Is civil war in Iraq inevitable?

[selfAdjoint]

Maybe the sectarian conflict in Iraq, of which the insurgency is part, is simply a matter of "a difference of opinion" and the guns and bombs are simply used "to emphasize" their points.

:rofl: :rofl: Funny in a dark kinda way

Somebody else's suffering and death is always a small price to pay for that good feeling of confirming your own correctness.

 

[Anttech]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/theeditors/

Interesting article/blog regarding why the bbc doesn't define the current problems in Iraq as a civil war.

Somebody else's suffering and death is always a small price to pay for that good feeling of confirming your own correctness.

I wasnt laughing at my correctness, I was laughing at the "monty python" like wit of Astronuc. One can understand many a thing through satire

 

[Astronuc]

Forgive my dark humor, but I was reflecting upon the rationale of the Bush administration that the sectarian conflict in Iraq is NOT a civil war.

I find myself in disbelief sometimes at the absurdity of the reality of the Bush administration.

The situation in Iraq is a horrible tragedy.


Meanwhile, adding to the absurd -

Text of U.S. Security Adviser’s Iraq Memo
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/29/world/middleeast/29mtext.html

Following is the text of a Nov. 8 memorandum prepared for cabinet-level officials by Stephen J. Hadley, the national security adviser, and his aides on the National Security Council. The five-page document, classified secret, was read and transcribed by The New York Times.

Somebody get me off this planet! I have my towel.

 

[Curious3141]

All wars are civil wars, because all men are brothers. ~François Fénelon

What's so civil about War anyway? ~Axl Rose, Guns n' Roses

 

[Astronuc]

Iraqi Expatriates in Jordan Recount Personal Stories
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=6564639

Morning Edition, December 1, 2006 · It might sound like an unlikely hangout for Iraqi expatriates, but the World Donut cafe in Amman, Jordan, attracts Iraqi doctors, teachers, and intellectuals. Renee Montagne speaks with two exiles from Iraq about their experiences fleeing from home.

I wonder if Iraqis divide along sectarian lines outside of Iraq. I think there is still hope that someone will come along and resolve the conflict among the different groups.

Iraqis Split on Sectarian Lines; Hospitals Follow
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=6567172

All Things Considered, December 1, 2006 · Iraq's Health Ministry is controlled by Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr's movement, under an agreement struck by ruling parties, and sectarian influence has impeded healthcare, according to Dahr Jamail, an independent journalist who's been covering Iraq's healthcare system for Inter Press Service, a nonprofit news organization focusing on developing countries.

Jamail says that in his interviews with doctors at 13 hospitals in and around Baghdad in 2004 and 2005, he discovered a highly politicized healthcare system in Iraq, as well as other challenges facing the country's ailing hospitals.

http://dahrjamailiraq.com/reports/HealthcareUnderOccupationDahrJamail.htm

 

[BobG]

Al-Maliki is probably going to be removed from power very soon.

White House denies move to oust al-Maliki

At a minimum, this is a step back to where the Iraqi government was last winter - arguing among each other to come up with a national leader. In the current climate, I think it will be even more difficult this time around than the first time.

 

[Astronuc]

I've been reading Peter Galbraith's book, "The End of Iraq", in which he picks August 29, 2003 as the beginning of the civil war, basically the sectarian conflict between Sunni and Shii. On the day, an SUV laden with explosives detonated near Ayatollah Bakr al-Hakim as he and others left the Imam Ali mosque. He and 94 others died. And there has been a slow escalation ever since. In addition, there has been a huge internal displacement in Iraq, whereby Sunnis leave and area which is predominantly Shii and vice versa.

The Bush administration has been in deslusion and denial from the very beginning of the invasion and occupation of Iraq.

Galbraith's book is quite interesting as it delves into the ineptitude, incompetence and corruption of the Bush administration.

 

[Astronuc]

Powell Says U.S. Losing in Iraq, Calls for Drawdown by Mid-2007

By Karen DeYoung
Washington Post Staff Writer
Monday, December 18, 2006; Page A20

Former secretary of state Colin L. Powell said yesterday that the United States is losing what he described as a "civil war" in Iraq and that he is not persuaded that an increase in U.S. troops there would reverse the situation. Instead, he called for a new strategy that would relinquish responsibility for Iraqi security to the government in Baghdad sooner rather than later, with a U.S. drawdown to begin by the middle of next year.

Powell's comments broke his long public silence on the issue and placed him at odds with the administration. President Bush is considering options for a new military strategy -- among them a "surge" of 15,000 to 30,000 troops added to the current 140,000 in Iraq, to secure Baghdad and to accelerate the training of Iraqi forces, as Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) and others have proposed; or a redirection of the U.S. military away from the insurgency to focus mainly on hunting al-Qaeda terrorists, as the nation's top military leaders proposed last week in a meeting with the president.

But Bush has rejected the dire conclusions of the Iraq Study Group and its recommendations to set parameters for a phased withdrawal to begin next year, and he has insisted that the violence in Iraq is not a civil war.

"I agree with the assessment of Mr. Baker and Mr. Hamilton," Powell said, referring to the study group's leaders, former secretary of state James A. Baker III and former Indiana congressman Lee H. Hamilton (D). The situation in Iraq is "grave and deteriorating, and we're not winning, we are losing. We haven't lost. And this is the time, now, to start to put in place the kinds of strategies that will turn this situation around."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/12/17/AR2006121700494.html

Bush is still in denial. But I guess that's no surprise.

Bush is our equivalent to Ahmadinejad.

 

[Astronuc]

Attacks in Iraq at Record High, Pentagon Says
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/12/19/world/middleeast/19military.html

WASHINGTON, Dec. 18 — A Pentagon assessment of security conditions in Iraq concluded Monday that attacks against American and Iraqi targets had surged this summer and autumn to their highest level, and called violence by Shiite militants the most significant threat in Baghdad.

The report, which covers the period from early August to early November, found an average of almost 960 attacks against Americans and Iraqis every week, the highest level recorded since the Pentagon began issuing the quarterly reports in 2005, with the biggest surge in attacks against American-led forces. That was an increase of 22 percent from the level for early May to early August, the report said.

While most attacks were directed at American forces, most deaths and injuries were suffered by the Iraqi military and civilians.

The report is the most comprehensive public assessment of the American-led operation to secure Baghdad, which began in early August. About 17,000 American combat troops are currently involved in the beefed-up security operation.

According to the Pentagon assessment, the operation initially had some success in reducing killings as militants concentrated on eluding capture and hiding their weapons. But sectarian death squads soon adapted, resuming their killings in regions of the capital that were not initially targets of the overstretched American and Iraqi troops.

Shiite militias, the Pentagon report said, also received help from allies among the Iraqi police. “Shia death squads leveraged support from some elements of the Iraqi Police Service and the National Police who facilitated freedom of movement and provided advance warning of upcoming operations,” the report said.

. . . .

I heard similar news on other channels.

Maliki's Ties to Sadr Complicate U.S. Mission in Iraq
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=6643020