1. Limited time only! Sign up for a free 30min personal tutor trial with Chegg Tutors
    Dismiss Notice
Dismiss Notice
Join Physics Forums Today!
The friendliest, high quality science and math community on the planet! Everyone who loves science is here!

Group theory problem

  1. Jan 22, 2008 #1
    [SOLVED] group theory problem

    1. The problem statement, all variables and given/known data
    Classify the factor group (Z_4 cross Z_4 cross Z_8)/<(1,2,4)> according to the fundamental theorem of finitely generated abelian groups.

    2. Relevant equations

    3. The attempt at a solution
    <(1,2,4)> has order 4 so the factor group has order 32, so there are seven possibilities:

    (Z_2)^3 cross Z_4
    Z_16 cross Z_2
    Z_8 cross Z_2 cross Z_2
    Z_2 cross Z_4 cross Z_4
    Z_8 cross Z_4

    Anyone have any ideas about how to do this without doing a lot of tedious calculations?
  2. jcsd
  3. Jan 22, 2008 #2


    User Avatar
    Staff Emeritus
    Science Advisor
    Gold Member

    It seems evident to me: your relation says:

    (1, 0, 0) + (0, 2, 0) + (0, 0, 4) = (0, 0, 0)


    Maybe rewriting it as a quotient of Z³ would help?
  4. Jan 22, 2008 #3
    What is "it"?
  5. Jan 22, 2008 #4
    Let a,b,c be the generators of Z/4, Z/4, and Z/8, respectively. Then modding out by (1,2,4) is the same as saying that a=-2b-4c. So this means that a is completely determined by b and c, and hence doesn't matter anymore. Now the question is whether b and c can be whatever they want (between 0 and 3 and 0 and 7, respectively) and give different elements. I'll leave the rest to you.
  6. Jan 22, 2008 #5
    I am kind of confused about this. Does Z/4 mean the same thing as Z_4 i.e. the integers mod 4? If so, then a=b=c=1, and 1 is not equal to -6.
  7. Jan 22, 2008 #6
    Can someone please elaborate on what masnevets is saying?
  8. Jan 22, 2008 #7
    anyone? this problem is killing me!
  9. Jan 23, 2008 #8
  10. Jan 23, 2008 #9
    Yes, Z/4 is the integers modulo 4. Yes, 1 is not equal to -6, but you're confusing what I mean now. a, b, and c mean (1,0,0), (0,1,0), and (0,0,1), respectively.
  11. Feb 2, 2008 #10
    So, you're just saying that the class of (1,0,0) is in the same as the class of (0,-2,-4) ? I agree. Those two elements are clearly in the same coset. But how does that help you classify the quotient group according to the fundamental theorem of finitely generated abelian groups?!
  12. Feb 2, 2008 #11


    User Avatar
    Science Advisor
    Homework Helper

    The natural homomorphism from the group to the qotient is going to be onto, so the image of a set of generators is a set of generators.
  13. Feb 2, 2008 #12
    I am not sure I have seen that proof...

    But you're saying that the (1,0,0)+<(1,2,4)>,(0,1,0)+<(1,2,4)>,(0,0,1)+<(1,2,4)> will generate the quotient group?

    Can someone just give me a concrete instruction so that I can make some progress classifying this group!

    Maybe I need to use the Fundamental Homomorphism Theorem...to use this I need to find a group G' and a homomorphism phi such that ker(phi)=<(1,2,4)>. How would I figure out what G' is and what phi is though...
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2008
  14. Feb 3, 2008 #13
  15. Feb 3, 2008 #14
Know someone interested in this topic? Share this thread via Reddit, Google+, Twitter, or Facebook

Similar Threads - Group theory problem Date
P-group problem group theory Jan 31, 2015
Another group theory problem Jul 25, 2013
Simply group theory problem Nov 9, 2012
Group theory problem Apr 4, 2011
Short problem on group theory q.3 Oct 26, 2010