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If you love Jesus, you'll fight global warming

  1. Feb 8, 2006 #1

    Ivan Seeking

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    "If you love Jesus, you'll fight global warming"

    Talk about a paradigm shift!

    http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory?id=1594855
     
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  3. Feb 8, 2006 #2

    selfAdjoint

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    It will take god's help.

    Yesterday I saw a movie on global warming, narrated by Alanis Morisette (sp?). There was a disconnect between the two themes of the movie, on the one hand you had scientists stating the dire effects that global warming is already having on everything from rice paddies to midwestern asthma. One scientist stated that it would take tenfold times the Kyoto restrictions to halt GW.

    The other thread was what we can do, and it was about turning out lights, and solar power ( which was going to bring in lots of "high paying technical jobs". Gee, I wonder who will end up paying all those high salaries?), and the rest of the you-can-do-it greenery from the 70's. None of this showed any feel at all for what "ten times Kyoto" means in economic, social, or personal terms.

    I don't think we're going to stop global warming; it's just too big a thing. Politicians can't get re-elected by cutting the economy down 10 or 20 percent. Not here and not in Europe either.
     
  4. Feb 8, 2006 #3
    If everybody in alternative energy field focused on this plan (power via buoys), I'm sure it will succeed:

    www.oceanpowertechnologies.com

    I saw these people on "Discoveries this Week" on the Science Channel.

    They have the best alternative energy program by far.
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2006
  5. Feb 8, 2006 #4

    Pengwuino

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    Want my advice? Nuclear war. Less pollution, possibly even a dip in temperatures, antarctica will foot the bill.

    That's actually the problem with politicians being... politicians. They really can't come out and give the perfect plan because there is no perfect plan. Someone is going to lose their job, someone is going to have to live a crappier life, blah blah blah... but no one wants to say it.

    I say nuclear power. Damn it, the hell with what people's ignorant fears may be, go nuclear. We know how to do it, it makes a lot of power, it has minimal relative impact on the environment. The more people bicker, the bigger the problem is. Build it and use it until something better is designed. I really don't think anyone actually gives a crap about global warming. If people did care, they would look at Kyoto and wonder exactly why some of it is as stupid as it seems. That's really the problem here. No one is going to agree to what we NEED to agree to. Everyone has to be touchy feelie, we can't use nuclear reactors because people will cry and greenpeace will come out and make fools of themselves, etc etc. Real solutions call for real action, john wayne style. Pow pow, cowboys and indians, everyone dies..... because if the indians dont die, you will!

    Ok im not sure what that last bit was about but nuclear power rules!
     
  6. Feb 8, 2006 #5

    Curious3141

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    :surprised :biggrin:
     
  7. Feb 9, 2006 #6

    Ivan Seeking

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    Well, there could be a ten times Kyoto solution.
    https://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=14470

    Scary stuff...

    And I would like to add that if you love Jesus, you will sacrifice your SUV; for demolition.
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2006
  8. Feb 9, 2006 #7

    Pengwuino

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    :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: I was minutes away coming in here and asking if any such inert gas coudl be made that reflected the infrared back out into space. Or maybe a huge mirror! We can make the sun into a huge archimedes lens thingy!
     
  9. Feb 9, 2006 #8

    Pengwuino

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    I say start building nukes. Everyone seems to be good at sitting on their butt and theorizing about the ultimate way of dealing with global warming or complaining about this and that but no one wants to go out and do something!

    If you love jesus, you love MOX.
     
  10. Feb 9, 2006 #9

    Ivan Seeking

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    So you are speaking here as a chemist? As an atmospheric scientist? Or out of ignorance? What can you tell me about it; speaking as a scientist.
     
  11. Feb 9, 2006 #10

    SOS2008

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    A chemist...maybe...one who needs to stop taking what he makes in the bathtub?
     
  12. Feb 9, 2006 #11

    Pengwuino

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    I was laughing at the fact that i was just about to come in here and ask about the feasability of just such a solution outlined in the link you put up.

    Turn off your auto-insult mechanisms
     
  13. Feb 9, 2006 #12

    Pengwuino

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    How rude, please refrain from such behavior.
     
  14. Feb 9, 2006 #13

    Art

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    What is the latest thinking on GW? A while back I saw some studies that concluded whilst greenhouse gasses do cause warming the effect is beneficial because it promotes plant growth and mitigates against a natural cyclic event which is leading us into the next ice-age.
     
  15. Feb 9, 2006 #14
    Really? I've read some studies too, seemed mostly like junk to me.

    Do you remember seeing statements of uncertainty with all these precise 'measurements' of global warming, cooling, whatever? Seldom, never.

    It's one thing to attempt to integrate out space born satellite measurements--available for the last few decades, not centuries or millenia, and even THAT requires a model and assumptions, and those things do not have zero uncertainty. Where is THAT data fro the 1800s? the 1700s?

    So, what means of measuring 'the' global temperature in centuries past exist, and, much more important, what is the uncertainty of those methods? Oh, we dig up sparsely sampled glacial ice, then look at trapped gasses, then take a WAG uncalibratable guess at how this local measurement relates to 'global' agregates, and then, here is the kicker, DO NOT publish our uncertainties--not even, estimates of same. Nope; "4.31 deg C change" in 'the' global temperature, or whatever. And, we compare that with modern space born data from radiometers, which, by the way, measure scene radiance, not even scene temperature, and certainly, not surface temperature. To try to convert to a surface temperature, a hand waving model of the atmosphere must be employed, give or take a Pinatubo eruption, and in the end, simply brute force correlated with surface bouy data. As imprecise as all of THAT is, we pretend to compare it with data extracted from ancient history? Or, my favorite--future history? Jesus H. Christ.

    If the change being claimed is substantially less than the uncertainty of the methods used, then what does that tell you?

    As well, the absolute biggest driver in all of this; solar 'constant,' poorly named.

    In all of this observational science, there is one thing that is the least uncertain; in the end, no matter how long we hold our breath, the entire Universe is going to be a dim 3 deg Kelvin cloud of nothingness. In a cosmic sense, it's totally OK if we leave some greasy naked ape fingerprints along the way; it's of no more cosmic significance --nor permanance--than the wake of surfboard left on the ocean.
     
  16. Feb 10, 2006 #15

    Ivan Seeking

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    Sorry about that. I don't know how that happens...sometimes I completely misread things. I guess I try to rush through too quickly and just don't read things.
     
  17. Feb 10, 2006 #16

    Pengwuino

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    Well most things i see funny aren't funny to other people :tongue2:
     
  18. Feb 10, 2006 #17

    Ivan Seeking

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    Well, it's like I always say, penguins have a unique sense of humor.
     
  19. Feb 10, 2006 #18
    "[God will] bring to ruin those ruining the earth."-- Revelation 16:14

    Just a thought for all the "Chirstians" out there working for oil companies and such.
     
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