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Cloning. Right or Wrong?

  1. Dec 5, 2004 #1
    To try to avoid a religious confrontation lets try posting 1) Yes or No (or undecided at the moment) and why we feel that way instead of reading what other people say and arguing with them over why they are wrong and you are right.

    I am undecided. I see some good and some bad that can come out of it. However at the moment I am leaning towards a "no" because I feel that the bad outways the good.
     
  2. jcsd
  3. Dec 5, 2004 #2
    By the way, I was not sure if this should go here or in the morality/values forum because I guess I am asking about what is morally right but since cloning is a science...I was not sure.
     
  4. Dec 5, 2004 #3

    loseyourname

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    It should go in the ethics section and you should have posted a poll.

    Personally, I don't see anything innately wrong with cloning, but there are a good deal of practical problems with it that need to be resolved before it should be attempted.
     
  5. Dec 5, 2004 #4
    Right.....
     
  6. Dec 6, 2004 #5

    russ_watters

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    This will certainly require the government legislate exactly what limits are to be set, regardless of what those limits are.

    Regarding the question, its far too broad for a short answer, and impossible for a 1-word answer unless its a religious-based "no," but IMO, cloning of anything except humans should be unrestricted. Human cloning should be limited to cells, organs, tissues, stem cells, and *maybe* week-old embryos.
     
  7. Dec 6, 2004 #6
    Wrong.

    If you are referring to human cloning: cloning sacrifices hundreds, if not thousands or millions, of human life to get the desired effect.

    However, As Russ stated:
    I would disagree with the week-old embryos, and stem cells (although you have to specifiy what kind of stem-cells, adult is ok, but not embryo stem cells). However, cells, organs, and tissues are acceptable, since they serve the same purpose as medicine.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 6, 2004
  8. Dec 7, 2004 #7

    honestrosewater

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    Why not clone people?
     
  9. Dec 7, 2004 #8
    Without referring to any religious beliefs, i can answer that with simple ethics:
     
  10. Dec 7, 2004 #9
    Because then you will have some extremist who will take over the world by mass-cloning himself and declaring widespread war :tongue2: , or at least that is what Hollywood wants us to believe.
     
  11. Dec 7, 2004 #10
    Why clone people, except for russ' comment on cells, etc? If that's it, then I say ok (not right/wrong). Just do it.
     
  12. Dec 7, 2004 #11

    honestrosewater

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    Says who?

    Oh, right, just like nuclear weapons. Silly me.

    Seriously, what is the argument against cloning humans? (Practical matters like how we would do it aside.)
     
  13. Dec 7, 2004 #12

    honestrosewater

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    Actually, motai's example raises a good question (by assuming an extremist's clone would also be an extremist). How would a clone be different from any other human?
     
  14. Dec 8, 2004 #13

    loseyourname

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    Extremists have already found methods far more effective than cloning to create other extremists.
     
  15. Dec 8, 2004 #14
    on:
    Says logic. It only makes common sense that to create such a complicated effect, we will have to take desperate measures to get there.
     
  16. Dec 8, 2004 #15

    AiA

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    The ethical wrong of cloning

    Dekoi makes a good point, but there are more reasons as to why cloning is wrong, one is that quite simply goes against human nature, goes against being human, (if you don't know why that is then you obviously don't know much). It is unnatural, humans are not ment to be grown out of a test tube, if we were then we would of been created that way, but we werent, and thats for a good reason.

    And besides all that, think about it, whats the point of cloning, its all for selfish reasons, one is for eugenits, and that is beyond morally wrong, that is just disturbing, the other reason might be to have an exact of yourself, hence the term cloning, but even that is for yourself, you want your child to be just like you, for you, don't you see the illogic in that, a human is much more than a toy to grow, or a weapon to make stronger, so using a human for any reason of the sort is degrating of the cloned one.
     
  17. Dec 8, 2004 #16

    honestrosewater

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    If you state something as a fact, I want facts. Those are not facts. The only reason I would believe those assertions is if you were an expert on cloning, I was also an expert on cloning, and I happen to already believe them.
    Where is the evidence? What research have you done on the matter? Can you lay out an argument? Do you know how cloning works? How did you arrive at the very wide range of figures, "hundreds, if not thousands or millions"?
     
  18. Dec 8, 2004 #17

    honestrosewater

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    AiA,
    Your whole argument is jello (and if you don't know why, a fly is eating your mother). Does that make sense? Can you give some reasons why cloning goes against human nature? I don't know what that means.

    You are just plain wrong. Does that satisfy you as an argument? Can you offer anything other than bare assertions? How do you know the motivations for people's actions? How does one thing you said follow from another thing you said?
    If you are getting tired of me asking you for these things, imagine how I feel.
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2004
  19. Dec 8, 2004 #18

    AiA

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    Alright honestrosewater, I'll attempt at educating an uneducated fool, first off, what Dekoi sais about the hundreds of embryo's dying on behalf of creating one desired clone IS true, so instead of question where he gets his info from, question your own.

    Secondly, how the hell doesn't it go against human nature, human nature, man meets girl, man likes girl, man loves girl, man marries girl, man procreates love with girl, man and girl have children, aw, natural. I hope that isn't to complicated for ya.

    unnatural, man gets cup of jaculates sperm, man mixes jaculates sperm with embryo (yes i'm not being scientific about it but you know what I mean) man tries hundreds of times to get desired fertilized egg, man IMPLANTS fertilized egg in womb, mother has UNNATURAL CHILD. Clear enough for ya, if you don't understand, I'll try to speak in a language suitable for your level of intelligence, ok.
     
  20. Dec 8, 2004 #19
    Sorry, but I'm still confused as to what's being claimed, but here is what you are referring to:

    So you're talking about cloning humans and raising them, taking organs? Just need a little clarity.

    So, are your sensibilites offended? Is this something you want to confuse with right/wrong? BTW, this wasn't the original intention of the thread. It would be acceptable to state your opinion and reasons, but it'd be best to not embarrass yourself with an emotional outburst.
     
  21. Dec 9, 2004 #20
    For means of clarity for 0TheSwerve0 and others.

    Reasons to Clone:

    Production of New Organs
    Totally fine, on the count that the old organs were somehow not functioning properly. On the same line as medicine.

    The chance to have children for infertile couples
    Should not be allowed. This will only bring upon genetic engineering to modify human qualities/attributes. Absolutely contrary to human law.

    The improvement of reconstructive and cosmetic surgery
    Fine, as long as the cosmetic surgery is meant for reconstructing the faces/bodies of seriously injured victims. Of course, this is the same as plastic surgery in the modern era.

    The curing of diseases that are still uncurable
    Of course! That is what evolution is for -- curing diseases and prolonging human life. Although some say that death is a "disease" which should be cured, one can object by saying that death is not a disease, but rather a part of human nature.

    The replacement of dead people
    On the same line as genetic modification of human embryos.

    The chance for lesbians to have children
    Absolutely stupidity; if homosexuality is unsound in the first place, what would make this right? Besides, the child won't even be theirs.

    A society that is broken into two classes
    Dystopia here we come.

    A note: In some of the disagreements later in this thread, we are referring to cloning of human beings. Not individual cells or organs, but whole human beings.


    As for Mr.honestrosewater,
    And that was a sheep....
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 9, 2004
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