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China launches man into space

  1. Oct 15, 2003 #1
    http://www.msnbc.com/news/976744.asp?0cv=CA00

     
  2. jcsd
  3. Oct 15, 2003 #2
    Go China!!!
     
  4. Oct 15, 2003 #3
    Yeah Zero, that's what we want, an evil communist dictatorship with access to outer space. And i don't want to hear that they're democratic. If I'm Hitler, but tell you all I'm jaques charaque (don't know how to spell french names, I'm refering to the pres of france), that don't make it true, I'd still be Hitler.
     
  5. Oct 15, 2003 #4
    Jonathan

    Care to explain this little chunk of pure ignorance?

    It's not communist.

    It's not a dictatorship.
     
  6. Oct 15, 2003 #5
    Who cares about the politics? Space travel is always cool, baby!
     
  7. Oct 15, 2003 #6

    Njorl

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    Adam,

    China is ruled by the Chinese communist party. It has outlawed all other political parties. Despite well publicised capitalist experiments, the vast majority of all industry is state owned and controlled. In what way, shape or form is China not communist?

    While China is not a traditional one-man dictatorship, it is certainly a dictatorship of the communist party elite.

    Njorl
     
  8. Oct 15, 2003 #7
    BTW, 'evil' is a term often used in place of rational thinking, and I dislike its use in most political situations...unless someone has voted for incestuous infant canibalism or something!
     
  9. Oct 15, 2003 #8
    Despite propaganda over the past few decades, it is not communism when the government owns and runs the state assets. The word "communism" comes from "communis". Communism is when the people own and control the state assets. When the government controls state assets, it is socialism. China is a socialist state.
     
  10. Oct 15, 2003 #9

    Njorl

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    ...and "gay" means light-hearted and happy!

    Sorry Adam, that definition of communism has not been current for about 150 years. What you describe is 'Utopian Socialism'. Interestingly, those known as utopian socialists in the 19th century did call it communism. In the middle of the 19th century, those known as communists were divided into those who believed in social determinism (utopian socialists) and economic determinism (Marxists). As the struggle between working class and ruling class became violent, the utopians, not wanting to be persecuted, stopped referring to themselves as communists. The successful revolution in Russia forced a further change in the meaning of communism. The Russian situation was inconsistant with Marx's predictions. Lenin's success gave him the authority to rewrite the communist philosophy as he saw fit.

    Maybe your use of 'communism' is more logical, and is the original meaning of the word, but the point of language is communication.

    Njorl
     
  11. Oct 15, 2003 #10
    Sure, language evolves. But "Gimme mo money ho" is not English. Sometimes words have meanings. Communism, commune, communal, community... See a common thread? I'll stick with the real meaning.
     
  12. Oct 15, 2003 #11
    I hope your Ivory Tower isn't in the United States. Because those with glass houses shouldn't throw stones.
     
  13. Oct 15, 2003 #12

    Nereid

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    If 'industry' is defined in the narrow sense of 'heavy industry and oil & gas', you may be right. However, from the economic (as in 'economics') perspective, state ownership in China is modest and declining, certainly well below 50% of all economic activity. 'Control' is a more slippery concept; with some notable exceptions, the state exercises no more control in China than it does in most developing economies.
     
  14. Oct 15, 2003 #13

    GENIERE

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    Well Zero you can certainly call China “Evil” as even today infant cannibalism is practiced. Do a Google for “China cannibalism” and find many entries, including some with price lists for body parts.
     
  15. Oct 15, 2003 #14

    Njorl

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    State owned and controlled production is 34%
    State owned collectively controlled production is 10%
    Local government controlled production is 30%
    Individually owned pruduction is 11%
    Publicly traded production 1s 14%

    Njorl
     
  16. Oct 15, 2003 #15

    Nereid

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    Source?
     
  17. Oct 15, 2003 #16

    Njorl

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    I'll see if I can find it online somewhere. I had read it a few days ago.

    Njorl

    Edited to add -> This site has info up to 1993 on table 5, but it looks like they lumped together state and local collectives.
    http://www.pitt.edu/~ibcmod/journal/articles/huang.html

    Edited again ->This site looks like it drew from the same source that I recall, the China statistical yearbook. It also has interesting points to make about the Chinese economy. While technically communist (or socialist if you insist) because much industry is state owned, they are letting market forces set prices.
    http://www.cipe.org/publications/fs/ert/e19/putter.htm
     
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2003
  18. Oct 15, 2003 #17
    Well that's absolutely horrible! And since I read it on the internet it must be true! Did you hear about the Guatemalans? They like to rape nuns and drink puppy blood.
     
  19. Oct 15, 2003 #18

    russ_watters

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    Hang on while I run a search for the words "bush" and "evil" appearing in the same post...
     
  20. Oct 15, 2003 #19
    China has a horrible civil rights record - I have no problem with hoping "democracy" replaces the current political system.
     
  21. Oct 15, 2003 #20

    Njorl

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    Calling nations evil is silly and pointless. Nations evolve according to geopolitical and cultural pressures. The Chinese government is ruthless, oppressive and fervently nationalistic. Have they ever had any contact with other nations that would have influenced them to be any other way? The treatment of Chinese people by the western powers, Japan and Russia is one of the most disgraceful episodes of human history. They will bear a grudge for a very long time. Yes, they are brutal, but can we lecture them about brutality after British opium wars, or the German ambassador decided to use Chinese peasants for target practice, or the Rape of Nanking.

    Njorl
     
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