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If you back in time and shooting yourself, do you die?

  1. Jul 17, 2004 #1
    If you go back in time and shooting yourself, do you die?

    NO - I believe that you do not die.
    But to which YOU are we referring ?

    Let's say, that from the year 2012 you come back and shoot 'yourself' dead in 2004.
    We first need to understand that the 8 year older you is an 'external intruder' to the 2004 time line AND has LEFT the 2012 time line.
    So anything that happens to the 8 year older 'you' now in 2004 will not effect the future you (2004-2012) from the original time line, but of course, if the 8 year older you dies in 2004 or later while here, then this 'intruder you' to the 2004 time line is dead.
    On the original 2012 time line (from whence you came), you would have 'left the building' so to speak - you would not be there any more - because you are back in 2004.

    But back to the original 2004 'you'.
    If you (the one from 2012) shoots the 2004 'you', that 2004 'you' is dead - but the 2012 'you' is still there - but 8 years older.
    Now, if you do exactly the same things as the previous 2004 'you' did, then everything will be the same - except you are 8 years older.
    But if you change things (probably the reason for going back) then the future from that point in 2004 will be different. This would CHANGE history from 2004 onwards - but if you do that, this is when the general "paradox" kicks in.

    Now, if you go straight back to your point of origin (time and place) one second after originally leaving, then the original 8 year older 'you' is back - but now as an 'external intruder' to the 2012 time line, just as anyone else who would be 'brought forward' to a future time would be.
    YOU would still be alive - remembering all your life's history, including the back step event from the original time line 2004 to 2012 - but as the 2004 'you' died in 2004 there would not be any history of 'you' for that period. You would still exist (the 8 year older you), but no one would know who you are (except when your personal records up to 2004 when you were killed are viewed). In this case, you would only be able to return to the future if you had a time machine yourself, taken with you when you first back-stepped in 2012.
    If no personal time machine, then as you have changed history substantially, then there may not be anyone in the future that knows you are back in the past (or even time travel may not have been invented yet at that 'new' future 2012 time) - hence you would be stranded in the 'new' 2004 time line. But YOU would still be there (8 years older).

    So travelling in time is not the paradox - the older "time traveller" will still exist where ever he is - it is what you do when you are visiting past times that causes the problems.
    Changing the past is not the best thing to do, as it will change the future - but there is another option that will alter the future, but not change the past - and derives no paradox if done carefully.

    In the 2012 example, if 'you' came back to the 2004 'you' not to kill yourself, but to give a warning, assistance, or to add further 'warnings' to existing texts about past mistakes, then this would not change neither the past, present, or future, as the technology (and decoding key) available to read/view the 'encoded' texts will not be revealed or understood to scholars until they actually happen in the future (as the time traveller knew they would - as they are documented events of his history {from 2012}). In this case you would be able to return to your future start point with or without a personal time machine.

    What do you think ?
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2004
  2. jcsd
  3. Jul 17, 2004 #2

    selfAdjoint

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    Where did these codes come from? If you went back in time to give warnings to the people of that time why would you encode the message so it couldn't be read? In any case isn't this just voluntary? You could take actions that would completely change the history between 2008 and 2012 so that your former present, including the time machine itself, will no longer exist.
     
  4. Jul 17, 2004 #3
    Ronald Mallets experiment keeps coming back to me when I see these kind of questions.

    But more then this, if information can be sealled in time, in the form of a mandala or model built from any one of our past histories, how could we have moved it forward in any future lives.

    You notice the separation in 2012 from 2004. You recognize you have altered the timeline by killing the self then.

    Inherent models assimilated and born into the new you of 2005, and at 8 years of age, you would have found memories formulating in images deep from your subconsious.

    So the timeline is not the physical life and its possibilties in expression of each soul, but the ability of each soul to carry forward the model apprehensions from those past lives?

    So where and what is the gap responsible for in the neuron synapse? What is the probabilties of information movingthrough such a point.

     
  5. Jul 18, 2004 #4
    Reply to selfAdjoint

    selfAdjoint said "You could take actions that would completely change the history between 2008 and 2012 so that your former present, including the time machine itself, will no longer exist."

    Yes, but a responsible Time Travel Agency would NOT do this. They would find another way to correct past mistakes without ERASING the past, present, or future.
     
  6. Jul 18, 2004 #5

    selfAdjoint

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    Responsiible agents are not apt to dominate the scene. See History and current events. Imagine a time traveling Bush, or Pope, or Genghiz Khan.
     
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