News Cindy Sheehan arrested

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I've been to the white house there is plenty of room to step around people (there was a protest going on while i was there - and no I wasn't part of it, I don't even know what it was for).
 
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MaxS said:
Pengwuino, the first ammendment GUARANTEES ME FREEDOM OF SPEECH.

THE FACT THAT THERE IS EVEN A POSSIBILITY OF HAVING A REQUEST FOR A PERMIT DENIED IMPEDES THIS FREEDOM.

Comprende!?!?!!??!?!??!?!?
I don't disagree that at times demonstrations should be denied (otherwise people could just use it as an excuse to disturb the peace). What I dislike is that you have to take a couple hours out of your day to do it. You shouldn't need a permit, but cops should be able to (with a warrant) arrest you if they think the demonstration is just silly.
 
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MaxS said:
I've been to the white house there is plenty of room to step around people (there was a protest going on while i was there - and no I wasn't part of it, I don't even know what it was for).
Okay then, there we go then. It wasn't obstructing movement unless they were going out of their way to take up a lot of space. IN THAT CASE it would have been justified PROVIDED she was informed that she had to stop (not because she probably didn't know, but because it's her right).

Having said that, I think it's quite possible that it was a publicity stunt and she was justifiably arrested.
 

Pengwuino

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MaxS said:
Pengwuino, the first ammendment GUARANTEES ME FREEDOM OF SPEECH.

THE FACT THAT THERE IS EVEN A POSSIBILITY OF HAVING A REQUEST FOR A PERMIT DENIED IMPEDES THIS FREEDOM.

Comprende!?!?!!??!?!??!?!?
Incorrect. The courts have already decided that you are wrong.
 
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Pengwuino said:
Incorrect. The courts have already decided that you are wrong.
Ok genious the courts have NO right to take away my rights as defined in the bill of rights.

They, as part of the federal government, share a responsibility in DEFENDING those rights.
 

Pengwuino

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Smurf said:
You shouldn't need a permit, but cops should be able to (with a warrant) arrest you if they think the demonstration is just silly.
Sounds like a violation of freedom of speech. Don't you canadians have any rights? :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

And how in gods name would they need a warrent? Those need to be signed by judges. By the time you get one, the protest would probably be gone.

But at least we have firmly established here that she was breaking the law and that getting a permit does not infringe on your freedom of speech.

And what kinda sidewalk can handle 2 full grown people laying down????? Man the world must be supersized outside of my city.
 

Pengwuino

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MaxS said:
Ok genious the courts have NO right to take away my rights as defined in the bill of rights.
I think you need to take a few minutes to study up on american legal history.
 
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I am not talking about precedent. I am talking about having my civil liberties, as defined in the bill of rights, impeded upon.

By your reasoning the Patriot Act is perfectly justifiable in impeding on my civil liberties.

THAT reasoning by the way is treasonous.
 
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Pengwuino said:
Sounds like a violation of freedom of speech. Don't you canadians have any rights? :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

And how in gods name would they need a warrent? Those need to be signed by judges. By the time you get one, the protest would probably be gone.

But at least we have firmly established here that she was breaking the law and that getting a permit does not infringe on your freedom of speech.

And what kinda sidewalk can handle 2 full grown people laying down????? Man the world must be supersized outside of my city.

Two points:

1. We certainly have NOT established that it does not infringe on our freedom of speech.

2. In DC it is QUITE EASY TO WALK AROUND THE SIDEWALK BY USING THE GIGANTIC GRASS LAWN RIGHT NEXT TO IT!
 

Pengwuino

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4,854
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MaxS said:
I am not talking about precedent. I am talking about having my civil liberties, as defined in the bill of rights, impeded upon.

By your reasoning the Patriot Act is perfectly justifiable in impeding on my civil liberties.

THAT reasoning by the way is treasonous.
The Patriot Act was legislation. Courts rule upon legislation once a case is brought up. Jesus, did you ever take any high school government classes? Do you even realize the countless other things that, at face value, are infringements, but everyone has realized is ok since the governing of 300,000,000 people is not easy when you take everything at absolute face value?
 
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Pengwuino said:
Sounds like a violation of freedom of speech. Don't you canadians have any rights? :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Not to me.. why?

And how in gods name would they need a warrent? Those need to be signed by judges. By the time you get one, the protest would probably be gone.
In canada police can get warrants over the phone. They're called telewarrants. This would be a perfect example of when they could be used.

But at least we have firmly established here that she was breaking the law and that getting a permit does not infringe on your freedom of speech.
We havn't actually...

And what kinda sidewalk can handle 2 full grown people laying down????? Man the world must be supersized outside of my city.
It's only that big on one street... The others can be substantially smaller. Then again, I havn't seen the whole city yet, there might be bigger ones too.
 
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Pengwuino said:
The Patriot Act was legislation. Courts rule upon legislation once a case is brought up. Jesus, did you ever take any high school government classes? Do you even realize the countless other things that, at face value, are infringements, but everyone has realized is ok since the governing of 300,000,000 people is not easy when you take everything at absolute face value?
Yes I did take some high school government classes.

They taught me that the most important things that make america so special are the preamble to the declaration of independance, which guarantees me life, liberty, and happyness, and the bill of rights of the U.S. constitution, which protects my right to life, liberty, and happyness.

This means that any legislation, body, entity, or person that seeks to impede upon the bill of rights or the constitution is comitting treason and seeking to limit my ability to pursue those 3 key aspects mentioned in the preamble.

Perhaps you skipped class on that day, my feathered and ignorant amigo.
 

Pengwuino

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MaxS said:
Two points:

1. We certainly have NOT established that it does not infringe on our freedom of speech.

2. In DC it is QUITE EASY TO WALK AROUND THE SIDEWALK BY USING THE GIGANTIC GRASS LAWN RIGHT NEXT TO IT!
You have brought nothing but emotional rhetoric to this argument. Thus, we have established both of my points to be correct while you have simply yelled out your unfounded opinions

If anyoen wants to take a look via google's satellite program... you can see the fence (aka big grassy area, ha)
 

Pengwuino

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Smurf said:
In canada police can get warrants over the phone. They're called telewarrants. This would be a perfect example of when they could be used.
Holy crap are you serious? Man.. if they tried that in the US, people would be going nuts.

Smurf said:
We havn't actually...
Denial is a waste of time... you cannot deny it.... you are under my control.

Smurf said:
It's only that big on one street... The others can be substantially smaller. Then again, I havn't seen the whole city yet, there might be bigger ones too.
I have hte hugest street in my city. You can practically drive 100mph while drunk and not hit anything on the side of the road. Pretty awesome.
 
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!?!? We must be talking about two different parts of the white house because where I was, there was a big line to go take a closer look and tour of the white house (though not inside it), and this line was on the grass lawn, because on the sidewalk there was protest of some sort. It was very easy to walk around it however.
 

Pengwuino

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MaxS said:
Perhaps you skipped class on that day, my feathered and ignorant amigo.
Oh so you just took a single day of it? No wonder you don't understand. It's ok... many people out there haven't graduated high school so you're not alone.
 
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... so in other words you've completely retreated from your attack on my civil liberties and sunk to attacking my character?
 
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Pengwuino said:
If anyoen wants to take a look via google's satellite program... you can see the fence (aka big grassy area, ha)
http://cryptome.sabotage.org/whitehouse-0015.jpg [Broken]

Now, forgive me if I'm just an ignorant canadian and this is some other white house.... But those sidewalks look damn big. Bigger than here in nanaimo, easily two people - hands outstretched. maybe even 4.
 
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Pengwuino said:
The Patriot Act was legislation. Courts rule upon legislation once a case is brought up. Jesus, did you ever take any high school government classes? Do you even realize the countless other things that, at face value, are infringements, but everyone has realized is ok since the governing of 300,000,000 people is not easy when you take everything at absolute face value?
Sorry, I'm not willing to give up my rights to make governing this country any easier. They are my rights and I am going to keep them and excersice them whenever I please. It is the government's job to protect my rights and not infringe upon them for the sake of convenience. If the government can't do that then they are not serving the purpose they were created for and should be replaced.

This situation is very simple. Was she harrassing people or infringing on anyone elses rights? If not, then she shouldn't have been arrested. The charge that they have against her of protesting without a permit is unconstitutional because we are guaranteed the right to freedom of speech.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.
Requiring a permit violates this amendment because a permit is neither free nor unrestricting. A permit abridges our first amendment.
 
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Pengwuino

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Smurf said:
http://cryptome.sabotage.org/whitehouse-0015.jpg [Broken]

Now, forgive me if I'm just an ignorant canadian and this is some other white house.... But those sidewalks look damn big. More than enough for two full grown humans to lay down across... 3 even.
Yah... i measured it at 10yards... With a few dozen people... anyone have pictures of what this actually looked like? I Mean they could have all been sitting on the edge... or they coulda been jumbled up.

I just was thinken based off my own sidewalk which ... well it barely can handle 2 people standing up!
 
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Smurf said:
http://cryptome.sabotage.org/whitehouse-0015.jpg [Broken]

Now, forgive me if I'm just an ignorant canadian and this is some other white house.... But those sidewalks look damn big. Bigger than here in nanaimo, easily two people - hands outstretched. maybe even 4.
Ah, looking at that picture I have indeed surmised that I was on the complete opposite side of the white house LOL. (Or they opened up the fence so people could stand in line to take a tour.. this was well before 9/11. They don't even allow tours of the white house anymore).
 
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Pengwuino

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MaxS said:
... so in other words you've completely retreated from your attack on my civil liberties and sunk to attacking my character?
MaxS said:
Perhaps you skipped class on that day, my feathered and ignorant amigo.
Yes, I alone have sunk to personal attacks. I don't know what I was thinking.
 
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I addressed the issue and then insulted you, you just abandoned the issue and ran with the insult.

Besides, all I did was call you ignorant as to the purposes of the bill of rights (which you obviously are).

You made some idiotic statement about me not having a high school diploma...
 

Pengwuino

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MaxS said:
Ah, looking at that picture I have indeed surmised that I was on the complete opposite side of the white house LOL.
See thats what im talking about. Whenever it hink "protest infrotn of the white house".... in that exact spelling... I think of people posting lil flyers or banners on the gate at the north side. I think they do that because the oval office has a direct view of the gate on that side of the grounds.
 

Pengwuino

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MaxS said:
I addressed the issue and then insulted you, you just abandoned the issue and ran with the insult.
No, you ignored the issue and started attacking. Bad form.
 

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