interact in ways such that the quantum state of each particle cannot be described independently of the others,". (my underline).
Yet you will notice that the particle with state |0⟩ is described independently of the others.
A little sloppiness here?
Product of two entangled states is not "inseparable whole" either as it can be separated into two entangled states. "Inseparable whole" of 4-particle state would be GHZ state.Demystifier said:Either the sources are sloppy or you are a sloppy reader. Take for example wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_entanglement#Meaning_of_entanglement
which says (my bold):
"An entangled system is defined to be one whose quantum state cannot be factored as a product of states of its local constituents; that is to say, they are not individual particles but are an inseparable whole."
pranj5 said:Prof. Masahiro Hotta of Tohoku Univeristy of Japan has published a few papers on this matter.
Good observation. It is no surprise wikipedia is a bit sloppy in this very wordy article.zonde said:Product of two entangled states is not "inseparable whole" either as it can be separated into two entangled states. "Inseparable whole" of 4-particle state would be GHZ state.
I was disappointed at your response in post #23 in defending Wikipedia sloppiness, you know full well that "each member of an ensemble X has property P" is the same as "every member of X has property P" in math or science.Demystifier said:Perhaps wikipedia is not the most reliable source. So let me take a definition from Nielsen and Chuang "Quantum Computation and Quantum Information" which is a kind of Bible for that stuff. At the top of page 96 it says:
"We say that a state of a composite system having this property (that it can’t be written as a product of states of its component systems) is an entangled state."
At the bottom of page 93, composite system is defined as a "system made up of two (or more) distinct physical systems".
I think it is quite clear that |0⟩⊗|ψ⟩ (|ψ⟩ = √½(|00⟩ + |11⟩)) is entangled by that definition.
I am pretty sure that N&C would say that it consists of two disctinct physical systems.Zafa Pi said:Could |ψ⟩ = √½(|00⟩ + |11⟩) be a distinct physical system
Term "partial entanglement" is already taken. It refers to state vector ##|\psi\rangle=a|00\rangle+b|11\rangle## where |a| and |b| are different.Zafa Pi said:I would like to propose the following: If a state |ζ⟩ representing multiple particles can't be factored it is fully entangled. If |ζ⟩ can be factored (to lowest terms) but one of its factors also represents multiple particles but it can't be factored then we say |ζ⟩ is partially entangled. We say |ζ⟩ is entangled if it is either fully or partially entangled.
Too bad for me. But good looking out. How about sortta entangled?zonde said:Term "partial entanglement" is already taken. It refers to state vector ##|\psi\rangle=a|00\rangle+b|11\rangle## where |a| and |b| are different.
Given what we've been discussing I am pretty sure you're right. But at the time I read it, it wasn't clear to me at all.Demystifier said:I am pretty sure that N&C would say that it consists of two disctinct physical systems.
Energy entanglement is a phenomenon in quantum mechanics where two or more particles become connected in such a way that the state of one particle is dependent on the state of the other particle, regardless of the distance between them.
Energy entanglement is possible due to the principles of quantum mechanics, specifically the concept of superposition and the collapse of the wave function. When two particles interact, their states become entangled, meaning that the state of one particle cannot be described without considering the state of the other particle.
Energy entanglement has potential applications in quantum computing, quantum teleportation, and secure communication. It also has implications for understanding the fundamental nature of the universe and could potentially lead to new technologies in the future.
No, energy entanglement is a phenomenon that occurs at the microscopic level and is not observable in everyday life. It requires controlled experimental conditions and specialized equipment to observe and study.
Yes, energy entanglement has been observed over long distances, including between particles on opposite ends of the universe. This is possible due to the non-local nature of quantum entanglement, where the state of one particle can affect the state of another particle instantaneously, regardless of the distance between them.