Dismiss Notice
Join Physics Forums Today!
The friendliest, high quality science and math community on the planet! Everyone who loves science is here!

Quantum communication

  1. Mar 5, 2010 #1
    In a previous post I discussed the idea of an intelligent universe but realized from your responses that communication faster than the speed of light is impossible. I got to thinking about that and thought what about worm holes. Worm holes can pass information across the universe faster than the speed of light. Then I thought can quantum tunneling be used to pass information across the universe. If information can pass through tiny worm holes into other parts of the universe then there is communication faster then the speed of light.

    Tell me where I'm wrong.
  2. jcsd
  3. Mar 5, 2010 #2
    I know absolutely nothing about this topic, but it seems that there is a shift in instances. Like one instant it is here, and the next it is very far away. Its not like the speed of that object or information ever exceeded the speed of light, i view it as more of a teleportation type of thing.
  4. Mar 5, 2010 #3
    I dont think worm holes allow for things to move faster than the speed of light, it connects regions of space that are far apart on a linear (curved) scale to be in close proximity to one another, like a short cut. Something like this:

    http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/9432/24674506.jpg [Broken]

    Thus, in this example, it should take 3 light years to go from point A to point B following the blue line which is the predicted path based on space curvature. If a worm hole is available, it will take only 1 light year (as an example). Thus, one may think that information was violated because the observer at Point B assumed that information traveled at three times the speed of light (3C). But in reality, it travel at the speed of light through a short cut giving only the impression to the observer that it traveled at 3C.
    Last edited by a moderator: May 4, 2017
  5. Mar 5, 2010 #4
    But aren't worm holes singularities? What are the rules for the speed of light in a singularity?
    Last edited by a moderator: May 4, 2017
  6. Mar 5, 2010 #5
    i thought they were short cuts through spacetime, not singularities.
  7. Mar 5, 2010 #6
    I'm not positive if a worm hole is or isn't a singularity, but it wouldn't matter in any case. A singularity in this context is a break down of mathematical formula that leads to non-defined behavior.. It does not say anything about a worm hole per se, but rather our mathematical understanding of one. The idea being that we would one day have a more complete formula that would lead to a non-singularity based understanding of a worm hole (or the big bang, or a black hole, etc).

    In other words, a singularity is more a lack of information as opposed to a defined idea, and since our math breaks down at this point it would be quite difficult to discuss the speed of light under those circumstances.
  8. Mar 6, 2010 #7
    Assuming they exist. It's quite possible that wormholes can't exist in the universe.

    No it can't. It turns out that whenever someone thinks of some clever way of passing information through quantum tunnelling, it turns out not to work.

    *If* :-) :-) :-)
  9. Mar 6, 2010 #8
    I understand that my hypothesis is highly speculative. I'm just merging the Einstein-Rosen tunnel theory and quantum weirdness and proposing a space-time fabric with tiny tunnels to other parts of the universe. Who knows how weird nature is?

    Here's something more weird, is it possible that gravity is so weak because it "leaks" through all those tiny tunnels?
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2010
  10. Mar 6, 2010 #9
    Don’t try to out-weird me, three eyes. I get weirder things than you in my breakfast cereal. – Zaphod Beeblebrox, H2G2.

    People have thought of doing this before. The trouble is that you don't get anything useful out of it. One problem is that in order to replicate the experimental results, you have to assume that there is a wormhole between every particle in the universe and every other particle in the universe.

    Also there is no such thing as "wormhole theory." Whether space-time tunnels are even *possible* is an active area of mathematical research. No one has come up with a usable tunnel, while at the same time no one has come up with a mathematical proof that usable wormholes are impossible.

    One big. big problem in explaining weirdness is explaining *non weirdness*. Trying to explain why we aren't getting messages from the future and coming up with a physical theory in which you *don't* constantly see weird things turns out to be non-trivial.

    The trouble with weird explanations is that not everything is weird. Whether it's possible or not to send messages back in time under extreme situations is unknown, but what is obvious is that it's not possible to *routinely* send messages back in time or faster than light. It's pretty easy to come up with a weird theory. It's really, really difficult to come up with a theory that doesn't cause total weirdness, and is "non-weird" when it has to be.

    Yes it's possible. Lot's of things are possible. But to go from a possibility to an argument that people will accept is hard. You not only have to show that it's *possible* but also that it happens.

    Also one problem with trying to come up with weird theories, is that it's quite difficult to come up with an *original* weird theory. For example the idea that gravity is weak because it leaks through tunnels in space-time isn't particularly original. One idea is that gravity is weak because it interacts through higher dimensions


    The hard part isn't coming up with the weird idea, but coming up with a way of testing that idea. In the case of extra dimensions, it means that if you hit two particles at each other real hard, some of the energy will go into the extra dimensions creating a particle jet.
Share this great discussion with others via Reddit, Google+, Twitter, or Facebook