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Modernisation of Religion to be Equal to Women

  1. Jan 29, 2009 #1
    I saw on a Sunday TV show 'The Big Questions' that the Church is the only institution that is still allowed to be sexist. Women are not allowed to be appointed as bishops. Surely the modernisation of religion is overdue in our secular society? I believe that the adoption of a total religious equality of women is the only way forward in healing the materialistic western way of life. A positive step in the right direction is desperately needed.
     
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  3. Jan 29, 2009 #2
    If we're going with the definition of sexism that you imply (absolutely equal treatment of women and men without regard to genuine gender differences), I would point out that the military is also sexist. Only men are required to register for the draft, and women typically aren't allowed in combat zones.

    Mind you, I don't subscribe to the same definition of sexism, so I don't think there's anything wrong with the military in this regard. But that's another discussion. My point is that it might help if you propose a clearer definition of sexism.
     
  4. Jan 29, 2009 #3

    mgb_phys

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  5. Jan 29, 2009 #4

    russ_watters

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    As the others have pointed out, this is just plain factually wrong. There are countless organizations/entities that are allowed to discriminate on the basis of gender and that even includes ones where money is concerned, such as car insurance.
     
  6. Jan 29, 2009 #5
    Another question for Mammo. How are we defining "the Church?" This can mean a number of things including the Catholic Church, Eastern Orthodox, a variety of Protestant denomination, and sometimes even other religions or the "Church" of Scientology. Who are we talking about when we refer to the Church?
     
  7. Jan 29, 2009 #6

    Gokul43201

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    At least insurance companies can make an argument based on the statistics to back their case. The Church has an entirely different kind of argument (one that we can't get into here).

    But as mgb pointed, "modernisation of religion" is itself an oxymoron of sorts.
     
  8. Jan 29, 2009 #7

    turbo

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    Holy cow! Apparently the OP has never played golf. Even at public clubs, the women are routinely denied early-morning tee-times, and some private clubs do not admit women at all.
     
  9. Jan 29, 2009 #8

    Evo

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    I was watching a show on India, and the host was visiting a Muslim shrine and there was a big sign in English saying "Sorry, no ladies beyond this point".

    There was sign for the men "No open heads beyond this point". Only men could enter and only those wearing skull caps and barefoot, no shoes allowed either.

    A religion can have any rules they want.
     
  10. Jan 29, 2009 #9

    Gokul43201

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    I don't understand the connection to materialism, but ignoring that for now, would you also recommend adoption of equal treatment for other groups of people as well, such as homosexuals, for instance?
     
  11. Jan 29, 2009 #10

    turbo

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    I'd be all for the Roman Catholic church ordaining gay female priests. It would be safer for altar boys.
     
  12. Jan 29, 2009 #11

    russ_watters

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    True, but it was just an example - other organizations need no logic - for example, the Boy Scouts and Girl Scouts.
     
  13. Jan 29, 2009 #12
    I suppose this is as good a time as any to mention separation of church and state. As I understand the history of that term and how it found its way to Thomas Jefferson's pen, the original intent of separation of church and state was to protect the church from the state. And it was probably with things such as these in mind. As long as we all believe in the Constitution, it would be both a bad idea and illegal to enforce the sorts of rules that are being suggested here. Religious organizations are protected under American law to have whatever rules they want, and the state can't enforce its own policies on these organizations.

    Remember that we live in a country where the KKK is permitted to put its views into practice within the confines of its own membership. So it seems to me that this discussion about "adoption of a total religious equality" is moot.
     
  14. Jan 29, 2009 #13

    Math Is Hard

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    I think we can safely rule out Wiccans. :smile:

    Absolutely. I can create a club tomorrow and make up my own rules. If people like them, they'll join. If my rules suck, they won't join.

    Obviously, some women are quite comfortable with the rules of patriarchal religions and traditions because in many situations they are free to leave or disobey, but they don't. A classmate of mine told me that she likes the rules of modest dress of her religion because it makes her feel protected from men who would look at her lustfully. Her sisters don't wear a headscarf, but she chooses to do this. She also feels that her male classmates take her more seriously because they are not focusing on her beauty and are listening to what she has to say. Another former coworker has never learned to drive and her husband drives her everywhere. To some people it seems odd, but to her, it is chivalrous. This woman is a highly talented technical professional, one of the best in her field that I have worked with.

    It's only going to become an irritating issue to the members who are unhappy about the rules. Until that's the majority, there's no reason for a change.
     
  15. Jan 29, 2009 #14

    Math Is Hard

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    and the PF Sisterhood. :biggrin:

    note: I'm moving this to General Discussion. I don't think it fits well with Philosophy.
     
  16. Jan 29, 2009 #15
    I tried girl scouts and hated it, I decided to join my brother in boy scouts instead. One of the leaders quit because I was there, but the only rule was that my dad had to be there as a witness that nothing inappropriate happened. This was more to protect the leaders than me. Even boy scouts are not allowed to deny a lady her rights. The funny thing is, none of the boy scouts cared at all, I was just one of the guys, it was the parents that got all upset.
     
  17. Jan 29, 2009 #16
    there are female ministers and female rabbis in some churches and temples. there also exists a strictly female order that is part of the masons. these things are already ironing themselves out there also exist religions such as wicca where females are often regarded as more important than males.
     
  18. Jan 30, 2009 #17
    do you know if the girl scouts have a similar policy?
     
  19. Jan 30, 2009 #18
    it seems that the girl scouts don't allow boys at all because apparently research shows that girls have special needs and interests that are best served in a program designed specificly for girls in an all girl setting. pfft

    there is apparently also a organization called spiralscouts which is a pagan unisex alternative to boy scouts and girl scouts.
     
  20. Jan 30, 2009 #19
    Actually, when I was in Girl Scouts, we had a boy that used to sit in on alot of our meetings. We just considered him as a brother tho, so none of us cared.
     
  21. Jan 30, 2009 #20
    I no longer associate with any synagog now that I have kids. My wife is not Jewish and it seems that no synagog will accept my children as Jewish unless they convert. As I am against such a conversion, they never went to Hebrew school. The point is that a Jewish woman married to a non-Jewish man would not have gone through this, their children would be considered Jewish without conversion.

    By the way, I've been a girl scout ever since I was 13.
     
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