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News Presidents (or future presidents) religion, an effect on the election?

  1. Oct 27, 2004 #1
    Hi everyone, I'm new and just wanted to say hello before i got into this topic so...hi!

    I am sure many of you know that John F. Kennedy was the first and only (as of now) United States President that was Catholic. I too am Catholic (although not as involved as some members of my church) and, while I am an independent, for this election I support President Bush although it was very difficult for me to decide.
    The reason I made this thread is that when many people think conservative, they think Christian which is hard for me to understand for a few reasons.
    First, every president has been a type of Protestant with the exception of JFK, and although I dont know the number, several were democrats. How then does this fit into the stereotyping that says most christians are conservative?

    Also, many Catholics dissaprove of John Kerry. This is simply because although he is Catholic, he doesnt really support or live out the religion. I considered him a good candidate until recently when I really looked into the election and saw more specifically what he is for and although I never let religion dictate my political decisions, I could not help but notice that he seems to contradict his religion. Just thought it was interesting and wanted to see what you all thought of it :smile:
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  3. Oct 27, 2004 #2


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    Bush is the first president, at least since the nineteenth century, to speak about having the direct support of God. To this, a lot of people can't decide which is worse, if he's lying about it or if he isn't.
  4. Oct 27, 2004 #3
    Being a Catholic yourself ... isn't Bush a man of the aggressive Old Testament (a eye for an eye), and not of the New Testament (Jesus)? Isn't Bush promoting revenge and shows a history of death and death penalties (as Governor of Texas). You really consider him an honest Catholic or Christian? Can you show one single point where he applies the ideas of Jesus?
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2004
  5. Oct 27, 2004 #4
    Welcome to PF!

    Personally, I wouldn't let that bother me. A LOT of Catholics, dare I say, the majority, don't believe in and/or practice 100% of the church's teachings. There are some who are even trying to get Kerry excommunicated from the church. I think if they do this, they might as well do this to every Catholic who isn't following the catechism word for word. Look at a candidate's policy and not religion.
  6. Oct 27, 2004 #5
    Bush is not Catholic.
  7. Oct 27, 2004 #6
    Yes I realized after my post, so I edited. Our posts crossed.But he calls himself a Christian.
  8. Oct 27, 2004 #7
    Godless?? My last, best effort to save Adjoint's soul - by changing his vote.

    Cut up your volume, grab a tissue, and click the link.

    Last edited: Oct 27, 2004
  9. Oct 27, 2004 #8


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    That's the biggest load of crap I've seen today. Congrats. :grumpy:

    After this post, I'm considering voluntarily moving from the United States (if Bush does get re-elected). This is the only land where a president who claims to be a cowboy (insulting himself at the same time) and has an IQ that a 2 year old can count to, can become the leader of.

    See, this is the thing. Christians are favoring the guy because he says he is a Christian. Wait, maybe if I go around advertising that I was a drunk, and found my way to the Christian God - I can become President. If I could become the President that way, I certainly would.

    If Americans do continue to favour this sort of thing, it'll prove that we are regressing in our evolution. :uhh:
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2004
  10. Oct 27, 2004 #9
    Thanks :smile:
  11. Oct 27, 2004 #10
    President Bush isnt catholic and, no he is hardly an image of God but religion doesnt really effect my outlook on politics, this topic was soley to discuss whether the religion of the candidates might effect the outcome and a little other information I decided to put up. Although I'm not sure if John Kerry is still going by this (I'm not trying to joke or harass him, i really cant keep up with the constant changes) but he was for abortion at one point, along with gay marriage (at one point) and will most likely not support Israel in the future, whereas Bush does not support these things. Now its true that gay marriage is not in the bible and personally I'm not completely against it, yet the church has spoken against it yet kerry support(s/ed) it. Abortion is against what the church says yet he is for it. Plus as I was mentioning before, Bush is least likely to go against Israel, which if you happened to read on clintons early years where it was mentioned a few times or if you read a book entitled American Prophesies (I believe thats the correct title) you would know that Bill Clintons pastor said the words "You will make mistakes, and God will forgive you. But if you ever go against the state of Israel, God will never forgive you."
    A few years later Clinton practically forced palestinian and Israeli leaders (Arafat and Israels prime minister before Areil) to shake hands and agree to a peace treatment. In the following months surprise suicide bombings killed thousands in Israel, which broke the short lived peace treaty.

    Its odd how often religion and politics continuously become intertwined.

    Thank you for the welcome! Yes I heard about the attempts at getting kerry excommunicated which I also think is rediculous.
  12. Oct 28, 2004 #11


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    The whole deal, his evangelical stance and the mistakes his administration made about Iraq raises lots of uncomfortable questions.

    Has the Bush administration been incompetent planners (the plan for Phase IV - Stabilization of post-War Iraq To Be Provided rumor, for example) or are we 'misunderestimating' Bush? Is this really bumbling or is Iraq really part of a war on Islam, itself?

    Either way, there's too many unanswerable questions to have any idea what Bush does next.
  13. Oct 28, 2004 #12


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    I agree that the majority of catholics don't practice the churches teachings. I think it's something like 70% use unacceptable birth control methods etc. but just to keep things on a relevent, factual basis....the catholic law that Kerry's excommunication would be based upon has nothing to do with "following the catechism word for word" it has to do specificly with abortion and the level of direct support and contribution to abortion. I think we delved into specifics in an earlier thread so...don't let me derail this one but I did want to clarify that.
  14. Oct 28, 2004 #13


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  15. Oct 28, 2004 #14
    Thanks kat. Yes, I was aware that Kerry’s support for ‘pro-choice’ is the basis for the whole excommunication suggestion. I guess I shouldn’t have suggested that a less than total following of the Catechism should be grounds for excommunication.
  16. Oct 28, 2004 #15


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    I think the stereotype is slightly misdirected: its the level of faith that is the key. And though I don't have the stats to back this up, it seems that conservatives are more likely to strictly adhere to their religion. Kerry and Bush both fit (opposite sides) of that.
  17. Oct 28, 2004 #16

    True. Its weird how earlier in the year Bush got a little respect for being a more religious president, and a lot of criticism. I wonder how Kerry would have been treated.
  18. Oct 29, 2004 #17


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    Well, Kerry's getting both too.
  19. Oct 29, 2004 #18

    Ivan Seeking

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    That about covers it. Tsu and I have a family member who is a [more, was a] fundamentalist Christian. Her faith was seriously challenged as she learned about extreme, fundamentalist Islamic groups - terrorist. She commented to me one day that "they sound just like us". She couldn't understand how people having such a deep faith in God could be so evil.
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