Understanding Phase Curves and Directionality in ODE Systems

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In summary, the conversation discusses finding the phase graph of a system of ODEs. The curves of x2 as a function of x1 are ellipses and the direction of the flow around the ellipse is being determined by analyzing the derivatives of x1 and x2. It is noted that in the first quadrant, the flow is clockwise due to a negative slope, but in the other quadrants, the direction is inconsistent. The question of how to determine if the flow is clockwise or counterclockwise based on the derivatives is also raised.
  • #1
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Well I need to find the phase graph of the next system of ode:
dx2/dt=-4x1
dx1/dt=x2
now i know the curves of x2 as a function of x1 are ellipses, but in what direction.
I mean obviously i need to check dx2/dx1, and from this find if x2 is decreasing or increasing, so for the first quadrant obviously it goes clockwise cause dx2/dx1<0 so x2 in this quadrant is decreasing, the same analysis i did with the other quadrants but shouldn't it have a consistent direction, I mean from my analysis not every part of the ellipse in every quadrant moves clockwise.

can this be ok?
or am i way off here?

thanks in advance.
 
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  • #2
What happens at the point (1, 0)? If x1= 1 and x2= 0, then dx2/dt= -4 and dx1/dt= 0: x2 is decreasing while x1 stays the same. That's going downward and indicates that the flow around the ellipse is clockwise.

Your statement "from my analysis not every part of the ellipse in every quadrant moves clockwise" is just wrong. if x1= 0 and x2= 1, dx2/dt= 0, dx1/dt= 1 so the flow is to the right: again clockwise. If x1= 0 and x2= -1, dx2/dt= 0, dx1/dt= -1: clockwise. If x1= -1 and x2= 0, dx2/dt= 4, dx1/dt= 0: clockwise.
 
  • #3
my way is like this:
dx2/dx1=-(4x1/x2) so for x1>0 and x2<0 dx2/dx1>0, so x2 should increase in this quadrant, should it not?

I hope you can clear this issue to me.
thanks in advance.
 
  • #4
loop quantum gravity said:
my way is like this:
dx2/dx1=-(4x1/x2) so for x1>0 and x2<0 dx2/dx1>0, so x2 should increase in this quadrant, should it not?

I hope you can clear this issue to me.
thanks in advance.

As x1 increases, yes x2 increases: the tangent line to the ellipse is increasing.
And as x1 decreases, x2 decreases.

But that's not the question! You are talking about what happens as t increases. In the fourth quadrant, both x1 and x2 decrease as t increases.

The flow around the ellipse is clockwise.
 
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  • #5
ok, thanks.
 
  • #6
i have another question:
how can i tell when it's counterclockwise or clockwise telling from those derivatives?
I mean in clockwise the angle which is also the slope is defined to be negative, i feel that i read it in courant's first volume of intro to clalc, but can't seem to remember.
 

What is a phase curve in ODE systems?

A phase curve in ODE systems is a plot of the solution trajectory of a system of ordinary differential equations (ODEs) in a phase space. It shows how the state variables of the system change over time, and how they are related to each other.

Why is understanding phase curves important in ODE systems?

Understanding phase curves is important in ODE systems because it allows us to visualize and analyze the behavior of the system. It helps us identify the stability of equilibrium points, determine the existence of limit cycles, and predict the long-term behavior of the system.

How is directionality represented in phase curves?

Directionality in phase curves is represented by the direction and slope of the trajectory of the solution. This is determined by the values of the state variables and the parameters in the ODE system. The direction of the trajectory indicates the direction in which the state variables are changing, while the slope represents the rate of change.

What factors can affect the directionality of phase curves in ODE systems?

The directionality of phase curves can be affected by various factors such as the initial conditions, the values of the parameters, and the form of the ODE system. Small changes in these factors can result in significantly different phase curves and can alter the behavior of the system.

How can we use phase curves to analyze and solve ODE systems?

Phase curves can be used to analyze and solve ODE systems by providing a visual representation of the behavior of the system. By examining the shape and directionality of the phase curves, we can identify the stability of equilibrium points and predict the long-term behavior of the system. This information can then be used to design control strategies or make predictions about the system's behavior under different conditions.

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