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Or, could it be Gore?

  1. Oct 11, 2007 #1

    Ivan Seeking

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    http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/10/10/politics/main3355237.shtml?source=mostpop_story

    I thought he was out for sure, but if Gore steps into the race, it could be all over. That solves the Hillary problem and easily trumps Edwards and Obama...and helps to draw the Southern vote.
     
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2007
  2. jcsd
  3. Oct 12, 2007 #2
    http://nobelprize.org/nobel_prizes/peace/laureates/2007/

    IPCC and Gore got it.

    "for their efforts to build up and disseminate greater knowledge about man-made climate change, and to lay the foundations for the measures that are needed to counteract such change"

    Sometimes I wonder if it is just spin. Getting an Oscar, then a NP (seems odd that climate data has something to do with peace).
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2007
  4. Oct 12, 2007 #3

    chemisttree

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    Maybe Hillary could run as VP with Gore! If that were come to pass, I'm sure his days would be numbered... and we would have our first woman president.

    Note to Al Gore... Stay away from convertibles!
     
  5. Oct 12, 2007 #4

    marcus

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    wrecking the planet has a lot in common with war

    I think it is an intelligent extension of Nobel's will, to put working to save the planet on par with working for peace.

    climate havoc can do a lot of the same things as war:
    spread disease
    cause famine
    trigger mass migration---provoke genocide
    destabilize societies/degrade cultures

    and climate shock can make it more likely that resource wars will break out

    I applaud the Peace Prize committee's interpretive extension. It recognizes something very important. I hope they continue to put saving the planet on the same plane as peace (both critically involve international trust and cooperation for common goals, and the restraint of aggressive greed). Hope they make it a Peace and Planet prize and continue awarding it to other leaders like Gore in the future.
     
  6. Oct 12, 2007 #5

    siddharth

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    IMO, while Gore did play an important role in raising awareness about climate change (especially in the US), it's nice that the contribution of the scientists, who reviewed and published the IPCC reports which gave the actual detailed evidence, was recognized.
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2007
  7. Oct 12, 2007 #6
    Way to go Al.
     
  8. Oct 12, 2007 #7

    Ivan Seeking

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    Congratulations to Al and the IPCC!

    First he helped to drive the "information super-highway" [that was his baby, which is what we are all using here today], and now a Nobel Prize for his efforts wrt climate change. Gore is a true visionary.
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2007
  9. Oct 12, 2007 #8
    Very sad and ludacris at the same time.
     
  10. Oct 12, 2007 #9

    marcus

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    That's right! He never claimed that he "invented" the internet, but he was the first leading politician to see the potential and get behind it. He spearheaded the political side of creating the internet. Two of the main architects acknowledged this in a statement that Wikipedia quotes (I expect you know the statemement IvanS, but for those who dont here it is)

    ...a CNN interview in which he said, "During my service in the United States Congress I took the initiative in creating the internet. I took the initiative in moving forward a whole range of initiatives that have proven to be important to our country's economic growth and environmental protection, improvements in our educational system."[88]

    In response to this controversy, Internet pioneers Vint Cerf and Bob Kahn wrote a 2000-09-29 article (originally sent via email) that described Gore's contributions to the Internet since the 1970s, including his work on the Gore Bill:[89]

    As the two people who designed the basic architecture and the core protocols that make the Internet work, we would like to acknowledge VP Gore's contributions as a Congressman, Senator and as Vice President. No other elected official, to our knowledge, has made a greater contribution over a longer period of time. Last year the Vice President made a straightforward statement on his role. He said: "During my service in the United States Congress I took the initiative in creating the Internet." We don't think, as some people have argued, that Gore intended to claim he "invented" the Internet. Moreover, there is no question in our minds that while serving as Senator, Gore's initiatives had a significant and beneficial effect on the still-evolving Internet. The fact of the matter is that Gore was talking about and promoting the Internet long before most people were listening. We feel it is timely to offer our perspective. As far back as the 1970s Congressman Gore promoted the idea of high speed telecommunications as an engine for both economic growth and the improvement of our educational system. He was the first elected official to grasp the potential of computer communications to have a broader impact than just improving the conduct of science and scholarship. Though easily forgotten, now, at the time this was an unproven and controversial concept.
     
  11. Oct 12, 2007 #10

    Ivan Seeking

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    Last edited: Oct 12, 2007
  12. Oct 12, 2007 #11

    Ivan Seeking

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    Sept. 23, 2002

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/transcripts/gore_text092302.html

    - Al Gore
     
  13. Oct 12, 2007 #12

    Art

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    His 'An Inconvenient Truth' might more aptly be named 'A Convenient Lie'

    'Friends of the Earth' or is that 'Enemies of the Truth' are disgusted that the high court in England during a hearing on whether it should be shown to school children has identified 9 deliberate untruths in his 'documentary' which the court determined must be pointed out to children if the film is shown. Needless to say the 'chicken littles' are disgusted; you can't tell school kids the truth and undo all their propaganda, don't people realise the lies are for their own good. :rolleyes:

    . http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/law/corporate_law/article2633838.ece

    Hence the need to bestow a nobel prize on him. If the facts won't support his credibility perhaps this honour will.

    Does the US really want yet another president with a proven track record of lying to the people in order to further his own agenda?
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2007
  14. Oct 12, 2007 #13

    Is there any proof that they were deliberate untruths?? Not hardly. Is a judge capable of intpreting the data? not hardly. Were their mistakes in the documentary?? Most likely.


    "As for the errors, Kreider said, "Of the thousands of facts, the judge seemingly only took issue with a handful. We've got peer review studies that back up those facts. There were a couple of cases where we feel the film wasn't quoted accurately."

    http://www.abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=3719791&page=1

    With some minor disclaimers the documentary was cleared for viewing by British students.

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21103729/
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2007
  15. Oct 12, 2007 #14

    Art

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    When Gore presents a documentary as scientifically proven fact then it is incumbent on him to ensure that his 'facts' are indeed facts.

    The judge made no personal intervention as to his own beliefs so it is very disingenuous to attack him to support a failed argument. He interpreted the facts as a matter of law. He tested the various claims against what the scientific community consider reasonable proof and found many claims severely wanting including some such as the link between CO2 and temp as outright misleading and the piece about polar bears drowning because of melting ice was a total fabrication. The only record of polar bears drowning in recent history was 4 who died in a storm!!

    The 9 instances the judge found very dubious do not even have the support of the mainstream climate change advocates. They were included only to sensationalise and frighten the public into behaving the way the makers of the documentary wanted.

    Anything about this strategy of 'the end justifies the means so it's okay to fix the evidence' sound familiar to you??
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2007
  16. Oct 12, 2007 #15

    russ_watters

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    Oh please - his influence on the early development of the internet is right up there with Bill Gates' (nonexistent).

    From that quote from the inventors of tcp/ip:
    Twice nothing is still nothing.

    Gore does have one major pro working for him, though: he's not Billary.
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2007
  17. Oct 12, 2007 #16

    BobG

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    Gore would still be a huge underdog to Clinton. She has too strong of a campaign staff and too big a head start in money. The strength of her campaign staff is the tougher obstacle - she isn't leaving any openings.

    I think the odds are too long for Gore to even enter the race. He has the status of an ex-President already, plus still has a chance to run again if there's a better opportunity in the future. Losing in the primaries would diminish the status of what he's already accomplished, plus pretty much end any ideas of a future run.

    As to Gore's "creating"/"inventing" the internet, the information superhighway is a pretty good analogy. Building/creating the US interstate highway system isn't the same as inventing roads, nor is "creating" the internet the same as inventing communication between computers. He did a lot to make it possible for the internet to grow very fast, so it's fair to say he played a significant part in the internet developing into what it is today, which is what I think he was actually claiming.
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2007
  18. Oct 12, 2007 #17

    Gees I know they have some natsy storms up there but this storm would have had to last for a month.




    http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article767459.ece
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2007
  19. Oct 12, 2007 #18

    Evo

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    I have to agree, Gore had nothing to do with the internet (which is run by businesses, not the government). Most people don't know that though.

    Uhm, talking about the internet. Yep, I wholeheartedly agree, that's the ONLY contribution he made to internet technology, he *talked about it*. :rolleyes: And he was pretty late to the game, at that.

    Judging from the negative feedback on the internet today and judging from the silence in this thread, (not many approve of the award, Ok it was a slow year and no viable nominees, better perhaps not to give one out? I agree with those that say this has lessened the meaning and purpose of the award) Gore is not a viable presidential candidate. Let's focus on viable candidates, throwing Gore into the muck is only going to cause more confusion among democrats and guarantee another loss.
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2007
  20. Oct 12, 2007 #19
    I would whole heartedly support him - as would the vast majority of people who call themselves liberals... that you would diminish his role in promoting a technology that was vastly expanded DUE to his lending his voice (read the article written by the architects of the net in his support for goodness sake) merely speaks of your bias against him - as does your diminishing of a nobel prize simply because it was awarded to him. Bringing about peace has more than one meaning - instead of supporting the oil tycoons he supports environmentalism - and you degrade him for it.
     
  21. Oct 12, 2007 #20

    Evo

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    They were just being pc to try to get Gore's foot out of his mouth, if you knew about the growth of the internet, you would know that. He did nothing to encourage businesses taking over the internet. You *do* know what the internet is, right? I was working with it at AT&T in 1973, before it was called the internet. (want to make clear, I was not working on the internet project, I was in data networking for them)
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2007
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