InterWeb Speed Woes: 2 Computers, Linksys, Sympatico High-Speed

[DaveC426913]

I've got two computers on my Linksys network, one wireless, one wired - with Sympatico High-Speed service.

I very frequently get download stoppages - where a page load will freeze for, like, 20-60 seconds. This happens several times an hour.

It is not:
- my wireless connection (which shows 11Mbps at all times, and has a decent signal strength)
- my DSL pipeline (I have had it checked - it's actually 3rd-party resell from Sympatico, so I'm in direct contact with them)
- LAN traffic (only one other computer, wireless network is WEP-enabled)
- happens on all sites (I might get the hang on site A, which I frequent, but going to Google doesn't fix the problem.)

I've been testing whether ftp and email gets tied up at the same time as my browser, but no conclusive results yet.

I've tried running a program called BitMeter, but I don't know what that's supposed to do for me - when these stoppages occur, bitmeter tells me there is no u/l or d/l occurring. Duh.



Any more ideas I can try?

 

[chroot]

Your bandwidth might be totally fine, but it sounds like you're suffering packet loss. If the handshaking packets that are used to open a connection get lost en route to the server, your browser will end up waiting quite a while before deciding the connection attempt failed. Since web pages are made of potentially hundreds of individual elements (images, etc.) a loading page can be hung at any point.

Run a traceroute and see if any of your upstream routers are experiencing packet loss. It's not likely a problem on your local area network; it's much more likely that some provider upstream has an overloaded or poorly configured router.

- Warren

 

[Anttech]

I've got two computers on my Linksys network, one wireless, one wired - with Sympatico High-Speed service.

I very frequently get download stoppages - where a page load will freeze for, like, 20-60 seconds. This happens several times an hour.

Does this happen on both computers? When you have this problem have verified that you still have communication with your router? ie have u tried pinging it? What type of router is it?

Chroot quite possible is on the money, but I always start as close to the PC as possible when troubleshooting these problems then work my way out..

I have been toubleshooting ISP problems all day as a matter of fact! an ISP we use at work is dropping large datagrams (MTU > 1500) which means that http requests of large tcp payloads get dropped and they have to be retransmitted.

I don't think you would see such a large lag time on an occational dropped packet it would have to be a total drop out for you to loose connection for 60 secs

 

[DaveC426913]

Your bandwidth might be totally fine, but it sounds like you're suffering packet loss. If the handshaking packets that are used to open a connection get lost en route to the server, your browser will end up waiting quite a while before deciding the connection attempt failed.
- Warren

But would this continue to happen if I
a] refreshed the browser (requesting the page again), or
b] tried a bunch of other website4s to see if it's just that one
?

After 20-60 seconds, it just starts working again.

 

[Anttech]

a) if you request the page again u may still have packet loss, depending on the amount of http gets are needed in seq to furfill the request

b) if the packet loss is at a common hop on both routes u would see the same problem..

It won't be an "internet" problem it will be a problem local to you..

Take some time and answer my questions and I'll be able to help u further

 

[DaveC426913]

Does this happen on both computers?

I have been trying to verify this. Every time I get hung up, I unplug my laptop power and race into the other room. But I always get my connection back before I can test it! Need more time.

When you have this problem have verified that you still have communication with your router? ie have u tried pinging it?

Is that the IP that I use via wired LAN to setup my access point/router? I'll try that.

What type of router is it?

Linksys 802.11B 2.4GHz wireless.

I don't think you would see such a large lag time on an occational dropped packet it would have to be a total drop out for you to loose connection for 60 secs

It always freezes with "Opening page http://...", and usually (though not always) freezes *before* the browser has even changed to the new page. Sometimes, it will get as far as colouring the background with the colour of the new page, but I never have a freeze in the *middle* of a page.

 

[Anttech]

I have been trying to verify this. Every time I get hung up, I unplug my laptop power and race into the other room. But I always get my connection back before I can test it! Need more time.

So which wired or wireless can u verify that the problem is happenin on?

 

[DaveC426913]

It is most definitely happening on my laptop (wireless). I have yet to determine if it is happening on the desktop.

 

[chroot]

If it only happens on the wireless machine, you might want to try changing the wireless channel; this can be done through the router's configuration "webpage." It's possible you just have some interference somewhere, and the 802.11 hardware is renegotiating from time to time.

You could also use a network traffic analyzer on the affected computer to see where the hangs happen: at the start of a connection or in the middle of an established one, for instance.

- Warren

 

[DaveC426913]

I can definitely and promptly ping my router/access point while this is happening.

 

[Anttech]

Do as Chroot says, it will be a wireless problem.. I have seen the same with numerous access points.. Especially cheaper models

 

[DaveC426913]

If it only happens on the wireless machine, you might want to try changing the wireless channel; this can be done through the router's configuration "webpage." It's possible you just have some interference somewhere, and the 802.11 hardware is renegotiating from time to time.

I used to get this problem when I had a 2.4GHz wireless phone. It was a hair-pulling experience. But I could always tell because my system would tell me everytime it lost connection. That is definitely not what's happening here. My wireless connection is having no trouble at all. In fact, aping to the access point itself comes back instantly.

You could also use a network traffic analyzer on the affected computer to see where the hangs happen: at the start of a connection or in the middle of an established one, for instance.

Can you recommend any piece of (XP) s/w in particular?

 

[Anttech]

Look, just because the "icon" in XP isn't showing that the wireless is disconnected mean nada!

A possible scenario is that u are using the same channel as another access point near you. the two conflict and as chroot said u get interference and u loss your "connection" with the access point. The technology especially in a <$50 linksys is NOT 100%...

Use ethereal if u want to analyse traffic, you will also need to install wincap, but I don't think it will work correctly on your wifi link... from my experience anyway.

 

[DaveC426913]

Look, just because the "icon" in XP isn't showing that the wireless is disconnected mean nada!.

It says 'no connection!' then 'connection good'. It is not doing that. I can ping the access point with no trouble.

A possible scenario is that u are using the same channel as another access point near you.

Possible. Though when I scan for networks, mine is the only one that is in range.

Use ethereal if u want to analyse traffic, you will also need to install wincap, but I don't think it will work correctly on your wifi link... from my experience anyway.

Well, then I won't waste my time with that one.

 

[Anttech]

It says 'no connection!' then 'connection good'. It is not doing that. I can ping the access point with no trouble.

hmmm.. can u access it via http while u have the problem?

Possible. Though when I scan for networks, mine is the only one that is in range.

The only one that is broadcasting its ssid, others maybe there but hidden from you

 

[DaveC426913]

hmmm.. can u access it via http while u have the problem?

That is http. It's just http://x.x.1.1

The only one that is broadcasting its ssid, others maybe there but hidden from you

Not likely in this neighbourhood.

 

[Anttech]

That is http. It's just http://x.x.1.1

ehh?? That didnt make any sence.

The reason I asked you if you can access [your router] via http, because it tests different layers of IP.. An ICMP packet works at the Network layer HTTP works at the application layer..

Just because u can Ping the device doesn't mean you can establish a session with it..

Ohh and if you are using NAT which I suspect you are due to the "wireless" and LAN, then you will be using a Non-routable Private IP address (RFC 1918) which I can't get to anyway, due to its non-routabilty so there is no need to mask it.

Not likely in this neighbourhood.

ok then..

 

[DaveC426913]

ehh?? That didnt make any sence...

You asked me if I can access it via http. I showed you the URL I'm using to access it, which is http. I get the configuration admin screen for my access point.

Was there some subtlety to your question that escaped me?

Ohh and if you are using NAT which I suspect you are due to the "wireless" and LAN, then you will be using a Non-routable Private IP address (RFC 1918) which I can't get to anyway, due to its non-routabilty so there is no need to mask it.

Yes. I was just being over-cautious (not about you, just in general).

 

[Anttech]

Nope.. I was confussed at your post..

Looks like your access point is ok.. on the wireless side anyway..

 

[DaveC426913]

You know, much of the delay I'm getting happens while on this board. It's possible that the board responses are slow getting to me.

But I've been checking that. Everytime I get a delay, I immediately go to Google to see if it's just this website. But no, Google still takes forever to open, as do other sites.

 

[Anttech]

do this at cmd

ping google.com -t

and then watch it when u next experince the problem to see if u have packet loss

 

[DaveC426913]

Wow. I just tried that when I *wasn't* experiencing any problem, and it's timing out maybe one time in a dozen (though quite unpredictably - sometimes it'll timout several times in a row, then won't timeout 25 times in a row).

 

[Anttech]

you have a packet loss problem... :-)

do a tracert to google

@ cmd

tracert google.com

see if u can see any "*" anywhere, if you cant. then ping every node up till google till see which router is causing you pain.

If it is outwith your control, note the IP address and call your ISP

 

[DaveC426913]

see if u can see any "*" anywhere, if you cant. then ping every node up till google till see which router is causing you pain.

If it is outwith your control, note the IP address and call your ISP

Yep. Tried it 3X. Got a * * * timeout on first hop all 3 times. Otherwise, remaining 14-16 hops were fine.

 

[Anttech]

try pinging that node like before.. Is that your router?

 

[DaveC426913]

I did some traces while getting a delay. This is what I got:
Trying to access my own homepage:
Tracing route to google.com [72.14.207.99]over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 * * * Request timed out.
2 * * * Request timed out.
3 47 ms 46 ms 46 ms frn1-r1-vlan401...
4 45 ms 50 ms 49 ms frn1-r2-vlan401...
5 59 ms 46 ms 55 ms fastvibe-tor...
6 49 ms * 62 ms OC48POS1-0.tor-1...
7 55 ms 46 ms 52 ms OC48POS1-0.tor-...
8 56 ms 58 ms 61 ms OC48POS0-0.chi-...
9 * 60 ms 57 ms 216.187.68.178
10 61 ms 58 ms 65 ms 66.249.95.253
11 58 ms 56 ms * 66.249.95.120
12 82 ms * 71 ms 72.14.236.20
13 71 ms 73 ms 72 ms 72.14.236.183
14 72 ms 75 ms 72 ms 72.14.236.181
15 84 ms 72 ms 72 ms 66.249.94.96
16 87 ms 73 ms 71 ms 72.14.207.99
Trace complete.

Then, once my hoepage came up, I tried to link to physicsforum.com.
(the following is all during one delay, and includes several refreshes and even a couple of close/re-opens of IE)



Tracing route to google.com [72.14.207.99]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 * * * Request timed out.
2 51 ms 51 ms 47 ms frn1-r3.tor...
3 49 ms 50 ms 56 ms frn1-r1-vlan401...
4 45 ms 45 ms 47 ms frn1-r2-vlan401…
5 * 46 ms 55 ms fastvibe-tor…
6 47 ms 46 ms 51 ms OC48POS1-0.…
7 46 ms 45 ms * OC48POS1-0.…
8 57 ms 57 ms 58 ms OC48POS0-0.…
9 63 ms 71 ms 58 ms 216.187.68.178
10 60 ms 57 ms * 66.249.95.253
11 57 ms 65 ms 59 ms 66.249.95.120
12 79 ms 76 ms 71 ms 72.14.236.20
13 * 72 ms 74 ms 66.249.94.68
14 72 ms 72 ms 75 ms 72.14.236.134
15 71 ms 82 ms 83 ms 72.14.236.130
16 72 ms 85 ms 72 ms 72.14.207.99
Trace complete.

Tracing route to google.com [64.233.187.99]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 * * 15 ms 192.168.1.1
2 46 ms 46 ms 45 ms frn1-r3.tor...
3 45 ms 45 ms 46 ms frn1-r2-vlan400.
4 46 ms 46 ms 46 ms fastvibe-tor-g….
5 46 ms 45 ms 46 ms OC48POS1-0.….
6 46 ms 45 ms 46 ms OC48POS1-0.. ….
7 56 ms 57 ms 57 ms OC48POS0-0.….
8 57 ms 57 ms 57 ms 216.187.68.178
9 57 ms 57 ms 57 ms 216.239.46.5
10 57 ms 66 ms 58 ms 66.249.95.245
11 83 ms 75 ms 75 ms 64.233.175.99
12 81 ms 82 ms 85 ms 66.249.95.124
13 78 ms 76 ms 79 ms 66.249.95.125
14 76 ms 79 ms 79 ms 216.239.49.226
15 76 ms 76 ms 80 ms 216.239.49.222
16 76 ms 75 ms 76 ms 64.233.187.99
Trace complete.

Tracing route to google.com [64.233.187.99]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 * * * Request timed out.
2 * * 48 ms frn1-r3.tor...
3 45 ms * 49 ms frn1-r2-vlan400. ….
4 47 ms 48 ms 45 ms fastvibe-tor. ….
5 51 ms 46 ms 47 ms OC48POS1-0.….
6 47 ms * 48 ms OC48POS1-0.….
7 * 65 ms 57 ms OC48POS0-0.. ….
8 57 ms 59 ms 65 ms 216.187.68.178
9 * 57 ms 57 ms 66.249.95.253
10 59 ms 60 ms 60 ms 66.249.95.120
11 82 ms 75 ms 76 ms 64.233.175.99
12 85 ms 75 ms 78 ms 66.249.95.124
13 76 ms * 76 ms 72.14.236.19
14 * 77 ms 77 ms 72.14.236.15
15 79 ms 76 ms 76 ms 64.233.187.99
Trace complete.

Tracing route to google.com [64.233.187.99]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 * * * Request timed out.
2 48 ms 48 ms 49 ms frn1-r3.tor...
3 46 ms 44 ms 46 ms frn1-r2-vlan400.tor. ….
4 45 ms 45 ms 46 ms fastvibe-tor-g. ….
5 45 ms 46 ms 45 ms OC48POS1-0.…
6 49 ms 46 ms 45 ms OC48POS1-0.…
7 58 ms 56 ms 56 ms OC48POS0-0.chi….
8 57 ms 57 ms 57 ms 216.187.68.178
9 57 ms 58 ms 59 ms 66.249.95.253
10 58 ms 58 ms 63 ms 66.249.95.120
11 75 ms 76 ms 75 ms 64.233.175.99
12 75 ms 74 ms 75 ms 66.249.95.124
13 76 ms 217 ms 76 ms 66.249.95.125
14 78 ms 77 ms 77 ms 72.14.236.15
15 79 ms 78 ms * 64.233.187.99
16 82 ms * 81 ms 64.233.187.99
Trace complete.

Tracing route to google.com [64.233.187.99]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 * * * Request timed out.
2 45 ms 47 ms 46 ms frn1-r3.tor...
3 46 ms 46 ms 48 ms frn1-r2-vlan400.tor…
4 46 ms 57 ms 47 ms fastvibe-tor-gw.peer1…
5 46 ms 46 ms 45 ms OC48POS1-0.tor-151f-cor-1….
6 51 ms 45 ms 46 ms OC48POS1-0.tor-core-1….
7 56 ms 58 ms 65 ms OC48POS0-0.chi-dis-1….
8 58 ms 56 ms 58 ms 216.187.68.178
9 58 ms 70 ms 57 ms 66.249.95.253
10 58 ms 57 ms 70 ms 66.249.95.245
11 74 ms 77 ms 76 ms 64.233.175.99
12 76 ms 76 ms 75 ms 66.249.95.124
13 78 ms 76 ms 78 ms 72.14.236.19
14 79 ms 79 ms 80 ms 216.239.49.226
15 81 ms 78 ms 79 ms 216.239.49.222
16 77 ms 80 ms 76 ms 64.233.187.99
Trace complete.



Tracing route to google.com [64.233.187.99]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 * * * Request timed out.
2 47 ms * 46 ms frn1-r3.tor...
3 46 ms 50 ms 54 ms frn1-r2-vlan400.tor….]
4 51 ms 49 ms 46 ms fastvibe-tor-gw….
5 45 ms 47 ms 45 ms OC48POS1-0.-…
6 49 ms 45 ms 50 ms OC48POS1-0.-…
7 58 ms 58 ms 65 ms OC48POS0-0…]
8 67 ms * 60 ms 216.187.68.178
9 59 ms 58 ms 57 ms 216.239.46.5
10 70 ms 68 ms 57 ms 66.249.95.120
11 * * 76 ms 64.233.175.99
12 77 ms 75 ms 76 ms 66.249.95.124
13 76 ms 87 ms 86 ms 72.14.236.19
14 78 ms 88 ms 76 ms 72.14.236.15
15 83 ms 78 ms * 64.233.187.99
16 77 ms 79 ms 77 ms 64.233.187.99
Trace complete.

Tracing route to google.com [64.233.187.99]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 * * * Request timed out.
2 49 ms 46 ms 47 ms frn1-r3.tor...
3 * 61 ms 45 ms frn1-r2-vlan400.
4 48 ms 49 ms * fastvibe-tor-gw….
5 46 ms 47 ms 46 ms OC48POS1-0.…
6 47 ms 46 ms 56 ms OC48POS1-0.
7 57 ms 65 ms 59 ms OC48POS0-0.chi…
8 64 ms 58 ms 61 ms 216.187.68.178
9 57 ms 57 ms 58 ms 66.249.95.253
10 57 ms 59 ms 60 ms 66.249.95.245
11 79 ms 77 ms * 64.233.175.99
12 75 ms 75 ms 79 ms 66.249.95.124
13 78 ms 107 ms 77 ms 72.14.236.19
14 79 ms 89 ms 88 ms 216.239.49.226
15 79 ms 83 ms * 216.239.49.222
16 78 ms 77 ms 77 ms 64.233.187.99
Trace complete.

Tracing route to google.com [64.233.187.99]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 * * * Request timed out.
2 47 ms 52 ms 45 ms frn1-r3.tor...
3 46 ms 46 ms 46 ms frn1-r2-vlan400.tor….
4 47 ms 46 ms 47 ms fastvibe-tor-gw….
5 45 ms 46 ms 50 ms OC48POS1-…
6 46 ms 46 ms 45 ms OC48POS1-0.-…
7 56 ms 57 ms 57 ms OC48POS0-0.chi-dis…
8 58 ms 57 ms 60 ms 216.187.68.178
9 65 ms 78 ms 57 ms 216.239.46.5
10 59 ms 62 ms 57 ms 66.249.95.120
11 77 ms 82 ms 75 ms 64.233.175.99
12 76 ms 74 ms 76 ms 66.249.95.124
13 75 ms 81 ms 77 ms 72.14.236.19
14 77 ms 84 ms 77 ms 72.14.236.15
15 82 ms 77 ms 77 ms 64.233.187.99
Trace complete.

Tracing route to google.com [64.233.187.99]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 * * * Request timed out.
2 49 ms 47 ms 60 ms frn1-r3.tor...
3 137 ms 205 ms 209 ms frn1-r2-vlan400.…
4 45 ms 46 ms 46 ms fastvibe-tor-gw.…
5 46 ms 46 ms 46 ms OC48POS1-0.-…
6 * 46 ms 45 ms OC48POS1-0.….
7 58 ms 56 ms 57 ms OC48POS0-0.ch….
8 57 ms 57 ms 57 ms 216.187.68.178
9 61 ms 72 ms 61 ms 216.239.46.5
10 57 ms 58 ms 58 ms 66.249.95.245
11 79 ms 75 ms 75 ms 64.233.175.99
12 74 ms 92 ms 79 ms 66.249.95.124
13 75 ms 76 ms 76 ms 72.14.236.19
14 81 ms 78 ms 79 ms 216.239.49.226
15 79 ms 80 ms 76 ms 64.233.187.99
Trace complete.

 

[DaveC426913]

try pinging that node like before.. Is that your router?

whcih node would you have me ping? The first hop tells me it's timed out and doesn't give me a node.

 

[DaveC426913]

OK, tried something a bit different. Doing some Googling and it's going splah (nothing's coming back). So I ping'ed it (pung it?). I got a pretty coinsistent 24% loss. Every ping failed 1 of the 4 requests. Tried it a dozen times.

 

[-Job-]

That's pretty interesting. Do you have other computers on your network and are they experiencing the same difficulty? Try to rule out a hardware problem.

 

[chroot]

As I said in my first response, I think you have a packet loss problem.

Note that some routers won't ever respond to pings, and will show up as timeouts, even when they're working perfectly. However, I noticed that most of the time, 192.168.1.1 (your router) fails to respond to pings, but not all the time. This suggests that maybe your router is broken or misconfigured -- assuming the wireless physical link is actually okay.

- Warren

 

[DaveC426913]

You know, I am sure it's my imagination, but it sure seems as if unplugging the AC from my laptop to carry it into the other room short circuits the delay.

Like, it'll hang for 20 seconds, and I'll decide to go check the desktop. I'll unplug my laptop, and it will chug-a-chug-chug access the hard drive for 3 seconds. And then - zing - the page will load.

It's done this a dozen times now.

 

[DaveC426913]

Things seem to be calming down this time of night. My pings only time out every 30 or 40 requests. But I did determine that these ones are happening on both systems simultaneously .

 

[chroot]

Your laptop is hitting the disk during these "hangs?"

- Warren

 

[-Job-]

Have you tried changing the channel the wireless signal is on? If there's some other signal present causing interference then most likely the computer would still show connected status but data would not be routed correctly resulting in erratic behavior.

 

[Anttech]

I think your linksys is going mental..

Try updating the firmware..

1 * * 15 ms 192.168.1.1

15 ms is a long time, seems that either your router doesn't have the resources to reply or it can't for some reason..