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Life after Death?

  1. No, I dont.

  2. Yes, I do.

  1. Jul 29, 2004 #1
    What happens after Death??

    Heaven? Hell? what??

    Is there another life after it?

    IMO, this is bull****...The concepts of things like Heaven & hell are just fabricated to make death easy to accept & to prevent misdeeds & crimes...

    What do you ppl think of this?
  2. jcsd
  3. Jul 29, 2004 #2
    Please see my recent post on "Destiny" thread. We are energy and move on to another form. I can not and will not rule out reincarnation.

    Heaven and hell are mythological places. The bible and the acient writings were presented in terms for that time. We need new writings and ideas.

    You and I are as divinely inspired as the acients. Post away! Who knows, you may even create the new myth.

    olde drunk
  4. Jul 29, 2004 #3


    So there is the story of death, and the story of the character Jesus in the book the bible.
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2004
  5. Jul 29, 2004 #4

    On the contrary, your theorem is all wrong. Songs have a three part sum, thought has five levels, we are indisputably four dimensional when we die, and that Jesus fits into the triangle equality part of the triangle inequality, due to his immortality. Therefore the bible isn't tested in math, but is instead tested in the Great New Indisputable Math that can only be known after the rapture.

    It's really quite simple!
  6. Jul 29, 2004 #5
    To test you to prove me wrong about my music. I'll get you to play a song you like. Then sing "OOMPA", along with the music like your playing a instrument. Then when you hear the inspirational part of your song sing "BOOMPA", as soulfully and excellently as you can, like Mario Carey.

    If you do this test. You'll see music is made of two parts. Also thought is expressed as human expression, as is music. So my ideas on the two being similiar is plausible.

    Now about the revelation. We have nothing to boast of Paul says in Romans. The rapture would cause boasting, so there will be NO boasting of it. For it will not happen to cause boasting.
  7. Jul 29, 2004 #6
    I always laugh now when people say they don't believe in God or the life of the soul because we were created by God. And we were created out of love and that love grants us the freedom to say we don't believe in our creator lol.

    If you consider this world and this life seriously for even a moment you have to see there is an underlying intelligence in every cell and microbe that exists. Even on the large scale things behave with a purpose. Earth spins around the sun like a clock, but nooooooooo we live in chaos people say.

    The argument of wether heaven or hell exists must break down to it's simplest element before it can move on and out to larger topics, and that is do we have a soul. That is, an inner spirit that is like a man but in spirit. I'm telling you we do, but it cannot be proved by science because it is not in space, rather it is in a 'state.' The nearest I can come to 'proof' of the soul is our dreams . . . and that's a whole nother topic.
  8. Jul 29, 2004 #7
    But then finish with "Doopedy Do" for the final unadulterated parts!

    No, but there will be seven golden lampstands. Are you prepared for the septangle inequality?? Have you even tried??
  9. Jul 29, 2004 #8
    Life, death...

    Scientists and thinkersare now veering round to the idea that the concept of "self" is an illusion.There simply is no ghost inside the machine! (But what an astounding machine that mindless evolution has wrought!)
    So out goes everything; self, soul, freewill, and...God
  10. Jul 29, 2004 #9


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    Well if you ask how did we get here, there are two posabilities.

    1. Everything came into being by chance.

    2. Someone made it.

    In both case you have the same and therefore equally valid delema that something
    always existed.

    1. Matter or energy.

    2. Some entity.

    Option 1 leaves you with no point or purpose to life, you may as well end the misery now.

    Option 2 means you exist for a reason.

    I happen to like option 2 better.

    I suppose both have the possability of an after life though option 1 is just recycling.

    In following option 2, I for several reasons try to live by the teaching of Christ.
    In doing so I find the principals he gives to bare out in reality in their effect on my
    being. More than this there have been many opportunities to pray and to see these
    prayers answered. Like the time I prayed for a couple whom the doctors told get used to the idea of never having children. After years of futile trying, she was pregnant within weeks of prayer. Another time the church prayed for a baby whose body was riddled with many cancers. That child is now completely clear of it. Another child had moluscs which is verry difficult to treat and takes a long time to cure if ever. Within days of prayer, it was gone. All these and much more I have personally witnessed among family friends church and elsewhere. Therefore I trust Christ's teaching which
    includes the idea of mans imortal soul which lives on after death in one of 2 conditions.
    Which is up to you.

  11. Jul 30, 2004 #10
    If prayer could really cause change then there would be chaos! Because you pray for something, and then it happens, does not mean you caused it. Many people die horrible deaths, it does not mean there is no God and no one is praying for them.
  12. Jul 30, 2004 #11
  13. Jul 30, 2004 #12
    Mani quotes the thinking of many; i.e., "...self is an illusion." This has been proven to me through my own mediative experience. Self is a construct and not a solid state. It's constantly changing. Not only are the physical body's cells renewed constantly, but your inner being is in constant motion due to your experiences. Are you the same Self you were 5, 10 years ago? You will say no, if you are honest. I look back at my life (I'm 58) and see a road map with many vistas of selves I thought were me, only to move on and realize I am a journey - an energy moving through the landscape of action and inaction - The Watcher of the self, the Pilgrim. Whether in Form or in No Form, we are in the sea of causality. Energy cannot die. It transforms. Remember?

  14. Aug 3, 2004 #13


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    If it were a one off or even a few times like other coincidences I would agree,
    that is no proof. Probably no proof if taken as any single event on it's own.
    However when this sort of thing occurs very consistantly I think we have to suspect there is a correlation. It's a bit like the smoking causes lung cancer
    argument. For decades, we all knew there was a correlation between the
    two even though no causative mechanism could be defined.

    The issue of prayer is a difficult one because we are dealing with a suspected spiritual reality. Our science is incapable of revealing causation here.
    However I would like to point out that if you work from an original assumption
    of an entity creating the universe, then spiritual reality is primary.
    Physical reality is then subjuct to it. So how can prayer by physical
    beings affect reality. I think the answer is clear that only prayer that is in
    agreement with (comes as a response to) the creator entity can become
    reality. Also we have prophetic writing that if they have come as a
    revelation from the creator, give clues to spiritual principals to apply
    to reveal the causative link between prayer and changes to reality.
    Humans do not have that kind of ability to make prayer real.
    The Creator does. It would the stupid and arrogant to think we could in
    any way manipulate such a creator, rather it's the other way round.
    The Creator does not create chaos but order and that is why prayer does not
    result in chaos.

    I have spent many years, decades looking into this and only in recent years, do I see consistant results from prayer.

  15. Aug 3, 2004 #14

    if humans find death is painful and that the concept of Heaven can help them to soothe the pain, what is wrong with that? does that mean that they are not strong enough compared to those who doesn't believe ? humans are smart and they have found a way to overcome things like that. if it works, who care if heaven or hell exist or not? i am a practical person, i only care if it works or doesn't ; if i am in the situation.

    and if it helps to prevent misdeeds and crimes, shouldn't everybody encourage that concept to flow ? or you don't agree it works.
  16. Aug 3, 2004 #15


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    Sounds to me like your thinking of prayer as some kind of magic, where
    your action causes a result. A prayer is a request. If you ask someone to
    do something, either they will or not it's their choise not yours and how they
    do it is not necessarily what you had in mind either. No one has God in their
    pocket. It's the other way round. The Bible speaks of a relationship with
    God and claims that whatever we ask in his name will be done for us.
    "In his name" suggests representing his will, not ours. So it's more like
    responding to a prompting he places in us and not comming from self.

    One or a few events could be coincidence but when it happens regularly
    it looks like a correlation. Causation is often suspected although the
    mechanism is not fuly known or understood. Just like the link between
    smoking and lung cancer. For decades, the link was well accepted
    on the evidence of corelation but only recently proved.

    Death has it's purpose releasing us from a fallen and corrupt existance.
    All I can say is that in my experience, praying in such situations,
    God has always been mercifull in this.

  17. Aug 3, 2004 #16


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    >First of all, option 1 still has a purpose and a point. I do not think that most athiests would want to end their life because someone with a weak argument thought that life without a creater is meaningless.

    If I did not believe in God, I would still find purpose in my life but that is not
    the same as life itself having porpose. For something to have purpose,
    there has to be an intention for that something. That's what purpose means.
    If there is an intention, that can only come from something like a mind.
    Therefore if life itself has a purpose, there must be some kind of mind entity
    with an intention for life.

    Actiually it's kind amusing to hear scientists say things like event tend to
    order themselves. This kind of language is a thin mask for the conclusion
    they are trying so deperatly to avoid. Such are not the properties of matter.

    >Just because everything you know has a beginning and an end does not mean that the universe is that way. thats just an assumption. What if the universe has always existed and always will?

    Exactly the delimma.
    Either the universe always existed or God did.
    Both are equally valid assumptions to begin from.

    >That would add a third number to your list. What if your creator made you but has no purpose for you?

    Do you really seriously think any intellegent entity creating such a complex
    ordered universe would do so for no reason at all, even a trivial one?

    >Hell, what if the only reason he made you was to follow his will and serve him? Sounds like a slave driver to me.

    Then people would have no free will to choose between good and evil.
    It fact those concepts would not exist because we would simply
    automatically do what we were created to do.

    >Oh and by the way, just because you happen to like option 2 better, ( most likely a security issue) does not make it anymore valid than option 1.[/QUOTE]

    True, I'm just saying it's an equally valid point to start from.
    "Security" issue, TV steriotypes arn't real life you know.
    These are really important questions in life. I went this way searching for
    answers. I could have simply ignored the issue and I could then do whatever
    I liked but no. Over decades, the more I follow this path, the more sure it
    seems and the more I have to sacrifice. So no it's not because it's
    comfortable or easy or even that I like it. It's the last thing I would want
    to choose. It's hard and difficult I've had to give up a very great deal
    constantly at war with myself. I choose it because it seems to be the trueth.

  18. Aug 3, 2004 #17
    people don't believe things because things never happen to them.
    people don't believe things because they have already given up at the first place.
    people don't believe things because they tend to protect themselves from being hurt and disappointed. they might once choose to believe, try really hard and eventually it didn't come out as what they had expected.
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2004
  19. Aug 17, 2004 #18


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    if life after death was fake, then life now is fake, and if all is fake, then this, which we are witnessing isnt real, the origin of all origins, is originless, the end of all ends, is endless...

    Life after death, and life before birth are all existance beyond big bang - big crunch, there are things greater than start / end, things like infinity, which is a scientific fact, that we human being should consider in examining the universe.

    Thanks to god for his knowledge and wisdom, thanks to god for his mercy and blessings, may god guide us all, may peace upon us all...


    Ilm i.e. Science.
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