Flex is a sad boy

  • #26
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Ugh... this really hurts. I hate the idea of starting from scratch again. When does it get better? :(
This is just my opinion at this moment, but I think it slowly gets better as you come to terms with the idea that this state of relationship-less suffering is the default-setting for humans. When you're in a relationship, it feels like such a natural high that you begin to think of it as the way things are supposed to be. Maybe it is in some sense, but that seems to be what causes the loss to be painful. You will slowly get used to living alone, day by day (maybe hour by hour sometimes), and eventually you will feel like you are no longer vulnerable to things that hurt you, even though they are still there inside you. It is really no different than any other process of disciplining yourself through some form of suffering, except it especially sucks in this case because you didn't choose to have the suffering put on you.

I guess it's true; I don't like the term "chauvinist" though ("pig" is fine). Some women prefer traditional gender roles; I do too. Frankly, I think a lot of women are afraid to be open about that. Feminist propaganda is better at making those women feel bad about what they want more than actually empowering women. In my grief-stricken opinion.
What do you want feminism to do, then? Tell women that if they want to make their self-image dependent on what men think of them, go for it? Tell them that if a man treats you like crap when you aren't submissive, go ahead and be submissive because then he'll be nice to you? Then, of course, there are the gender traditions that feminism doesn't really mess with because it favors women, such as expecting men to take initiative so that women have the luxury of responding to someone else's lead instead of taking the lead themselves. Well, I shouldn't generalize because some feminism is pro-active about leadership attitudes and initiative-taking among women. If this makes women feel bad, it is because they are shy or otherwise scared to embrace their power because gender traditionalism has programmed them to feel powerless or bad about themselves for doing so, imo.
 
  • #27
radou
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Then, of course, there are the gender traditions that feminism doesn't really mess with because it favors women, such as expecting men to take initiative so that women have the luxury of responding to someone else's lead instead of taking the lead themselves.
Good point.
 
  • #28
BobG
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Then, of course, there are the gender traditions that feminism doesn't really mess with because it favors women, such as expecting men to take initiative so that women have the luxury of responding to someone else's lead instead of taking the lead themselves. Well, I shouldn't generalize because some feminism is pro-active about leadership attitudes and initiative-taking among women.
Or the other gender traditions feminism doesn't mess with, such as which parent gets custody of the kids after a divorce.

Of course, it should be obvious that that would be so. It is feminism, after all, not equalism. The goal of feminist groups is to promote womens' rights, not equal rights.

Not that some (many even?) of their points aren't valid, but there just shouldn't be confusion about what feminist groups are all about.
 
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  • #29
FlexGunship
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This is just my opinion at this moment, but I think it slowly gets better as you come to terms with the idea that this state of relationship-less suffering is the default-setting for humans. When you're in a relationship, it feels like such a natural high that you begin to think of it as the way things are supposed to be. Maybe it is in some sense, but that seems to be what causes the loss to be painful. You will slowly get used to living alone, day by day (maybe hour by hour sometimes), and eventually you will feel like you are no longer vulnerable to things that hurt you, even though they are still there inside you. It is really no different than any other process of disciplining yourself through some form of suffering, except it especially sucks in this case because you didn't choose to have the suffering put on you.
Meh, hard to argue. Still sucks. :(


What do you want feminism to do, then? Tell women that if they want to make their self-image dependent on what men think of them, go for it? Tell them that if a man treats you like crap when you aren't submissive, go ahead and be submissive because then he'll be nice to you?
Couldn't there be a gray area, where "housewives" and "homemakers" aren't looked down upon as the traditional "pre-feminism problem?" Maybe not. Ignoring the idea that some men are submissive and some women are submissive seems to only alienate them or make them feel "wrong" about their personality. Seems like that's been done to homosexuals for a while.
 
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  • #30
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What happened to el fumo?

It was only a few months back. Wasn't it?
 
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  • #31
FlexGunship
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It was only a few months back. Wasn't it?
I don't fall often, but I fall hard when I do. This situation is very different.
 
  • #32
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I don't fall often, but I fall hard when I do. This situation is very different.
It's only been 2 months though, as sad as the story is it hasn't really been that long to know someone to go from zero to moving in. Or have I completely missed something here?
 
  • #33
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Or the other gender traditions feminism doesn't mess with, such as which parent gets custody of the kids after a divorce.
Actually, it seems that the very notion of "custody" is being eliminated in favor of "joint parenting." Logically, both parents should have the child(ren)'s interest in mind regarding getting the most out of their relationship with both parents and "visitation" by one parent constitutes time for work or leisure for the other. So joint-parenting is a mutually beneficial arrangement.

Of course, it should be obvious that that would be so. It is feminism, after all, not equalism. The goal of feminist groups is to promote womens' rights, not equal rights.
I think this is debated among feminists but I have read feminist philosophy that equates masculinity with dominance and femininity with subjugation, so in this sense the issue is about generally disrupting "dialectics of domination" with special focus on gender (but also other identities such as race, class, sexuality) as identity-arenas in which the logics of domination/submission/subjugation are played out. So I don't think such feminists would promote female domination of men except maybe as a measure to raise consciousness and promote resistance to domination among men or other dominant identities that are traditionally accustomed to being fairly complacent with social-cultural domination since it usually benefits them more than they are bothered by it.

Not that some (many even?) of their points aren't valid, but there just shouldn't be confusion about what feminist groups are all about.
Well, I think confusion about what feminism is about is a central aspect of feminism and one that feminism has embraced as a strength. The more different feminisms there are in disagreement, the more likely it is for enlightening insights to emerge from the discourse, no?

Couldn't there be a gray area, where "housewives" and "homemakers" aren't looked down upon as the traditional "pre-feminism problem?" Maybe not.
Some feminism has struggled to increase recognition of the economic value of homemaker work, for example. Other feminism has argued that such work should not be relegated to women. Both approaches are reasonable and combinable, imo. The ideal would be to value housework AND share it between women and men, along with wage-labor. I think the economy has been struggling with this for a number of years in many different ways, though. One thing seems certain: men are not giving up the wage-labor economy to women in exchange for becoming homemakers and child-rearers. The few that are generally seem to be treated as exceptions to a rule that is not viewed as problematic in practice.

We should maybe start a new thread on feminism since this is a tangent to the OP - although, is that as much of a problem in the relationship section?
 
  • #34
FlexGunship
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Okay, this isn't really cathartic at all anymore. Maybe we could be done? Kind'a' wish I hadn't shared.
 
  • #35
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I hope you find a normal girl next time once you get over her. There is nothing good in being a savior or changing/protecting others in relationships.

Personally, I try to be unattached when I am in a protector/supporter role but I have never been in a case similar to your one.
 
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  • #36
Evo
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Flex, we told you to stay away from emotionally damaged women. There is a good chance that she will have problems going back to a sick, abusive environment and come back to you for a while to regroup, then leave you again.

DON'T DO IT!

Get away.

Start looking for NORMAL, MENTALLY STABLE, women that aren't victims of abuse.

But I think you can't do it, because you enjoy the sick way these women need you and want to provide for you because of their history of abuse and their need to please.
 
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  • #37
AlephZero
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Okay, this isn't really cathartic at all anymore. Maybe we could be done? Kind'a' wish I hadn't shared.
Jean-Paul Satre got it about right: "Hell is other people".

Still, very few people actually die from broken hearts. Twelve months from now you will probably feel rather different about it. And if it wasn't as "real" as you think it is, you will feel different a lot quicker than that.
 
  • #38
lisab
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Okay, this isn't really cathartic at all anymore. Maybe we could be done? Kind'a' wish I hadn't shared.
Sorry you're going through this :frown:. I hope things look better after a good night's sleep.
 
  • #39
378
2
Flex, we told you to stay away from emotionally damaged women. There is a good chance that she will have problems going back to a sick, abusive environment and come back to you for a while to regroup, then leave you again.

DON'T DO IT!

Get away.

Start looking for NORMAL, MENTALLY STABLE, women that aren't victims of abuse.

But I think you can't do it, because you enjoy the sick way these women need you and want to provide for you because of their history of abuse and their need to please.
+1.


I thought flex is fuming with immature girls and their friends :biggrin:
 
  • #40
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I thought flex is fuming with immature girls and their friends :biggrin:
Am I really the only one seeing this as a 2 month fling that got too serious too quick?

I'm sorry if it's harsh but I must ask, after such a short time are you sure it was really a good move to start considering moving in together? Were you really that emotionally involved? Did you really know each other that well? Or have I completely missed something and was this over a longer term?

Again, don't want to be so blunt, but I feel someone here has to ask these questions. As much as I want to give you a pat on the back and tell you not to worry, things will get better, I don't think it reflects my feelings towards this very well at all.

(I've decided I'm taking a 'straight up' approach to things from now on and just calling it like I see it.)
 
  • #41
Zryn
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There seems to be a lot of missing information that may skew perceptions.

Okay, this isn't really cathartic at all anymore. Maybe we could be done? Kind'a' wish I hadn't shared.
Does this equate to asking for a mod to lock the thread, or do you just need time out?

Am I really the only one seeing this as a 2 month fling that got too serious too quick?
Perhaps given the sensitive nature of the event you could temper 'straight up' and re-word aggressive comments like 'fling' (since there seems to be a strong emotional attachment, which is contrary to the premise of a fling) by replacing it with 'relationship', which seems more appropriate (to me anyway).
 
  • #42
Math Is Hard
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Okay, this isn't really cathartic at all anymore. Maybe we could be done? Kind'a' wish I hadn't shared.
OK, I will close this, but I will just add one comment:

Miss Right can't get to you if Miss Wrong is still in the way.

Think it over. :smile:
 

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