If gravity begets gravity, do gravitons emit gravitons?

1. Dec 6, 2003

wolram

if gravity begets gravity, do gravitons emit gravitons?

2. Dec 6, 2003

3. Dec 6, 2003

wolram

VAN FLANDERN ARGUES.

One can even argue that these c-gravitons/graviphotons may also be the equivalent of the long postulated aether that light and electromagnetic waves propagate through.

He further demonstrates that gravity acts essentially instantaneously at a speed orders of magnitude greater than light speed, because the measured motion of distant celestial bodies is not affected by delays in the transport of light between them. Hence, gravity acts by a different mechanism than electromagnetic attraction/repulsion, which both act at the speed of light. He then argues that wave/particle duality is a consequence of the interaction between light-speed entities and non-light-speed entities. An implied consequence is that a Grand Unification of all four forces, weak, strong, electromagnetic, and gravitational, is not possible.
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this seems a controversy of what is accepted, ie speed
of gravity and forces can not be unified.

4. Dec 6, 2003

MathematicalPhysicist

this is why the paragraph you quoted has the title: "New Concepts".

5. Dec 6, 2003

wolram

it seems VAN FLANDERN is not very respected, and very
much out of main stream science, so i have to disregard
his work for now.
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http://en2.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Speed_of_gravity [Broken]

it seems Sigh. Van Flandern has been refuted *many* times. Most notably by Steve Carlip (an expert in General Relativity, and one of the editors of Classical and Quantum Gravity, the leading journal in the field). His most recent rebuttal of van Flandern's nonsense is at
http://xxx.lanl.gov/abs/gr-qc/9909087.

Last edited by a moderator: May 1, 2017
6. Dec 7, 2003

MathematicalPhysicist

if you read everything including the paragraph with the title "Gravitons and Graviphotons?" you would know that graviphotons arent the creation of VAN FLANDERN but those of supergravity theory so i dont see how these two conflict.

7. Dec 7, 2003

wolram

if you read everything including the paragraph with the title "Gravitons and Graviphotons?" you would know that graviphotons arent the creation of VAN FLANDERN but those of supergravity theory so i dont see how these two conflict.
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very sorry sir.
if you would be so kind as to direct me to a reputed
author, i just wonder why you pointed me to a VAN FLANDERN
paper in the first place.

8. Dec 7, 2003

Staff Emeritus
Better, have him show you a Supergravity site, or even one paper, that describes anihilationg gravitons as emitting "graviphotons".

9. Dec 8, 2003

MathematicalPhysicist

btw, the paper isnt written by VAN FLANDERN but it is refernced to him.

10. Dec 9, 2003

wolram

LQG,
i think that "gavitphoton", is an outside bet in the
gravity theory, from what i have read it is to say
the least, speculative.

11. Dec 10, 2003

MathematicalPhysicist

you asked and i replied with an answer if someone else has something on this do reply.

btw, graviphoton is predicted by supergravity theory so if you find them speculative then also is supergravity theory speculative (and i agree with you on that s.g.t s.s.t and l.q.g are all speculative that's why there are called theories).

12. Dec 10, 2003