Dismiss Notice
Join Physics Forums Today!
The friendliest, high quality science and math community on the planet! Everyone who loves science is here!

Jeremiah Wright: Why does Mr. Obama support him?

  1. Mar 17, 2008 #1

    arildno

    User Avatar
    Science Advisor
    Homework Helper
    Gold Member
    Dearly Missed

    Reverend Wright is a blatant racist, has made numerous inflammatory comments, and praises a fascist like Louis Farrakhan.

    Is this really the type of spiritual advisor a future president of the US should have?
     
  2. jcsd
  3. Mar 17, 2008 #2
    You should vote for Nader. You know you agree with him on every issue. It's better to vote for someone you want and have them lose, than to vote for someone you don't want and have them win.
     
  4. Mar 17, 2008 #3

    russ_watters

    User Avatar

    Staff: Mentor

    This should be worrisome for Obama supporters. If it doesn't kill him in the remaining primaries (the far left wing won't be too bothered by this), it has a good chance of killing him in the general election.
     
  5. Mar 17, 2008 #4

    Ivan Seeking

    User Avatar
    Staff Emeritus
    Science Advisor
    Gold Member

    Last edited: Mar 17, 2008
  6. Mar 17, 2008 #5

    Ivan Seeking

    User Avatar
    Staff Emeritus
    Science Advisor
    Gold Member

    This is one of Obama's statements:
    But I thought that Michele Norris had some interesting comments.
    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23658548/page/4/
     
  7. Mar 17, 2008 #6

    Art

    User Avatar

    I find it hard to fathom how a candidate is responsible for the reported preachings of a minister of the church he is a member of.

    Where does guilt by association end? Should all catholics be excluded from running for public office because of the child abuse scandal in that church?

    Should jews be banned from seeking office because a jewish Israeli minister recently threatened the Palestinians with a holocaust?

    Should protestants be banned because some preachers of their church support racist policies?

    I think if you judge people based on things said by people who happen to share some of their views then you would quickly reach the point where the entire poplulation would fail the selection criteria.
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2008
  8. Mar 17, 2008 #7

    Evo

    User Avatar

    Staff: Mentor

    If the viewpoints that are in question are known to the church member, then it would stand to reason that the member agrees with those views. If he was not aware, as Obama claims, then it's a non-issue, up to the point that he has become aware. I would expect Obama to change churches now that he has denounced the reverand.
     
  9. Mar 17, 2008 #8
    I see what you are saying, but there's a difference between "I am Religion X and Mr. Fred is Religion X, and he killed a man, therefore I am a bad person for being of Religion X."

    and "Mr. Fred is my spokesperson for religious people." If you let a preacher endorse you, you get (generally) the support of that preacher's umm... parishoners? Whatever they are called. In turn, that lets the preacher speak for you a bit. You are essentially weakly coupled and you can't take X and Y separately. The preacher being bat**** insane and you welcoming his support means you welcome his ideas.

    I mean honestly, you don't tend to associate with people you have nothing in common with. If you hung out with Stalin or Hitler because they liked to play chess, you'd still be seen as a bad person for hanging out with them, even if you didn't want them to kill anybody. It's just how it is.
     
  10. Mar 17, 2008 #9
    This is just pathetic grasping for straws by the corporate media, and bears no real significance.

    The only thing wrong with this is that this is yet another story of someone preaching politics from the pulpit - stupid.

    As for what this preacher actually said: I've got to say its hard to disagree with any of it on a factual basis.

    For that matter is there any proof that this was actually a speech delivered in a church??? This has been the suggestion but how do people know that he wasn't just making a political speech somewhere?
     
  11. Mar 17, 2008 #10

    Gokul43201

    User Avatar
    Staff Emeritus
    Science Advisor
    Gold Member

    Some of it was from a Christmas eve sermon. That is definitely abusing the role of the church. That Obama still makes weak excuses for him is quite sad to see. If only Obama were more like his mom when it came to religion...
     
  12. Mar 17, 2008 #11

    D H

    User Avatar
    Staff Emeritus
    Science Advisor

    To the contrary. This thread is chock full of pathetic grasping at straws by Obama supporters. The association between Obama and Wright lasted for twenty years. He was Obama's spiritual mentor. This reverend on let loose his wrong side when Obama did not attend services? Please!

    OK. Kool-aid time.
     
  13. Mar 17, 2008 #12

    chemisttree

    User Avatar
    Science Advisor
    Homework Helper
    Gold Member

    The real problems for Obama are manifold. If he rejects his spiritual mentor, member of his campaign advisory committee, inspiration for the title and subject of his book "The Audacity of Hope", close friend, etc... it will look just like what it is. And he is throwing a close confidante under the bus in the process. That is certain to raise a few eyebrows. Now he is saying that he wasn't present at the sermons in question. If that can be refuted by an eyewitness, his campaign is through. He really (uncharacteristically) painted himself into a corner with that denial and it remains to be seen if it is believed by many.
    The real problem is how he and his wife have been portrayed as behaving. Much has been made of his refusal to wear the American flag on his lapel and his wife's comment that for the first time in her adult life she is proud of America. It will be easy for his political opponents to leave those breadcrumbs lying about to encourage anyone who might have the slightest reservation in supporting him to support another candidate.
     
  14. Mar 18, 2008 #13

    Ivan Seeking

    User Avatar
    Staff Emeritus
    Science Advisor
    Gold Member

    If this was an isolated event then I think Obama can ride it out. If not, then he's dead. It may depend in large part on what he says tomorrow [today].

    Funny thing is the Jimmy Carter says much the same thing as the Reverend did, just not with all the damning. I think the message could survive, but the tone and language is devestating.
     
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2008
  15. Mar 18, 2008 #14

    arildno

    User Avatar
    Science Advisor
    Homework Helper
    Gold Member
    Dearly Missed

    The United States is pre-eminently the country where your religious affiliation is basically a commodity you choose, rather than a tradition you feel responsibility to uphold.

    What that means is that a proper denouncement of Mr. Wright would be to quit his Church as a member, and find some better spiritual mentor.
     
  16. Mar 18, 2008 #15

    Gokul43201

    User Avatar
    Staff Emeritus
    Science Advisor
    Gold Member

    Most every conservative preacher in the country has denounced America for being the land of the gay and the home of the greedy. Falwell said that 9/11 was deserved, thanks to the ACLU, gay rights activists, women's rights activists, pro-choicers and evolutionists. And when Falwell died, there wasn't a single news network that could dare to call him the scoundrel that he was. By comparison, what Wright has said here is mild and much of it is true (just not PC to say out loud)!

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/huffpost/20080317/cm_huffpost/091774;_ylt=Aq_lH72YCCxOlaE1vskCJXms0NUE

    We've got a preacher who says that America brought 9/11 upon itself through its interventionist foreign policy, and this person is evil. And then we have a preacher who said that America brought 9/11 upon itself for protecting the rights of gays and teaching evolution in schools, but this person is revered by the masses and the powers that be.

    Wow!
     
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2008
  17. Mar 18, 2008 #16

    Gokul43201

    User Avatar
    Staff Emeritus
    Science Advisor
    Gold Member

    Wright is no longer with the Trinity Church. He (was) retired recently.
     
  18. Mar 18, 2008 #17

    chemisttree

    User Avatar
    Science Advisor
    Homework Helper
    Gold Member

    True but what we have with Obama runs much deeper than just having lunch together or accepting the support of a dispensationalist. Obama's relationship with this pastor spans over two decades not just a grip and grin or a lunch date. The good pastor has said much more than America brought 9/11 upon itself. The church itself has a web site that preaches some very disturbing doctrine. They have even changed their web page to hide the evidence...

    http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/03/17/trinity-united-church-of-christ-makes-changes-to-web-site/

    For these Christians, Jesus is not about salvation but is about Black Power. Jesus is more about favoring the poor over the rich, the oppressed over the opressor. That is not a sentiment that I believe will have resonance with most of America, Christian or otherwise.
     
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2008
  19. Mar 18, 2008 #18

    Gokul43201

    User Avatar
    Staff Emeritus
    Science Advisor
    Gold Member

    c-tree, I hope that quote is not from NewsMax! Can you add the link as well? Cached versions of websites should be easy to dig up, I'd think.

    For an athiest like me, neither of those ideas is particularly appealing, but if these claims are true, then I can see this causing a huge problem for Obama. And I'd be surprised to hear that he'd not planned for this before.

    I thought these were things that are true, according to the Bible (what with all the stuff about the meek inheriting the world and the rich man...eye of a needle). I didn't know that the mainstream Christians rejected these views.
     
  20. Mar 18, 2008 #19

    chemisttree

    User Avatar
    Science Advisor
    Homework Helper
    Gold Member

    From the only TV interview with Pastor Wright:

    You can google black liberation theology and investigate it for yourself. Here is an excerpt from one hit.
    This supposes that 'black' is not merely a skin color but a status of inferiority in society. The term 'white' must therefore mean 'oppressor' and 'sinner'.
    No, this is not normal Christianity and it might greatly harm Obama. There is no amount of distancing from Wright that will change the fact that Obama attends a church based on black liberation theology. Very bad ju ju, I think.
     
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2008
  21. Mar 18, 2008 #20
    Wright is a product of radical oppression, and though I don't defend him making political statements in a religious context, the fact that people actually have the audacity to call him crazy for making statements like

    "The government gives them the drugs, builds bigger prisons, passes a three-strike law and then wants us to sing 'God Bless America.' No, no, no, God d--- America, that's in the Bible for killing innocent people," he said in a 2003 sermon. "God d--- America for treating our citizens as less than human. God d--- America for as long as she acts like she is God and she is supreme."


    I mean, what part of that could you actually disagree with?? Is any part of that factually WRONG?? No.

    The CIA smuggles cocain INTO the country. Historical fact. Just recently we found out that the USA has more people in prison than any other country on earth. Fact. The VAST majority of the prison population is comprised of blacks and other MINORITIES. FACT. The bible DOES say that you are damned for killing innocent people.

    Does the government treat its citizens as less than human?? How about Japanese internment camps. How about fire hoses, police dogs, and black demonstrators. How about secret CIA prisons.

    No, I'm sorry, but where does the reverend have his facts SO WRONG that this is headline news??

    "We bombed Hiroshima, we bombed Nagasaki, and we nuked far more than the thousands in New York and the Pentagon, and we never batted an eye," Wright said in a sermon Sept. 16, 2001. "We have supported state terrorism against the Palestinians and black South Africans, and now we are indignant because the stuff we have done overseas is now brought right back to our own front yards. America's chickens are coming home to roost," he told his congregation.


    Again... which part of this is inaccurate??
     
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2008
Know someone interested in this topic? Share this thread via Reddit, Google+, Twitter, or Facebook

Have something to add?



Similar Discussions: Jeremiah Wright: Why does Mr. Obama support him?
  1. Why support the eu (Replies: 16)

  2. Hate Obama? Why? (Replies: 489)

Loading...