Regarding the current thread on something from nothing, or something eternal and the possibility of a third option. I felt that if I didnt start a specific thread on the third option, that my post would get buried. There is no third option. In my opinion, saying that there is a third option is like saying, when it comes to the natural numbers, that there is neither a finite number of them, nor an infinite number of them, but 'something else' in between. Or, conversely, that there is both an infinite number of them, and a finite number of them, and that is 'something else'. Can the possibilities for that 'something else' even be coherently described without calling it something blatently contradictory like 'there is a finite number of natural numbers that never end' or, 'there is an infinite number of natural numbers that eventually comes to an end'? Or consider two lines (on a plane, a sphere, or a torus, it doesnt matter) . . . either they intersect, or they dont. As far as I know there is no possible exception to that. Or how about a bit . . . either 1 or 0 . . . on or off. That has little to do with the topic, I know, but I think I made my point that suggesting that there is a third option to the universe being either temporal/finite or eternal/infinite is like suggesting that there is a third digit you will find in base 2 arithmitic if you just keep at it. Or that matter is neither discrete or continuous (that one is actually pretty fuzzy when you factor in particle/wave duality, so that one isnt quite so damning). Or that there is a mathematical operation that isnt ultimately an addition or subtraction of quantities . . . but 'something else'. Or . . . ok, now its just getting silly.