Depleated Uranium problem?

  • News
  • Thread starter Arsonade
  • Start date
  • #26
691
1
Bob Nichols said:
http://www.xzone-radio.com/archives.htm
The world's experts on Uranium Weapons.

*So-called "Depleted uranium" results from a step in the process
of creating enriched uranium for nuclear power plant reactor cores
and thermonuclear bombs, commonly called Hydrogen Bombs and
Neutron Bombs.

The special killer uranium used in bombs and reactor cores at nuclear
power plants is about .711 of one percent of natural uranium, a tiny
amount. Like iodine in salt, except it kills everything.

Processing natural uranium removes about half of the bomb making
material. It is then called "depleted uranium" by the powers that be,
because it can no longer be used to make H-Bombs; but, it is used
to make uranium bullets, shells, and bombs instead.

The so-called "depleted uranium" is fully 88% as radioactive in total
radiation as the original uranium. There are an estimated 1.5 billion
pounds of "depleted uranium" at U.S. Nuclear Weapons Labs and
related facilities (H-bomb factories) in the US.

The word depleted does not mean the uranium is safe or OK to use,
it means it has been processed, that's all.

Perhaps a less deceptive name would be "12% depleted uranium;"
but, the term "Uranium Munitions" better describes what we are
currently using widely and continuously in Iraq, Afghanistan and
in other war zones and have been for about 15 years.
[End]
Bzzt!!! You are about 94.324% wrong my poor poor misguided friend.I would much rather hug DU than to stand within 3 feet of enriched U(greater than 90% is the mark BTW--military enrichment is much much greater).

DU means the useful part of the uranium has been extracted thus leaving a depleted mass of U-238. U-238 is not the devil. Now, 235 or some p-239 or even some Co-60(pretty mean stuff) now your talking. Oh, gosh darn it you know that blue coloring in plates and paintins. It's called cobolt blue. It's made with cobolt which as fate would have it also contains Co-60. A blue supper plate will set off a counter like nobodys business--why no comment on that?

Anyway, enjoy your evening. Good luck with your DU misadventures.
 
  • #27
Bob Nichols
Thank you for your comment, Faust9.

We can quibble over percentages. Actuall there are more than 200 different "mixtures" for nuker power plants; but, that is most certainly not the point.

Your discussion had nothing to do with ceramic uranium oxide gas and dust. So, let's focus for just a minute and talk about what is actually sickening and killing Troopers right now on the battlefields of Iraq.

No, it does not exist anywhere else except on a battlefield or a test range. Yes, it is respirable and very deadly.

BTW, the so-called "depleted" U is 75 to 88% as radioactive as the feedstock ore.

Try it again!
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #28
kyleb
faust9 said:
Bzzt!!! You are about 94.324% wrong my poor poor misguided friend.
Heh, he can't be wrong as he didn't make any claims in that post, but rather qouted someone else. ;)

faust9 said:
I would much rather hug DU than to stand within 3 feet of enriched U(greater than 90% is the mark BTW--military enrichment is much much greater).
I'd agree, and I imagine the person who Bob Nichols quoted would agree too, but it is hard to say as he never brought up enriched uranium.

Btw, about my previous comment that the Abrams only fires DU rounds, I managed to dig up my source:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/in_depth/2860759.stm

The information appears to be gained from a US defence department briefing, but I suppose the reporter may have missunderstood.
 
  • #29
Bob Nichols
Hug it - Try SNORTING uranium oxide gas & dust

Quote:
Originally Posted by faust9
I would much rather hug DU than to stand within 3 feet of enriched U(greater than 90% is the mark BTW--military enrichment is much much greater).

I'd agree, and I imagine the person who Bob Nichols quoted would agree too, but it is hard to say as he never brought up enriched uranium.
I think I see the observational difficulty you good folks are having. May I suggest the parallel to standing (and dying) next to a 16 foot long 3/4 inch wide fuel rod or a 7 Kilogram Enriched 235U (97%) Pit for a Thermonuclear weapon is snorting one gram of ceramic uranium oxide gas and dust.

Once inside your body, it cannot be removed, it cannot be treated, it cannot be cured.

You are now one of those American Troopers who went to Iraq and came back with your very own internal personal radiation source.

To the woman above who was concerned about a family member about to go. 518,000 of the Troopers who've served in Iraq are now on Medical Disability. That is a staggering 56%. Do everything you can to try to keep him or her out of Iraq or Afghanistan. Be creative! Don't be timid.

Here is a recent Archived World Wide InterNet Radio Program with myself and my colleagues talking about uranium oxide dust.

Major Doug Rokke USA, Ret., Ph.D. is first. He was the Pentagon's Director of the Depleted Uranium Project from 1992 to 1995. The US Military used 375 Tons of weaponized poisonous uranium oxide gas in the First Gulf War.

Here's the radio archive. Click on the "Play Now" on the right of the Uranium Weapons Show paragraph.
http://www.xzone-radio.com/archives.htm

Learn everything you can about this. I'll be here part of tomorrow to respond to comments and questions. Good Day.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #30
912
0
Pengwuino said:
"Mega billion" really turned me off. Unless of coures our war is in actuality costing us over 1,000,000,000,000,000 dollars
--
1 : HUGE : VAST <a mega electronics store>
--

(M-W Unabridged 3.0.)
 
  • #31
russ_watters
Mentor
20,162
6,686
Bob Nichols said:
To the woman above who was concerned about a family member about to go. 518,000 of the Troopers who've served in Iraq are now on Medical Disability. That is a staggering 56%. Do everything you can to try to keep him or her out of Iraq or Afghanistan. Be creative! Don't be timid.
Source? And are you claiming that all of them are sickened with radiation or heavy metal poisoning?
Major Doug Rokke USA, Ret., Ph.D. is first. He was the Pentagon's Director of the Depleted Uranium Project from 1992 to 1995. The US Military used 375 Tons of weaponized poisonous uranium oxide gas in the First Gulf War.
So you're saying all DU used is vaporized? And "Depleted Uranium Project"? Source?

Bob, a great deal of what you are saying sounds like nonsense - the rest sounds like emotional rhetoric.
 
  • #32
Bob Nichols
Russ Watters,

The numbers are sourced through the VA and include just Medically Disabled Vets rotated through Iraq and Afghanistan. Only 10% of Vets were Medically Disabled in Viet Nam and 5% in the other wars of the 20th Century.

The uranium in bombs is certainly vaporized and up to 80% of that in other ordnance. Maj Rokke worked for the Pentagon and Gen Schwarzkopf.

Again, what we are not coming to grips with here is now a common battlefield product. It is ceramic uranium oxide gas and dust. The US Military has successfully completed a long term project first started in 1943 at the Manhattan Project. That was to weaponize deadly uranium gas.

That is what we are using in Iraq. Here's the radio archive. Click on the "Play Now" on the right of the Uranium Weapons Show.
http://www.xzone-radio.com/archives.htm
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #33
russ_watters
Mentor
20,162
6,686
Bob Nichols said:
Russ Watters,

The numbers are sourced through the VA and include just Medically Disabled Vets rotated through Iraq and Afghanistan. Only 10% of Vets were Medically Disabled in Viet Nam and 5% in the other wars of the 20th Century.
Could I have the source itself, please. I want to read it myself.
The uranium in bombs is certainly vaporized and up to 80% of that in other ordnance.
Uranium in bombs? What bombs and how much uranium are we talking about? (answer: we're talking about a specific variant of a bomb used for penetration. it is not widely used).
Maj Rokke worked for the Pentagon and Gen Schwarzkopf.
So did everyone else in theater at the time. That alone is utterly meaningless.
Again, what we are not coming to grips with here is now a common battlefield product. It is ceramic uranium oxide gas and dust. The US Military has successfully completed a long term project first started in 1943 at the Manhattan Project. That was to weaponize deadly uranium gas.
You're saying that the use of DU to destroy tanks is actually a cover for a chemical weapons program designed to spread uranium oxide? Ok, I think I need to just back out of this one....
 
  • #34
912
0
russ_watters said:
Uranium in bombs? What bombs and how much uranium are we talking about? (answer: we're talking about a specific variant of a bomb used for penetration.
There is a conventional bomb with uranium in it? What bomb are you talking about, Russ?
 
  • #35
62
0
Wow Bob, that's interesting... but you know there's something even more pervasive that the military has been using even longer - dihydrogen monoxide.

I mean, this stuff is everywhere! The government has been giving this to our troops for a long time. This stuff is shown to cause frequent urination and in certain circumstances, an overdose can lead to death! This stuff is used in almost all nuclear reactors and variations are used in fusion bombs (the H-bomb!). This stuff is so abundant that it is even showing up in baby food and now makes up a measurable proportion of our atmosphere! We really need to get the word out and get the government to stop exposing out troops to this horrible stuff...
 
  • #36
kyleb
But while I'm sure you would feel perfectly safe chuging down a glass of dihydrogen monoxide, I doubt you be willing to suck down the gas created in the vaporization of a DU round. Eh, LunchBox?
 
  • #37
russ_watters
Mentor
20,162
6,686
hitssquad said:
There is a conventional bomb with uranium in it? What bomb are you talking about, Russ?
Ok, correction: at this point, it is just suspected, as it is classified (though I'm willing to concede it is probable that the GBU-28 does use it): http://www.eoslifework.co.uk/pdfs/DU2102A3b.pdf
 
  • #38
912
0
Interesting. Thanks for the info, Russ.
 
  • #39
FredGarvin
Science Advisor
5,066
9
Bob Nichols said:
To the woman above who was concerned about a family member about to go. 518,000 of the Troopers who've served in Iraq are now on Medical Disability. That is a staggering 56%. Do everything you can to try to keep him or her out of Iraq or Afghanistan. Be creative! Don't be timid.

The US Military used 375 Tons of weaponized poisonous uranium oxide gas in the First Gulf War.
GW1 (which I was part of) the US had a little over 500,000 TROOPS (please stop saying "troopers"). You're saying that between GW1 and 2 that the equivilent of the entire US contingent in GW1 is on disability. Until I see hard fact numbers, I call B.S.

Also...I found this little tid-bit:
The World Health Organization was nonetheless able to assess the health risks of Depleted Uranium in a post-combat environment thanks to a 2001 mission to Kosovo. A 2001 WHO fact sheet on depleted uranium concludes: "because DU is only weakly radioactive, very large amounts of dust (on the order of grams) would have to be inhaled for the additional risk of lung cancer to be detectable in an exposed group. Risks for other radiation-induced cancers, including leukaemia, are considered to be very much lower than for lung cancer." In addition, "no reproductive or developmental effects have been reported in humans" as a result of DU exposure.

source: http://www.who.int/ionizing_radiation/env/du/en/ [Broken]
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #40
62
0
But while I'm sure you would feel perfectly safe chuging down a glass of dihydrogen monoxide, I doubt you be willing to suck down the gas created in the vaporization of a DU round.
Thank you for picking up on the sarcasm... I was wondering if I laid it on thick enough. And thank you for helping to prove my point. The only time a DU round vaporizes is when it... you know... slams into something at high speed. Considering anyone in the vehicle when it is hit is going to die a pretty quick death, I doubt they have time to get cancer. The uranium in a DU round is completely encased in a sheath (sabot) that makes up the outside of the munition. Even if you abrade the outside of a DU round, you will not generate any uranium laced dust or gas.

Cheers...
 
  • #41
kyleb
I'm sorry, I didn't clarify my point; the stuff isn't water by any means. Obviously inhaling the gas directly off a vaporized DU round is a serious health risk; so when you vaporize enough of it into the air over the landscape and eventually an unhealthily dose of the stuff is bound to wind up inside peoples bodies. The dangers of water are far cry from those of radioactive heavy metals.
 
  • #42
912
0
kyleb said:
inhaling the gas directly off a vaporized DU round is a serious health risk; so when you vaporize enough of it into the air over the landscape [...] eventually an unhealthily dose of the stuff is bound to wind up inside peoples bodies.
The latter does not follow from the former.
 
  • #43
912
0
Alternate routes of DU aerosol exposure

LunchBox said:
The only time a DU round vaporizes is when it [...] slams into something at high speed.
Another route of aerosol exposure is the manual clearing of jams in automatic cannons that fire DU rounds.

And yet another route of exposure is the incidental burning of DU ordnance depots. There was such a fire during GW1 at a DU ammo depot in Doha.
http://www.google.com/search?q=DU+fire+doha

Here is a report of another DU fire, this time in 1999:
http://www.cadu.org.uk/info/nuclear/3_4.htm
 
Last edited:
  • #44
SK
14
0
hitssquad said:
Another route of aerosol exposure is the manual clearing of jams in automatic cannons that fire DU rounds.
Pretty much impossible, DU is used in penetrators who don´t come into contact with the barrel of guns but are saboted (M829 and M919) or contained in the bullet as a smaller diameter core (PGU-13).
The only way for aerosol exposure at the gun firing DU ammo would be a fatal barrel burst and the like, but that´s pretty rare and will have several more ill effects on the firing platform.

/edit: As for the "Journalist" Bob Nichols:
This story is about American weapons built with depleted uranium components for the business end of things. Just about all American bullets, tank shells, missiles, dumb bombs, smart bombs, 500 and 2,000-pound bombs, cruise missiles, and anything else engineered to help our side in the war of us against them has depleted uranium in it. Lots of depleted uranium.
http://www.onlinejournal.com/Special_Reports/071304Nichols/071304nichols.html [Broken]
It never ceases to amaze me how supposed "Journalists" can write down crap like this which is fundamentally wrong (as everyone googling for 3 mins can find out).
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #45
russ_watters
Mentor
20,162
6,686
SK said:
It never ceases to amaze me how supposed "Journalists" can write down crap like this which is fundamentally wrong (as everyone googling for 3 mins can find out).
Speaking of crap, did you read the BBC article posted on the last page? It contains The Most Ironic Thing Ever Written.
A 1995 report from the US Army Environmental Policy Institute, for example, said: "If DU enters the body, it has the potential to generate significant medical consequences."
You don't say?! :rolleyes:
 
  • #46
kyleb
I don't see the irony there Russ, could you elaborate?

hitssquad said:
The latter does not follow from the former.
I don't see how you can argue that. The logic holds true for fertilizers, herbicides, insecticides and the like; what makes DU exempt?
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #47
russ_watters
Mentor
20,162
6,686
kyleb said:
I don't see the irony there Russ, could you elaborate?
Its irony via unintentional, self-evident understatement: 'a bullet in the chest might be harmful - especially if it tears a big hole in your heart.'
 
  • #48
kyleb
That is more like irony via avioding the intent; the report was obviously referring to less forcefull ways in which the substance might enter the body, such as though inhalation or ingestion
 
  • #49
russ_watters
Mentor
20,162
6,686
kyleb said:
That is more like irony via avioding the intent; the report was obviously referring to less forcefull ways in which the substance might enter the body, such as though inhalation or ingestion
(well, the meaning isn't clear - there are a fair number of people with more or less permanent shrapnel wounds. But...) Yes, I know: that's why it was unintentional. That's what makes it so funny! You have heard of "irony", haven't you? Definition:
-The use of words to express something different from and often opposite to their literal meaning.
-An expression or utterance marked by a deliberate contrast between apparent and intended meaning.
 
Last edited:
  • #50
kyleb
Yeah, its like rain on your wedding day; right? :tongue2:

Seriously though, the apparent and intended meaning are the same unless in this situation unless one makes a contious effort to avoid that meaning.
 

Related Threads on Depleated Uranium problem?

  • Last Post
2
Replies
31
Views
4K
  • Last Post
2
Replies
29
Views
3K
  • Last Post
Replies
22
Views
5K
Replies
19
Views
5K
Replies
22
Views
3K
Replies
24
Views
4K
Top