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Khazars dispute

  1. Feb 27, 2004 #1
    "Friendly" fellow....NOT This brash fellow has some website on the Khazars. Too bad he wasn't a real historian who accepts history AND the Bible as two witnesses to Israelite identity truth. Regardless of his vain rantings, the United States remains Manasseh and England is Ephraim, sons of Joseph!

    ----- Original Message -----
    From: "Kevin Brook" <kbrook@pi.pair.com>
    To: "davidbenariel" <davidbenariel@famvid.com>
    Sent: Friday, February 27, 2004 1:53 AM
    Subject: Re: Yair Davidiy

    I am familiar with EVERY ARTICLE ON THE WEB about Khazars.
    Brit-Am is an agenda-driven cultish propaganda organization which
    dismisses the truth about Khazar people's origins to fit their pet theory
    that Israelites are everywhere throughout Europe.
    Since you're associated with them, I have no interest in corresponding
    The Khazars were ORIGINALLY TURKIC - ALL the sources say so.
    They mixed later with some Hebrews, but that wasn't their main lineage!
    And some other contentions of Brit-Am are also false: Khazars aren't
    Agathyrsoi, and Picts aren't Agathyrsoi, and Celts and Brits aren't
    Israelites, USA isn't Menashe. Yair Davidy is no historian.

    Don't waste my time with any further religiously-inspired false
    interpretations of history.
    And as you are a Christian you have no business going by a Hebrew name
    unless you have Israelite ancestry, nor do you have any business trying
    to establish a Jewish Third Temple on Jews' behalf.
    And there's no need for a new Third Temple anyway except in the minds of
    extremist wackos who think ritually slaughtering animals accomplishes


    About your alleged attempt to destroy the Dome of the Rock so that Jews
    could rebuild the Third Temple:

    You admit your real name is David A. Hoover - and that you're a "a blond,
    "non-Jewish" American" who is a "Christian Zionist" believing in "the
    Israelite identity of the peoples of Northwestern Europe":

    On Thu, 26 Feb 2004, davidbenariel wrote:
    Are you familiar with Brit-Am Israel and their article on the Khazars?
    Here it is: http://www.britam.org/khazars.html

    David Ben-Ariel

    Check out Beyond Babylon: Europe's Rise and Fall http://www.benariel.com
  2. jcsd
  3. Feb 27, 2004 #2


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    Well I was interested enough to read the first sentence.
  4. Feb 27, 2004 #3


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    Yeah, I'm always up for a hot discussion of Turkomon migrations! How 'bout them Patzinaks!

  5. Feb 27, 2004 #4


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    The thing about the Khazars that's got David's yarmulke in a twist is that they were Jewish. That is, they adopted Judaism and practiced it for a number of centuries.
  6. Feb 27, 2004 #5
    Khazars were Turkic, Brit-Am never disproved it

    David, I did not give you permission to copy my private email to a public forum. This shows your lack of understanding of copyright law. The email I sent you had a valid copyright notice:

    This email is Copyright (C) 2004 Kevin Brook, All Rights Reserved. No retransmission is permitted.

    The Christian cult of British Israelitism, founded in the 19th century, is not based on truth, but on biased biblically-inspired interpretations. Brit-Am has the preconceived notion that Western Europeans are Israelites and then tries simplistically to tailor information and names to suit that idea. Whereas by contrast I have no preconceived notion and am open to real facts from objective sources (read: real historians - the type you and Davidy casually ignore).

    It is very telling that Brit-Am's Yair Davidy uses defamation tactics to attack Dunlop, Koestler, Artamonov, myself, and other historians of the Khazars, without actually addressing the points we raised. His method is to selectively present his point of view and not presenting the actual facts presented by these authors. For instance I didn't see any time when Davidy quoted the several medieval documents that call Khazars TURKS. Why is he afraid? Because it defeats his theory?

    Many medieval writers attested to the Khazars' Turkic origins including Theophanes, al-Masudi, Rabbi Yehudah ben Barzillai, Martinus Oppaviensis, and the anonymous authors of the Georgian Chronicle and Chinese chronicle T'ang-shu. The Arabic writer al-Masudi in Kitab at-Tanbih wrote: "...the Khazars... are a tribe of the Turks." (cited in Peter Golden, Khazar Studies, pp. 57-58). T'ang-shu reads: "K'o-sa [Khazars]... belong to the stock of the Turks." (cited in Peter Golden, Khazar Studies, p. 58). In his Chronographia, Theophanes wrote: "During his [Byzantine emperor Heraclius] stay there [in Lazica], he invited the eastern Turks, who are called Chazars, to become his allies." (cited in Theophanes, The Chronicle of Theophanes Confessor, translated by Cyril Mango and Roger Scott, 1997, p. 446).

    Yes, Khazars mixed with Israelite immigrants (who came to Khazaria AFTER Khazars already existed as a group), but that doesn't mean Khazars were predominantly or exclusively Israelite.

    It's one thing to say that some Western Europeans have a small amount of Israelite ancestry. It's quite another to suggest that their principal origins are in Israel. I believe the former is true, but the latter is definitely false. When people speak about part of Spain's Christian population descending partly from Sephardim who were forced to become Catholics, it's true. But Celtic Welsh people, Germanic Frisian & English people, etc. can't be shown to have any
    connection to Israelites whatsoever. Nor American Indians (the Mormons' pet theory).

    By the way, please prove that Yair Davidy has recent Jewish ancestry! And that the Bible is a pure work of history! And even that Jesus existed!
  7. Feb 27, 2004 #6
    Khazars of Israelite origin

    I didn't ask for it, especially when such "private" email is PUBLICLY posted on your website. What are you trying to hide? What's so special about your OPINION you must "guard" it?

    You're arguing with yourself, your strawman is a figment of your biased imagination, especially since Mr. Yair Davidiy never ignores the alleged Turkic origins of the Khazars.

    A CONFESSION! You belatedly acknowledge Israelite origins of Khazars, and yet try and cover your tracks by your theories that seek to minimize its importance. Pitiful.

    More confessions from copyright man! Yes, indeed, the Western Europeans are Israelites!

    YOU "believe." Regardless, both the Bible and history PROVE our Israelite origins, O doubting Thomas! But then again, Joseph's brethren were BLIND to his identity and he was right in front of them. History repeats itself!

    It sounds like you have some REAL issues. Prove it yourself. What about YOU? With that "Christian" sounding name, are you a Jew trying to fit in with Joes? (Joseph/Anglo-Saxons). And if you're a Jew, why haven't you made aliyah/ascent/emmigrated to Israel? Or it is (always) "NEXT Year in Jerusalem..."?
  8. Feb 27, 2004 #7
    I have no problem with the Khazars of Israelite origin adopting Judaism. At least, for now, they're closer to biblical Christianity than the baptized paganism that masquerades as "Christianity," the Babylonian Mystery Religious lies of SUNday, Xmas, Easter and plenty of pork! The true Christians, however, observe the biblical Sabbath and holy days, just like Yahshua/Jesus and the early Church: just like the Bible and history testify.

  9. Feb 27, 2004 #8
    From Chana

    Kevin is an *interesting* fellow.
    Perhaps Kevin should change his distinctly Irish name for one more American(if he is indeed american)... seems a bit Chutzpadik to use an Irish name if you live in America. Shouldnt the name be Spike, or Bo, or Bubba, or something really American?
    . And I wonder why, since Kevin is obviously not Jewish *HE* is speaking out on who may use an *israelitish* name and who may not? And why is this Goy speaking out on the temple mount or the temple in anyway? Hmmm, double standard?
    And.. last but most importantly... why is this gentile presuming to say who is a jew and who is not a Jew???????????????
    Whatever the Khazars were or are...they converted to Judaism and that makes them 100% Jewish according to halacha no matter what this guy says.... Does he find fault with Ruth?
    I would be honored if someone forwarded this to him \
    Sincerely, Chana
  10. Feb 29, 2004 #9

    jimmy p

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    so i'm guessing this is a discussion on another forum which has been brought here...WHY??? Anyway, upon reading David's first post, i am inclined to agree with him, there was no need for that outburst when he asked a simple question. Lol, just lay off the discussions we arent interested in next time. And how did Truly Abrahamic find out about PF? Does that mean we are gonna have ANOTHER paranoid person on here spreading the word of overpaid and underworked Israeli journalists??
  11. Feb 29, 2004 #10
    Actually, if we can get "Truly Abrahamic" to substantiate his claim, we can take things to the next level...the ball is in your court, dude...
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