Necrosis Vs apoptosis

  • #1
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Summary:

Is necrotic cell death implicated in every disease condition (both inflammatory and non-inflammatory)? Is this why we fear any disease most?

Main Question or Discussion Point

It is said that necrosis precipitates inflammation. It is also considered that inflammation causes most of the damage in any diseased condition.

Comparatively, apoptosis doesn't trigger inflammation.

I have the following doubts in this context.

1) Is necrotic (and/or apoptotic) cell death implicated in every disease (both inflammatory and non-inflammatory)?

2) If so, should we encourage the process of apoptosis rather than necrosis for any impending cell deaths?

3) What factors decide necrosis and apoptosis?

4) Can both apoptosis and necrosis occur simultaneously in a diseased condition?

5) Are germs/infections implicated in apoptosis also?

6) Why necrosis is feared most? Does the necrosis affect the normal healthy cells also?

7) Is the current corona virus-panic is all about necrosis?

Thank you.
 
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Answers and Replies

  • #2
pinball1970
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Summary:: Is necrotic cell death implicated in every disease condition (both inflammatory and non-inflammatory)? Is this why we fear any disease most?

It is said that necrosis precipitates inflammation. It is also considered that inflammation causes most of the damage in any diseased condition.

Comparatively, apoptosis doesn't trigger inflammation.

I have the following doubts in this context.

1) Is necrotic (and/or apoptotic) cell death implicated in every disease (both inflammatory and non-inflammatory)?

2) If so, should we encourage the process of apoptosis rather than necrosis for any impending cell deaths?

3) What factors decide necrosis and apoptosis?

4) Can both apoptosis and necrosis occur simultaneously in a diseased condition?

5) Are germs/infections implicated in apoptosis also?

6) Why necrosis is feared most? Does the necrosis affect the normal healthy cells also?

7) Is the current corona virus-panic is all about necrosis?

Thank you.
Discussion and examples all here

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Necrosis
 
  • #3
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8
Discussion and examples all here

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Necrosis
Thanks for the quote.

There are more nuances to cell deaths than those that meet the eye from Wikipedia articles. While it is common knowledge that necrosis entails inflammation while apoptosis does not, it is imperative to understand the process behind what determines the process of cell death. How the body chooses necrosis over apoptosis?

I feel the interpretation of data is more important.

For example, a pneumonia-like condition prevails in the present CoV2 pathology. Is it due to the direct damage caused by the virus (or its replication itself) or is it due to the inflammatory response of the immune system (necrosis)?

I wanted to know specifically if apoptosis also can precipitate ARDS and if germs are implicated in apoptosis also.

I also wanted to differentiate the mechanism of lung conditions like pneumonia/ARDS say from tuberculosis and SARS CoV2. Simply I want to understand the present CoV2 condition.

Is it necrosis or apoptosis or both?

I couldn't grasp such finer points from Wikipedia article.

Thank you
 
  • #4
pinball1970
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Thanks for the quote.

There are more nuances to cell deaths than those that meet the eye from Wikipedia articles. While it is common knowledge that necrosis entails inflammation while apoptosis does not, it is imperative to understand the process behind what determines the process of cell death. How the body chooses necrosis over apoptosis?

I feel the interpretation of data is more important.

For example, a pneumonia-like condition prevails in the present CoV2 pathology. Is it due to the direct damage caused by the virus (or its replication itself) or is it due to the inflammatory response of the immune system (necrosis)?

I wanted to know specifically if apoptosis also can precipitate ARDS and if germs are implicated in apoptosis also.

I also wanted to differentiate the mechanism of lung conditions like pneumonia/ARDS say from tuberculosis and SARS CoV2. Simply I want to understand the present CoV2 condition.

Is it necrosis or apoptosis or both?

I couldn't grasp such finer points from Wikipedia article.

Thank you
My main take away from is that apoptosis is programmed where necrosis is not and is the result of disease.

Not everybody gets frost bite/gangrene/snake bite and resulting necrosis but all cells ultimately die in every individual.

Did you see the comparison of the cells from normal through to apoptosis and necrosis on the wiki article?

The difference with the organelles and cell membrane?

COVID is tricky as information is still coming out and there are a lot of unknowns

@jim mcnamara and @BillTre will be able to expand

EDIT I found this string from 2 years ago https://www.physicsforums.com/threads/mitosis-apoptosis-and-necrosis.900838/

some discussion on there
 
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  • #5
jim mcnamara
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See the picture here - this is a very detailed explanation of the difference between the two processes:
https://www.ptglab.com/news/blog/what-is-the-difference-between-necrosis-and-apoptosis/

Short answer:
Apoptosis:
By definition apoptosis is programmed cell death, is not related to the direct action of a pathogen:
Example: Cells that line the esophagus slough off and die every day. Dry skin flakes are another example. The cells are "programmed" to die. These kinds of tissues usually have an actively diving tissue underneath to replenish the lost cells. Cells that are undergoing apoptosis look different under the microscope from cells that are killed by pathogens.

Necrosis:
By definition necrosis is cell death brought on the action of a pathogen. Or by trauma, like direct physical tissue damage from an auto accident. Macrophages during an infection can also '"eat" surrounding healthy cells in infected tissue, an overreaction to pathogens. Or trigger the recruitment of other immune system cells that may do bad things. The cell detritus (junk) left over from necrosis is also an immune system trigger. Call it collateral damage if that helps.

Apoptosis may trigger separate components of the immune system for cell detritus cleanup.

So, we are back to the real issue: human definitions of Biological processes versus the real world where Nature does not read our textbooks. Darn it all. Definitions help us understand. But biological processes are not always black and white. And are not required to fit our definitions.
 
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  • #6
Astronuc
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As others have already indicated, apoptosis refers to the death of cells which occurs as a normal and controlled part of an organism's growth or development, i.e., the cell reaches the end of its useful/functional life, while necrosis refers to a form of cell injury which results in the premature death of cells in living tissue by autolysis. There is a difference in how the cells 'dies'. https://www.cureffi.org/2013/04/28/cell-biology-11-apoptosis-necrosis/ Apoptosis would seem an orderly and 'slow' process, compared to necrosis from infection or trauma.

I found several articles regarding phagocytosis, the process whereby phagocytes and macrophages clean up apototic and necrotic cells and pathogens.
https://www.nature.com/articles/4402184
https://www.nature.com/articles/4401900
https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fimmu.2018.00127/full
https://www.news-medical.net/life-s...yte-Macrophage-Neutrophil-and-Eosinophil.aspx

The concerns regarding SARS-CoV-2 are the damage to cells in the lung, which govern the respiratory process (exchange of oxygen and carbon dioxide), and the damage done to blood vessels and other organs in the body. With a virus, not only is there cell necrosis, but there are virions, which go one to infect other cells.
 
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