Coup attempt in Turkey

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  • #2
Garlic
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Edit: Curfew has been declared officially.
National television channels are showing the coup declaration at the moment.
Military has taken over the country. (Or it seems so.)
People are panicking in my neighbourhood.
 
  • #3
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Well, I'm a big fan of Mustafa Kemal and with respect to him, it hasn't to be bad news.
 
  • #4
Garlic
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Well, I'm a big fan of Mustafa Kemal and with respect to him, it hasn't to be bad news.
It's not simple as that.
 
  • #5
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Turks aren't barbarians and Turkey isn't an african third world dictatorship. I'm confident. I even am with Erdogan hoping he won't ruin the entire system although he obviously tries to.
 
  • #6
nsaspook
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If and this is a big IF the coup results in a secular military government instead of the current Islamic Republic that traded with ISIS for oil, murdered innocent Kurdish people with air attacks on Kurdish separatists and created a government that couldn't be called corrupt because corruption assumes some honest officials existed in the current government it might be for the best instead of a civil war.
 
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  • #7
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What is the situation like now, where you are, Garlic?
 
  • #9
Garlic
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What is the situation like now, where you are, Garlic?
President Erdoğan asked everyone to gather outside, to oppose the coup.
In important Places (Like the Taksim square, in Airports, the Bosporus Bridges) people are gathering. (Not to fight someone, but to stand against the coup.)

This is no true coup. It looks like a setup-or something like that. If it had really been a true coup, there would be soldiers in every street, and a true martial law. I see some people on my street.

I don't think there is a coup danger anymore, but we are afraid if some civil war or some conflict could take place. However this is unlikely.

I'm at home.
I have heard gunshots. But I don't think this is something serious.
Once in a while I hear ambulance and helicopter sounds.

I live in the asian side in Istanbul, but most of the action took/takes place in the european side.
 
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  • #10
Garlic
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Uptade: Live news claim the National Assembly in Ankara (the capital city of Turkey) has been bombarded.

I just saw a live footage helicopter gunshots firing at civil people, injured people expected.

Just at the time we thought things were calming down..

Just heard a big explosion in a live broadcast.

Guess there is no sleep for me tonight.
 
  • #11
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If and this is a big IF the coup results in a secular military government instead of the current Islamic Republic that traded with ISIS for oil, murdered innocent Kurdish people with air attacks on Kurdish separatists and created a government that couldn't be called corrupt because corruption assumes some honest officials existed in the current government it might be for the best instead of a civil war.
Honestly, if there's one thing we should learn from the whole mess that's the middle east, it's that militaries undermining democracy/elections in the name of secularism just doesn't work. And that comes from someone who hates nothing more than political Islam.
 
  • #12
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Honestly, if there's one thing we should learn from the whole mess that's the middle east, it's that militaries undermining democracy/elections in the name of secularism just doesn't work. And that comes from someone who hates nothing more than political Islam.
Seems it worked in Egypt and in Turkey there is (according to CNN) even a constitutional obligation for the military to guaranty secularism!
However, these guys were apparently dabblers which makes the situation unpredictable. They surely face death penalty or a life sentence so they have nothing to lose. If Erdogan were a true statesman he would be graceful and correcting his islamic policy. But I bet he isn't and Turkey will drive even more into a russian kind of "democracy" with an insane religious touch.
 
  • #13
EnumaElish
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It better be an attempt by a very desperate and rather inept group of people. The alternative explanation is waayy scarier.
 
  • #14
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Seems it worked in Egypt
Not sure what's your definition of 'working'. If it includes one of the biggest civilian massacres in Egyptian modern history, more than 40,000 imprisoned, hundreds of forced disappearances, protests outlawed, and an entire youth generation that completely lost hope in their country and scared to object, then you're probably right.
 
  • #15
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Not sure what's your definition of 'working'. If it includes one of the biggest civilian massacres in Egyptian modern history, more than 40,000 imprisoned, hundreds of forced disappearances, protests outlawed, and an entire youth generation that completely lost hope in their country and scared to object, then you're probably right.
Sure it is so bad? I mean Nursi did some questionable imprisonments, too.
 
  • #16
Garlic
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A bunch of soldiers invaded the CNN Turkey news studio.

There are claims of explosions and such. Sonic booms from low attitute flying jets are powerful enough to break houses windows.

There are multiple claims of casualities. Just saw a video showing lots of corpses lying on the streets.
 
  • #17
EnumaElish
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Reuters Mon May 23 2016 said:
MASTER MANEUVERER

Erdogan has made clear he wants to seek legitimacy for the presidential system, which will require constitutional change, via a referendum. To do that, he will need the support of at least 330 members of the 550-strong parliament, and unwavering backing from the AKP grass roots on the campaign trail.

Outgoing Prime Minister Ahmet Davutoglu was seen as too lackluster a supporter of Erdogan's ambitions. By replacing him, Erdogan aims to unify the AKP just as the nationalist opposition is embroiled in a damaging leadership row and the pro-Kurdish opposition faces the risk of its members being prosecuted after their parliamentary immunity was removed last week.

"Now the road to changing the constitution to include a presidential system is completely open," a second senior AKP official told Reuters.

Popular support for such constitutional change is unclear, with a recent IPSOS poll putting it at just 36 percent. The ORC research firm was meanwhile cited in the pro-government Daily Sabah newspaper as putting it at 58 percent.
(emphasis mine)
http://mobile.reuters.com/article/idUSKCN0YE1M3
 
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  • #18
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Sure it is so bad?
Yes, I'm sure it is that bad.

I mean Nursi did some questionable imprisonments, too.
I lived under both Morsi and Sisi. Oppression in both cases isn't even comparable. We could and did protest every single thing that Morsi did. It was expected, almost mandatory for every channel and news outlets to criticise him. Heck, I sat through many hours of air time spent on making fun of his English accent and even physical appearance. This isn't because he was benevolent. He wasn't. But he was a joke of a ruler, and he didn't control anything. Had we had a second election it was very likely his party would have lost miserably, and it could've been the end of political Islam in the birthplace of the Muslim Brotherhood.

Under Sisi, on the other hand, no one is allowed to object to anything. All prominent political figures and activists, who were very active under Morsi such as Wael Ghoneim, Bassem Youssef, etc. , had to flee the country. I know teenagers in prison for holding a sign saying 'No to torture'. There have been people arrested for objecting to the government decision to secede two islands to Saudi Arabia.

So yes, I know it is that bad.

I apologise to everyone for derailing the topic. This is about Turkey. I will stop discussing Egypt from now on.
 
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  • #19
EnumaElish
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@agirecudi said:
Erdogan says this attempt is a gift from God... Because it gives him opportunity to cleanse the Army. He says that live.
 
  • #20
EnumaElish
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This feeble coup attempt will likely feed anti-western and anti-american paranoia in Turkey. Erdogan appears as a defender of democracy. Allegations that he does not have the credentials to qualify for presidency have already disappeared from the media, I am sure.
 
  • #21
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Erdogan appears as a defender of democracy.
Democracy is like a train. We shall get out when we arrive at the station we want.
His own words.

The fact is that he is one of the strongest forces for fundamentalist religious authoritarianism in the western world right now.
 
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  • #23
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http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/europe/82168804/turkish-military-in-attempted-coup-prime-minister-says

The attempted Turkish military coup appeared to crumble in the early hours of Saturday after crowds answered President Tayyip Erdogan's call to take to the streets to support him.

Erdogan, who had been holidaying on the coast when the coup was launched, flew into Istanbul before dawn on Saturday and was shown on TV appearing among a crowd of supporters outside the airport, which the coup plotters had failed to secure.

The uprising was an "act of treason", and those responsible would pay a heavy price, he later told reporters at a hastily arranged news conference. Arrests of officers were under way, and it would go higher up the ranks, culminating in the cleansing of the military.
So the coup is reported to have failed.
 
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  • #25
EnumaElish
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A great thing about conspiracy theories is that one can always go farther. In this case, I would not stop at Erdogan planting a coup against himself to boost his political standing. Parenthetically, he did not prove to be a Yeltsin. He was nowhere to be seen, least of all in front of a tank, blocking its advance. However he was no mouse on social media, he roared when he invited the public to take on the tanks and the occasional gunship. End parenthese. I would go as far as to theorize that as in any dirty war, many a war crimes may have been committed during Turkey's bloody fight against the Kurdish separatist PKK, waiting for their day in Lahey (The Hague). When the civilian government may have as much as breached the subject with the soldiers, implying that they may have to choose between indicting a few of their own or feeding them to the International War Tribunal when the day arrives, the soldiers might have "taken it the wrong way." Regardless of who its ultimate mastermind is, the failed coup attempt may have presented the civilian government a pretext to liquidate the potentially criminal liabilities in the army as coup traitors, without ever muttering the words war crimes.

Of course I could go even farther :)
 
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