How Is Acceleration Derived in a Frictional System with Two Boxes?

In summary: You identified the fundamental principles and understood how they built their formula. Great job!In summary, the conversation discusses the derivation of the acceleration for two boxes on a floor with friction, where a force is applied from the left. The speaker questions which vectors are weighed against each other and suggests a more intuitive formula for calculating the acceleration. The expert summarizes the conversation and confirms that the speaker's reverse engineering is correct.
  • #1
keltik
4
0
Two boxes are side by side on a floor with friction, from the left a Force acts on them. To be more concise about the picture it is this one on this website:

http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/f2m2.html#c1

I don't understand how the acceleration is derived. Especially i don't get which vectors are weighed out against each other. And also from their pictures it is not clear where

I have already tried to "reverse engineer" the given expression for a (on that website):

Step-1: [itex]a = \frac{F- \mu*(m_{1}+m_{2})*g}{(m_{1}+m_{2})}[/itex]

Step-2: [itex]a*(m_{1}+m_{2}) = F- \mu*(m_{1}+m_{2})*g[/itex]

My question here is wether the left side stands for "[itex]F_{net}[/itex]" (or "[itex]F_{result}[/itex]") ? That is could i write instead of Step-2, this one:

Step-3: [itex]F_{net} = F- \mu*(m_{1}+m_{2})*g[/itex]

And the next question is could i replace F with [itex]F_{push}[/itex]?

Step-4: [itex]F_{net} = F_{push}- \mu*(m_{1}+m_{2})*g[/itex]

and the mu-Stuff with

Step-5: [itex]F_{net} = F_{push}- f_{m1}-f_{m2}[/itex]

If so, why didnt they write it on their website, because i think that it is more intuitive than just spitting out the formula for a? Or is my derivation totally wrong?
 
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  • #2
keltik said:
I have already tried to "reverse engineer" the given expression for a (on that website):

Step-1: [itex]a = \frac{F- \mu*(m_{1}+m_{2})*g}{(m_{1}+m_{2})}[/itex]

Step-2: [itex]a*(m_{1}+m_{2}) = F- \mu*(m_{1}+m_{2})*g[/itex]

My question here is wether the left side stands for "[itex]F_{net}[/itex]" (or "[itex]F_{result}[/itex]") ? That is could i write instead of Step-2, this one:

Step-3: [itex]F_{net} = F- \mu*(m_{1}+m_{2})*g[/itex]
You absolutely can (and must) do that. Any acceleration on the system is going to be a result of the net force, not individual forces. The force is what causes the acceleration not the other way around. Besides you couldn't get multiple accelerations that sum up in a case like this since they're all accelerating at the same rate.

And the next question is could i replace F with [itex]F_{push}[/itex]?

Step-4: [itex]F_{net} = F_{push}- \mu*(m_{1}+m_{2})*g[/itex]
Looks good to me, the F here is implied as the Force that is being applied to the object. It really is the catalyst which makes everything else work. No initial force, then friction won't manifest.
and the mu-Stuff with

Step-5: [itex]F_{net} = F_{push}- f_{m1}-f_{m2}[/itex]

If so, why didnt they write it on their website, because i think that it is more intuitive than just spitting out the formula for a? Or is my derivation totally wrong?
Other than "they didn't want to derive it" I think the reason they went this way, might be simply because the "push" force is what makes everything work and it is the only force that is actively being applied to the system.

However your reverse engineering of what they did looks spot on.
 

What is acceleration?

Acceleration is the rate of change of an object's velocity over time. It is a vector quantity, meaning it has both magnitude and direction.

What is the formula for acceleration?

The formula for acceleration is a = (vf - vi) / t, where a is acceleration, vf is final velocity, vi is initial velocity, and t is time.

What is the unit of measurement for acceleration?

The unit of measurement for acceleration is meters per second squared (m/s^2).

How is acceleration related to force?

Acceleration is directly proportional to force, as described by Newton's second law of motion: F = ma, where F is force, m is mass, and a is acceleration.

What is the difference between average and instantaneous acceleration?

Average acceleration is the change in velocity over a given interval of time, while instantaneous acceleration is the acceleration at a specific moment in time. Instantaneous acceleration is calculated using derivatives, while average acceleration uses the basic formula a = (vf - vi) / t.

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