Solve Elliptical Motion Homework: Find r', r'', θ', θ

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In summary, the conversation discusses the application of isotropic, two-dimensional, harmonic central force on a particle of mass m. The equations of motion and particular solutions are found using initial conditions, leading to expressions for r' and r'' in 2D spherical polar coordinates. The conversation then focuses on finding an expression for theta and taking the appropriate derivative. The use of arctan is suggested, but the individual is unsure of how to simplify the expression and take the derivative. It is recommended to look up methods for finding the derivative of an arctan expression.
  • #1
camorin
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Homework Statement


A particle of mass m is subjected to an isotropic, two dimensional, harmonic central force, F=-kr.
(r=(x,y)). At t=0 the particle is at r=A
Inline5.gif
and has velocity V yhat.

Find r' r'' θ' θ'' in 2D spherical polar coordinates.

Homework Equations


Fx=-kx
Fy=-ky

The Attempt at a Solution


I have found the equations of motion, as well as the particular solutions using the initial conditions.
So far I have:
x(t)=-Acos(wt-π)
y(t)=V/wcos(wt-π/2)

From here I found r' to be Awsin(wt-π)-Vsin(wt-π/2)
and r'': Aw2cos(wt-π)-Vwcos(wt-π/2)
Im fairly certain everything up to this point is correct, but I have no idea what to do about theta.

I know in spherical polar coordinates θ=arctan(y/x) but I don't think I can just take the derivative in this form. I have tried setting x(t)=-Acos(wt) and y(t)=V/wsin(wt) by using the relation between sines and cosines offset by pi/2.This has brought me to
θ=arctan((V/wa)tan(wt)). Again, I hit a wall with finding the derivatives.
 
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  • #2
Is the primed notation a space or a time derivative?

I have no idea what to do about theta
Write down an expression for theta and take the appropriate derivative.
I know in spherical polar coordinates θ=arctan(y/x) but I don't think I can just take the derivative in this form.
Why not? Did you try?
I have tried setting x(t)=-Acos(wt) and y(t)=V/wsin(wt) by using the relation between sines and cosines offset by pi/2.This has brought me to
θ=arctan((V/wa)tan(wt)).
... what happens when you take the appropriate derivative of that then?
 
  • #3
Im not sure of how to take the derivative of that arctan expression. Is there a way to simplify it? I've tried finding methods but I'm having trouble.

The primed notation is a time derivative, sorry.
 
  • #4
Look it up.
... that's what everyone else does.
 
  • #5


To find θ' and θ'', you can use the chain rule for derivatives.
θ' = dθ/dt = dθ/dx * dx/dt + dθ/dy * dy/dt
= (1/(1+(y/x)^2)) * (-V/wsin(wt)) + (-x/y^2) * (V/wcos(wt))
= (-V/wsin(wt)) / (1+(y/x)^2) - (x/y^2) * (V/wcos(wt))
Similarly,
θ'' = d^2θ/dt^2 = d/dt (dθ/dt)
= d/dt ((-V/wsin(wt)) / (1+(y/x)^2) - (x/y^2) * (V/wcos(wt)))
= (V^2/w^2cos^2(wt)) / (1+(y/x)^2)^2 * (y/x) * (dy/dt) + (V/wsin(wt)) / (1+(y/x)^2) * (x/y^2) * (dy/dt)
+ (V/wsin(wt)) / (1+(y/x)^2) * (dx/dt) + (x/y^2) * (V/wcos(wt)) * (dx/dt)
= (V^2/w^2cos^2(wt)) / (1+(y/x)^2)^2 * (y/x) * (V/wcos(wt)) + (V/wsin(wt)) / (1+(y/x)^2) * (x/y^2) * (V/wcos(wt))
+ (V/wsin(wt)) / (1+(y/x)^2) * (-Awsin(wt)) + (x/y^2) * (V/wcos(wt)) * (Awsin(wt))
= (V^2/wcos^2(wt)) / (1+(y/x)^2)^3 * (y/x) * (V/w) + (V/wsin(wt)) / (1+(y/x)^2) * (-Awsin(wt)) + (x/y^2) * (V/wcos(wt)) * (Awsin(wt))
Now you can substitute the expressions for x(t) and y(t) to get a final answer for θ'' in terms of the
 

What is r' in elliptical motion?

r' is the first derivative of the distance (r) from the center of the ellipse to a given point. It represents the rate of change of r with respect to time and is used to calculate the speed of an object in elliptical motion.

What is r'' in elliptical motion?

r'' is the second derivative of r, which represents the acceleration of the object in elliptical motion. It takes into account both the change in speed and the change in direction of the object.

What is θ' in elliptical motion?

θ' is the first derivative of the angle (θ) between the line connecting the center of the ellipse to the object and the major axis of the ellipse. It represents the angular velocity of the object in elliptical motion.

What is θ'' in elliptical motion?

θ'' is the second derivative of θ, which represents the angular acceleration of the object in elliptical motion. It takes into account both the change in angular velocity and the change in direction of the object's motion.

How are r', r'', θ', and θ'' related in elliptical motion?

In elliptical motion, r' and θ' are related by the equation r' = θ' * r. Similarly, r'' and θ'' are related by the equation r'' = θ'' * r + θ'^2 * r. This shows that the changes in r and θ are dependent on each other and cannot be considered separately.

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