Intelligent Light: Communicating with Far Objects in Universe

[Medd Newdanni]

I ask my question again because I'm new here and chose unrelated title.
I am wondering if there can be any intelligent light used as a means for communicating with objects existing too far away in the universe. Because of its speed, it can be used in the mentioned context and this way the slow race of human being in proportion to universal objects can be improved a lot. The definition of light is very important here. Many objects have been intelligent yet like various sensors now used in numerous devices. They are kind of intelligent. Can it happen to light and its constituting particles? It's clear that in addition to light physics, quantum physics and other branches may be involved too.

I'll be glad if any expert answer this question?

 

[berkeman]

I ask my question again because I'm new here and chose unrelated title.
I am wondering if there can be any intelligent light used as a means for communicating with objects existing too far away in the universe. Because of its speed, it can be used in the mentioned context and this way the slow race of human being in proportion to universal objects can be improved a lot. The definition of light is very important here. Many objects have been intelligent yet like various sensors now used in numerous devices. They are kind of intelligent. Can it happen to light and its constituting particles? It's clear that in addition to light physics, quantum physics and other branches may be involved too.

I'll be glad if any expert answer this question?

By "intelligent" I'm assuming that you mean the ability to adapt somehow to things that are sensed at the head of the light beam. I believe the short answer is no, since you would presumably need something physical to do the sensing, and nothing with mass can travel at the speed of light c. And any sensing you did back at the light source would not be able to propagate any change to the light at the front of the beam.

What sort of changing of the light do you have in mind? Changing direction, or color, or what?

 

[Medd Newdanni]

By "intelligent" I'm assuming that you mean the ability to adapt somehow to things that are sensed at the head of the light beam. I believe the short answer is no, since you would presumably need something physical to do the sensing, and nothing with mass can travel at the speed of light c. And any sensing you did back at the light source would not be able to propagate any change to the light at the front of the beam.

What sort of changing of the light do you have in mind? Changing direction, or color, or what?

I appreciate you a lot for your fast and thoughtful reply. You're right about the mass and travel at the speed of light. Maybe I should have not used the word sensing and sensors but pay attention that the sun's light plays an amazing role in such phenomenon as photosynthesis. So light can potentially be used in more complex applications.

 

[nasu]

What would "communicate with objects" mean in your conception?

 

[Medd Newdanni]

What would "communicate with objects" mean in your conception?

I mean to receive a reflection of the objects of any kind in order to be analyzed from aspects of physical world.

 

[Medd Newdanni]

Dear berkemean,

in fact, I haven't thought about the change of the light. I'm just assuming its probability. I just wonder to know my assumption is scientifically right or wrong.

 

[nasu]

I mean to receive a reflection of the objects of any kind in order to be analyzed from aspects of physical world.

You don't need intelligent light to have a reflection.

 

[Drakkith]

Dear berkemean,

in fact, I haven't thought about the change of the light. I'm just assuming its probability. I just wonder to know my assumption is scientifically right or wrong.

Your assumption is still unclear. Light behaves according to well known laws and is no more intelligent than a wave rolling up on the beach or a volley ball being hit back and forth.

 

[rootone]

There already are laser reflectors on the moon placed there by some of the Apollo missions.
We can use then to confirm that the Moon is very gradually getting more distant from Earth.
Is this something like what you mean?

 

[Medd Newdanni]

Your assumption is still unclear. Light behaves according to well known laws and is no more intelligent than a wave rolling up on the beach or a volley ball being hit back and forth.

You gave a very interesting example. If we add some ink on a volley ball and then hit it to a wall, we will see not only the ink sign on the wall but also the amount of ink which decreases after each touch. can we search for the same effect in relation to light?

 

[Medd Newdanni]

There already are laser reflectors on the moon placed there by some of the Apollo missions.
We can use then to confirm that the Moon is very gradually getting more distant from Earth.
Is this something like what you mean?

wow! I didn't know that. it's very amazing. it's very close to what I mean. If the reflector gathers its data by sending and receiving laser light, it's exactly what I mean, although I see the application of light reflection more broader than this. I guess light can be used for universal explorations more faster than this. upon that, we can overcome the indefinite expansion of the universe and get some useful info about other galaxies and planets. of course it's just one of my scientific dreams and I hope to make it more clear and logic with the help of respectful expert like you in this forum.

 

[Medd Newdanni]

You don't need intelligent light to have a reflection.

Dear nasu! I mean if we consider the light based on its constituting particles, we may be led to some unknown applications of it. consider quarks as an example. can we design a technology to enrich quarks of light and then try to evaluate the impression of a kind of light like laser on objects by analyzing the reflection of that enriched light?

 

[DocZaius]

You seem to have very ill-formed ideas about light and its possible uses. I suggest that you study a textbook on optics, do the exercises, and gain a more rigorous understanding. At that point it is likely that some or all of your current questions will have been dispelled. However, you will also likely have new questions that will be more well-formed and interesting to all.

 

[nasu]

Dear nasu! I mean if we consider the light based on its constituting particles, we may be led to some unknown applications of it. consider quarks as an example. can we design a technology to enrich quarks of light and then try to evaluate the impression of a kind of light like laser on objects by analyzing the reflection of that enriched light?

I am sorry but your "story" looks like you are mixing buzz-words just for the way they sound.
It may be ok for some SF story but it does not look like real physics. There is not much to discuss.

 

[Medd Newdanni]

I am sorry but your "story" looks like you are mixing buzz-words just for the way they sound.
It may be ok for some SF story but it does not look like real physics. There is not much to discuss.

I am afraid that you evade the discussion but do not underestimate imagination in science. it may be far from the reality at first but can lead to something if processed and expressed well. I thank you anyway.

 

[nasu]

Far from reality is different from using nonsense expressions.
Even in imaginative worlds a coffee that smells blue does not make sense. Even if the sentence is grammatically correct.

 

[rootone]

... quarks of light ...

No such thing, quarks are particles which exist within atomic nucleii.
Light is electromagnetism which can be considered as particles called photons, which are not bound within atoms.

 

[Medd Newdanni]

You seem to have very ill-formed ideas about light and its possible uses. I suggest that you study a textbook on optics, do the exercises, and gain a more rigorous understanding. At that point it is likely that some or all of your current questions will have been dispelled. However, you will also likely have new questions that will be more well-formed and interesting to all.

unfortunately I am not in a position to do what you suggested. I wish I could. but I accept to have well-formed question and I'll try to do. I hope to receive useful feedback here to do so.

 

[Medd Newdanni]

No such thing, quarks are particles which exist within atomic nucleii.
Light is electromagnetism which can be considered as particles called photons, which are not bound within atoms.

thanks for your explanation!

 

[Drakkith]

wow! I didn't know that. it's very amazing. it's very close to what I mean. If the reflector gathers its data by sending and receiving laser light

This is an odd statement. The reflector gathers no data. Gathering data implies that something is recording information for future retrieval. That is not happening here. If I reflect a laser off of a reflector I cannot then go to the reflector and gather any data about the reflected light. The light itself may contain information, but that is contained in the properties of the light, not in the mirror. In addition, the reflector does not send or receive light, it merely reflects it. Sending and receiving implies a different process where the light is actually generated or absorbed.

Really I think the problem here is you're using certain words, phrases, and concepts in a different manner than science does, which is causing confusion with your questions. It's like asking if my sandwich tastes blue. You could define blue to be a certain flavor, but that is not the standard usage of that word and using it in that manner will only cause confusion.

I guess light can be used for universal explorations more faster than this. upon that, we can overcome the indefinite expansion of the universe and get some useful info about other galaxies and planets. of course it's just one of my scientific dreams and I hope to make it more clear and logic with the help of respectful expert like you in this forum.

I'm not sure what you mean. We can already gather data using EM radiation (light, microwaves, etc). Can you be more specific about what you mean?

 

[mfb]

You can transmit information via light - if you have some receiver (made out of matter) at the end. Most data transmissions via the internet work that way, radio and satellite communication work in a similar way.

You always need an "intelligent" receiver, which has to be sent to the destination at a speed slower than light.

 

[jbriggs444]

You always need an "intelligent" receiver, which has to be sent to the destination at a speed slower than light.

In the absence of an intelligent receiver, some rather more extreme approaches could be used. For instance someone with a large ego and a larger wallet might consider inscribing his name on the moon by using an infeasibly powerful laser.

 

[mfb]

Well... yes. That doesn't create intelligence on the moon, however, unless you can control the laser good enough to produce some sort of giant machinery on the moon by burning away rocks in very special patterns. Something way beyond our intelligence level, but maybe not completely impossible.

 

[jbriggs444]

Well... yes. That doesn't create intelligence on the moon, however, unless you can control the laser good enough to produce some sort of giant machinery on the moon by burning away rocks in very special patterns. Something way beyond our intelligence level, but maybe not completely impossible.

The goal was not so much creating an intelligent receiver as demonstrating a successful transfer of information. I agree that burning an intelligent receiver into the rocks on the moon is seriously difficult.

 

[Medd Newdanni]

This is an odd statement. The reflector gathers no data. Gathering data implies that something is recording information for future retrieval. That is not happening here. If I reflect a laser off of a reflector I cannot then go to the reflector and gather any data about the reflected light. The light itself may contain information, but that is contained in the properties of the light, not in the mirror. In addition, the reflector does not send or receive light, it merely reflects it. Sending and receiving implies a different process where the light is actually generated or absorbed.

Really I think the problem here is you're using certain words, phrases, and concepts in a different manner than science does, which is causing confusion with your questions. It's like asking if my sandwich tastes blue. You could define blue to be a certain flavor, but that is not the standard usage of that word and using it in that manner will only cause confusion.
I'm not sure what you mean. We can already gather data using EM radiation (light, microwaves, etc). Can you be more specific about what you mean?

This is an odd statement. The reflector gathers no data. Gathering data implies that something is recording information for future retrieval. That is not happening here. If I reflect a laser off of a reflector I cannot then go to the reflector and gather any data about the reflected light. The light itself may contain information, but that is contained in the properties of the light, not in the mirror. In addition, the reflector does not send or receive light, it merely reflects it. Sending and receiving implies a different process where the light is actually generated or absorbed.

Really I think the problem here is you're using certain words, phrases, and concepts in a different manner than science does, which is causing confusion with your questions. It's like asking if my sandwich tastes blue. You could define blue to be a certain flavor, but that is not the standard usage of that word and using it in that manner will only cause confusion.
I'm not sure what you mean. We can already gather data using EM radiation (light, microwaves, etc). Can you be more specific about what you mean?

Thank you for your enlightening information, I am sorry for the terminology used in my post and the confusion it caused. You are somehow right because English is my second language and that's why the mentioned confusion happened. It proved me to try to use the words in a sense which a native speaker uses. I'll do my best in this regard.

 

[Medd Newdanni]

You can transmit information via light - if you have some receiver (made out of matter) at the end. Most data transmissions via the internet work that way, radio and satellite communication work in a similar way.

You always need an "intelligent" receiver, which has to be sent to the destination at a speed slower than light.

Finally I received a brave and bold feedback as I expected from the beginning. It sounds my perception of light in this discussion was not anti-scientific totally. your examples on communication open a new way but as you correctly said beyond our present intelligence. I'll think about that.

 

[Drakkith]

Medd, yours views appear to be very close to breaking PF rules regarding personal theories and speculation and as such I'm going to close this thread. If you think we've misunderstood you, please feel free to contact myself or another mentor.

Thread locked.