Out of Paper" vs. Upwards: Exploring Magnetic Forces

In summary, "upward" and "out of paper" are both perpendicular to the paper, while "normal" is perpendicular to a plane. Normal is just another word for perpendicular.
  • #1
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In giving directions of magnetic forces, we sometimes use the term "out of paper" or upwards, but what really is the difference between them?
 
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  • #2
upward lies in the plane of the paper while "out of paper" is perpendicular to it.
 
  • #3
Perpendicular to the paper?? What do you thinK about normal?
 
  • #4
If there's just a wire placing horizontally, how can you determine whether the force lies in the plane or out of the plane?
 
  • #5
That will depend on direction of magnetic field and that of current. Use Fleming's left hend rule.
 
  • #6
perpendicular and normal are synonim
 
  • #7
but I think that perpendicular is to a line and normal is to a plane.
 
  • #8
After a bit of research, I think both terms are good here.

Mathworld says for the definition of 'normal vector':

"The normal vector, often simply called the "normal," to a surface is a vector perpendicular to it."

So it makes sense to talk about a vector perpendicular to a surface (we knew that of course).

'Normal' is just a more sophisticated way of saying the same thing.

And it doesn't seem right to say that 'normal' and 'perpendicular' are synonim, because the term normal, as I understand it, can only be used when talking about a vector. So we can say that two planes are perpendicular to one another, but we cannot say that they are normal to one another.

sources:
http://mathworld.wolfram.com/NormalVector.html
http://mathworld.wolfram.com/Perpendicular.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surface_normal
 
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  • #9
So will it be correct to say that two vectors are normal to each other if angle between them is 90.
 
  • #10
I would say 'no'. 'Normal' is only used to describe perpendicularity of a vector wrt a plane.

Have you seen this used in a textbook before? I think they mostly use the term 'orthogonal', which is a synomim to perpendicular when talking about simple object such as lines, vectors, planes, etc., but actually extend to more abstract mathematical objects as the generalisation of the notion of perpendicularity.


See https://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=81294&highlight=orthogonal
 
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  • #11
Thanks for your valuable explanations.
 

1. What is the difference between "Out of Paper" and "Upwards: Exploring Magnetic Forces"?

"Out of Paper" and "Upwards: Exploring Magnetic Forces" are two different scientific concepts. "Out of Paper" refers to the state where there is no paper left in a printer or copier, while "Upwards: Exploring Magnetic Forces" is a scientific experiment or study that focuses on the effects and properties of magnetic forces.

2. How are magnetic forces explored in "Upwards: Exploring Magnetic Forces"?

In "Upwards: Exploring Magnetic Forces", scientists use various tools and techniques to study the behavior and properties of magnetic forces. This may include experiments with magnets, electromagnets, or magnetic fields.

3. Is "Out of Paper" a scientific term?

No, "Out of Paper" is not a scientific term. It is a common term used to indicate that there is no more paper available in a printer or copier.

4. How can the concept of "Out of Paper" be related to "Upwards: Exploring Magnetic Forces"?

There is no direct relation between the two concepts. However, one could draw a connection by considering the use of paper in printing scientific research and studies, including those related to magnetic forces.

5. What are some potential applications of studying magnetic forces in "Upwards: Exploring Magnetic Forces"?

The study of magnetic forces in "Upwards: Exploring Magnetic Forces" has various potential applications in different fields, such as engineering, medicine, and environmental science. For example, understanding magnetic forces can help in the development of new technologies, such as magnetic levitation trains, and in medical imaging techniques using magnetic resonance imaging (MRI).

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