- #26
maumer
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Reading previous posts:
I will believe you when you will give me a time definition without starting from motion. You are using motion to define time that measures motion. A snake eating it's tail.
Reading last Antiproton post 10-10-2003:
You've made an example using two systems: A and B. Each one has two events inside: a(A), b(A), a(B), b(B). I suppose A and B are isolated one from the other, otherwise A and B are the same system and your example is untrue. Now i'm asking myself in wich system do you take your "reference frame"? Inside system A? Staying in A you cannot see B system and viceversa. Staying in A you don't know a(B) and b(B) and their order in reference of a(A) and b(A) because the two systems are isolated. Are you creating a C system in wich put A and B and looking them from C? In this case you choose an external "reference frame" and C links A and B, because if you are looking them, you interact whith them and they aren't still isolated.
Returnig in my "artificial example": in my system there is a ball. It exists, and it makes gravity field and it is surrounded by space. You haven't still answered: could you experiment gravity, space, time in my system?
Reading previous posts:
In these posts you (Anti&Russ) use the motion of something to define time: atomic radiation period, cesius atom vibration, etc. In this way, you make a close correspondence between one vibration and one unit of time. But Antiproton said: "First, time is not measured relative to motion... motion is measured relative to time. v=dx/dt."
Antiproton 07-08-2003:
"Instead, consider more regular phenomina like the period of atomic radiation."
Russ_watters 10-07-2003:
"Transit of the sun (sundial), vibration of quarz chrystals (typical watch), vibration of cesium atoms (atomic clock)."
Antiproton 10-10-2003:
"However, if in this universe you have a ball NOT at 0k, then one can assume the molecules of the ball move in some fashion. One can therefore distinguish between 1 state and another state."
I will believe you when you will give me a time definition without starting from motion. You are using motion to define time that measures motion. A snake eating it's tail.
Reading last Antiproton post 10-10-2003:
You've made an example using two systems: A and B. Each one has two events inside: a(A), b(A), a(B), b(B). I suppose A and B are isolated one from the other, otherwise A and B are the same system and your example is untrue. Now i'm asking myself in wich system do you take your "reference frame"? Inside system A? Staying in A you cannot see B system and viceversa. Staying in A you don't know a(B) and b(B) and their order in reference of a(A) and b(A) because the two systems are isolated. Are you creating a C system in wich put A and B and looking them from C? In this case you choose an external "reference frame" and C links A and B, because if you are looking them, you interact whith them and they aren't still isolated.
Returnig in my "artificial example": in my system there is a ball. It exists, and it makes gravity field and it is surrounded by space. You haven't still answered: could you experiment gravity, space, time in my system?