Is a perfect vacuum truly achievable in reality?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of a perfect vacuum and whether it can be achieved in reality. Participants explore the definitions and implications of a perfect vacuum in relation to the presence of matter, specifically in a controlled chamber environment.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that within a chamber containing 1000 O2 molecules, there could exist a non-zero volume that is a perfect vacuum, as the individual molecules do not occupy the entire volume.
  • Another participant agrees that the spaces between the molecules are empty and could be considered a perfect vacuum.
  • A question is raised regarding the reasoning behind the belief that a perfect vacuum is "impossible," specifically whether it relates to the consideration of the entire volume of the chamber.
  • A later reply confirms the previous question, indicating agreement on the idea that the entire volume is what is considered when discussing the impossibility of achieving a perfect vacuum.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the nature of a perfect vacuum, with some suggesting that it can exist in parts of a chamber while others question the feasibility of achieving it in totality. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the implications of these viewpoints.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the assumptions made about the definition of a perfect vacuum and the implications of molecular presence in a given volume. The discussion does not resolve these complexities.

papernuke
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Let's say there is a chamber with 1000 O2 molecules. According to wikipedia, a perfect vacuum is an arbitrary space in which there is an absence of matter. Of course, the space that consists of the entire volume inside the chamber isn't a vacuum because of those 1000 molecules, but then isn't it true that somewhere, in a non-zero volume that is a subset of the volume of the entire container, there would be a perfect vacuum?

In other words, since those 1000 individual molecules can't take up the volume of the entire chamber, aren't there going to be volumes within the chamber in which no matter exists?
 
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Of course. The spaces between the molecules are empty and therefore a perfect vacuum.
 
Why is it considered "impossible" to create a perfect vacuum, then? Is it because the volume considered for the perfect vacuum is the entire volume of the chamber?
 
papernuke said:
Why is it considered "impossible" to create a perfect vacuum, then? Is it because the volume considered for the perfect vacuum is the entire volume of the chamber?

Exactly.
 

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