Dealing with Road Rage: Coasting Up to Red Lights

[fuzzyfelt]

I find that often a turning lane opens up close to the traffic lights, and although the main lights are red the turning arrow is green and coasters sometimes don't consider those behind that may wish to catch the green arrow to turn. Other than that, I find most traffic around me very considerate. I like this song, and often find it rather apt.

 

[OmCheeto]

I find that often a turning lane opens up close to the traffic lights, and although the main lights are red the turning arrow is green and coasters sometimes don't consider those behind that may wish to catch the green arrow to turn. Other than that, I find most traffic around me very considerate. I like this song, and often find it rather apt.

Actually, the above is one of several instances where I will adjust my driving habits.
1. Someone behind wants to make the green left turn. Maintain velocity until the last moment to facilitate their move. Forcing someone to sit at a light is a greater waste than the nano ounce of gas you'll save by coasting.
2. A vehicle of larger mass pulls up behind me as the light turns green. Accelerate to minimize the larger vehicles loss of kinetic energy.

The highway is a system, and overall losses should be minimized, regardless of how cheap I am.

But when traffic is bumper to bumper, I see no legitimate reason to let sociopathic drivers in front of me, and feel no remorse nor guilt when they rear end someone in the next lane because they were too busy looking and cursing at me for "cutting them off" to notice that their line of traffic had stopped.

Nice song by the way.

We should have more music.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BsqlDQKaMAU"

 

[leroyjenkens]

I'm seeing a pattern here. I think you need to start using the gas pedal a little more. I do that on the on ramps too, when the moron in front of me isn't accelerating up to a reasonable speed to merge. When you reach the end of the ramp, you should be going the speed of traffic you're merging with. If you haven't stepped on the gas hard enough, you're again making others slow down for you and making it more dangerous for the people behind you to find their opening...or making it more likely they'll just slam into you if they're trying to watch the openings in traffic and you're not accelerating as you should be.

I'll elaborate more on what I meant. When you're in the merging lane, waiting for a car to pass before you get on the highway, the car that's behind you has an opening before you do. The car passes him before it passes you. He uses that opportunity to try to pass YOU. That's just inconsiderate.

 

[BobG]

The simpler solution is to just stomp on the gas, accelerating to a speed that turns the red lights green due to Doppler shift.

 

[BobG]

I learned to drive in a standard transmission car by my mother. She would put a glass (three quarters full) of water on the dash. I learned to drive such that it would not spill.
:)

My mom used to do this, except with a cup of hot coffee. With seven kids in the car, the youngest used to wind up sitting in the middle of the front seat. If he screamed, my mom knew she'd stepped on the gas a little too hard.

Actually, she was a little more coordinated than that. We used to have a cinder Y driveway, with my dad's car on one side of the Y and my mom's on the other. With seven kids in the car on schoolday mornings, my mom had to release a little frustration, so would spin the tires as she backed up from her side of the Y to my dad's side of the Y, slam on the brakes and neatly snatch the sliding cup of coffee, then spin the tires as she drove down the driveway. All frustration having been burnt off, she was able to slow down to a safe speed by the end of the driveway and drove safely to school the rest of the way (except for the morning she forgot to check the passenger side mirror and made a right turn in front of a shocked bicycle rider).

Then my dad started carpooling and his car suddenly started appearing on his side of the Y at the exact same time we were leaving for school. Things suddenly got very hairy ... for my little brother, at least - the rest of us kids thought it was hilarious (even though a little painful, since we didn't dare laugh or even smirk out loud).

(By the way, this was the same little brother that went through most of his childhood with no 'M' encyclopedia. His childhood sucked. In fact, I think it's more than coincidence that he never had any children of his own.)

 

[Chi Meson]

Well, you've run rings around me logically now 'aven't you?

Intercourse the penguin!

 

[DaveC426913]

(By the way, this was the same little brother that went through most of his childhood with no 'M' encyclopedia.

For our younger members:

An 'encyclopedia' is a Wikipedia published in book form.

Hm.

A 'book' is a website that has been burned onto paper.

Ah...

'Paper' is...

...


Oh go text your parents about it.

 

[fuzzyfelt]

Actually, the above is one of several instances where I will adjust my driving habits.
1. Someone behind wants to make the green left turn. Maintain velocity until the last moment to facilitate their move. Forcing someone to sit at a light is a greater waste than the nano ounce of gas you'll save by coasting.
2. A vehicle of larger mass pulls up behind me as the light turns green. Accelerate to minimize the larger vehicles loss of kinetic energy.

The highway is a system, and overall losses should be minimized, regardless of how cheap I am.

But when traffic is bumper to bumper, I see no legitimate reason to let sociopathic drivers in front of me, and feel no remorse nor guilt when they rear end someone in the next lane because they were too busy looking and cursing at me for "cutting them off" to notice that their line of traffic had stopped.

Nice song by the way.

We should have more music.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BsqlDQKaMAU"

Agreed!
That was a good youtube, thanks Om.

Burma

 

[BobG]

I also take my foot off the gas as soon as I see a stop light in front of me (that I won't make it through) turn yellow, even if I'm still a quarter mile from it, but I've never had someone go around me to beat me to the light.

Really? I want to move to your town. It happens to me all the time. I've even had a guy behind me right on my butt when I was coasting up to a train crossing. The train was obviously there and a big line of cars was there, but I was coasting up to it and I looked in my rear view mirror and this guy is flipping out in his car because I'm going so slow. So when he finds an oppening, he speeds up around me about 50 MPH all the way up to the line of cars, then stops. About 30 seconds later, I coast up right beside him.
What did he accomplish? Well I guess he got me back for making him have to go slow. He sped around me really fast and that gets back at me somehow.

This is why most people should keep on living on the East coast or the West coast. They're crazy.

Living in the Midwest is much more relaxing in lots of ways and driving is one of them. Some people are actually courteous even when they're in their cars.

There are exceptions where it makes sense to pass someone just to get in front of them before a stop light. There might not be an immediate gain, but both adjacent lanes are going to fill up with traffic at a stop light. If you wait to pass, you're still stuck behind a slow driver, but now with no opportunity to pass. Realistically, an opportunity to pass is an opportunity to pass - if the driver ahead of you has already shown they're going to drive slower than you, then you take advantage of it (this isn't the case when a driver is coasting towards a light and will almost certainly speed back up once the light turns green).

 

[leroyjenkens]

There are exceptions where it makes sense to pass someone just to get in front of them before a stop light. There might not be an immediate gain, but both adjacent lanes are going to fill up with traffic at a stop light. If you wait to pass, you're still stuck behind a slow driver, but now with no opportunity to pass. Realistically, an opportunity to pass is an opportunity to pass - if the driver ahead of you has already shown they're going to drive slower than you, then you take advantage of it (this isn't the case when a driver is coasting towards a light and will almost certainly speed back up once the light turns green).

That's what happens a lot on my 30 minute drive from work. Someone will be behind me coasting up to a red light, they'll think that's how fast I go all the time, they'll get in the other lane, I'll speed up and get pretty far ahead and then they'll get back in my lane behind me, or behind a few cars that got directly behind me when he moved.

I'm just really sick of bad/crazy drivers. I was watching Trauma: Life in the ER yesterday night and even if I didn't hear what happened to the person, when I hear their injuries, like torn aortas, I know it was a car accident. People go to great lengths to just get a few yards closer to their destination, endangering entire families with their stunts they pull on the road and I refuse to accommodate them.

 

[DaveC426913]

... when I hear their injuries, like torn aortas, I know it was a car accident. People go to great lengths to just get a few yards closer to their destination, endangering entire families with their stunts they pull on the road and I refuse to accommodate them.

This is a generalization and far too broad a brush-stroke. You've gone from your behaviour on the road to presuming how everyone else behaves and why they behave that way and what you think happens to them.

 

[leroyjenkens]

This is a generalization and far too broad a brush-stroke. You've gone from your behaviour on the road to presuming how everyone else behaves and why they behave that way and what you think happens to them.

I'm just making the generalization that drivers who take risks and drive recklessly cause accidents. I think that's fair.

 

[DaveC426913]

I'm just making the generalization that drivers who take risks and drive recklessly cause accidents. I think that's fair.

Yes but your premise does not lead to this. Driving up to a stoplight instead of coasting has nothing to do with taking risks or driving recklessly. Essentially what you've committed is the logical fallacy of "straw man". (Or is it "red herring"? I always forget the difference...)

 

[leroyjenkens]

Yes but your premise does not lead to this. Driving up to a stoplight instead of coasting has nothing to do with taking risks or driving recklessly. Essentially what you've committed is the logical fallacy of "straw man". (Or is it "red herring"? I always forget the difference...)

I also mentioned their "stunts". How is driving up to a stoplight a stunt?

 

[DaveC426913]

I also mentioned their "stunts". How is driving up to a stoplight a stunt?

Uh. Right. That too. So, three ways you've made a non sequitur between your premise and your conclusion.

 

[Sorry!]

I'm just making the generalization that drivers who take risks and drive recklessly cause accidents. I think that's fair.

I have already stated anyways that it is people who drive as YOU are the main cause of a lot of accidents. On the highway in the city everywhere.

The way you're coming off to me right now is quite arrogant and selfish.

You're one person and you're saying that you're not going to accommodate everyone else on the road because of a few accidents you saw on a T.V. show (which you don't even know if it was from a car accident you pressume so based on the injuries?)

It's the rest of the drivers on the road that are forced to accommodate you whether they are driving around you or slowing down behind you they are still forced to accommodate your rediculous driving habit.

 

[leroyjenkens]

Uh. Right. That too. So, three ways you've made a non sequitur between your premise and your conclusion.

Why is my premise automatically stuck on people who simply don't slow down up to a red light? We've been talking about all kinds of traffic related problems we have throughout the entire thread, yet you're holding me to one specific thing that none of my other posts can slightly divert from.
But regardless, the original post was about a guy who cut me off really fast. I guess you don't see that as dangerous.

I have already stated anyways that it is people who drive as YOU are the main cause of a lot of accidents. On the highway in the city everywhere.

That's great. You can state you're the president of the united states, that doesn't make it true.
The main cause of accidents are careful drivers and not drunk or reckless drivers. Ok buddy, whatever you say.

The way you're coming off to me right now is quite arrogant and selfish.

You're one person and you're saying that you're not going to accommodate everyone else on the road because of a few accidents you saw on a T.V. show (which you don't even know if it was from a car accident you pressume so based on the injuries?)

It's the rest of the drivers on the road that are forced to accommodate you whether they are driving around you or slowing down behind you they are still forced to accommodate your rediculous driving habit.

I'm coming off arrogant and selfish because I won't accommodate what I deem as reckless driving, yet those other people aren't arrogant and selfish for not accomodating anyone else? It amazes me that you don't see how that should go both ways.
So how fast you should be going is now dictated by how fast the guy behind you wants to go?
You tell me what I should do. Should I just floor it up to the red light so I can appease the impatiant guy behind me, since me going 5-10 MPH slower on the way up to a red light is apparently the end of the world? That's what it sounds like.
I'm arrogant and selfish because I don't want to speed up to a red light, which forces people behind me not to speed up to a red light? That doesn't even come close to making sense. That's just a complete miss.

I have a ridiculous driving habit? That just seems like a baseless cheapshot. You didn't even bother to elaborate what's ridiculous about it. Saving money is ridiculous? That's brilliant logic right there.
Why are you getting hostile? I can only conclude you're the type of driver that we're all complaining about, since you're suddenly getting so defensive about it.
Sorry I think people should be more careful than they are driving a giant metal weapon.

 

[Sorry!]

That's great. You can state you're the president of the united states, that doesn't make it true.
The main cause of accidents are careful drivers and not drunk or reckless drivers. Ok buddy, whatever you say.

I'm coming off arrogant and selfish because I won't accommodate what I deem as reckless driving, yet those other people aren't arrogant and selfish for not accomodating anyone else? It amazes me that you don't see how that should go both ways.
So how fast you should be going is now dictated by how fast the guy behind you wants to go?
You tell me what I should do. Should I just floor it up to the red light so I can appease the impatiant guy behind me, since me going 5-10 MPH slower on the way up to a red light is apparently the end of the world? That's what it sounds like.
I'm arrogant and selfish because I don't want to speed up to a red light, which forces people behind me not to speed up to a red light? That doesn't even come close to making sense. That's just a complete miss.

I have a ridiculous driving habit? That just seems like a baseless cheapshot. You didn't even bother to elaborate what's ridiculous about it. Saving money is ridiculous? That's brilliant logic right there.
Why are you getting hostile? I can only conclude you're the type of driver that we're all complaining about, since you're suddenly getting so defensive about it.
Sorry I think people should be more careful than they are driving a giant metal weapon.

Who is drunk and how is driving PROPERLY reckless? Driving IMPROPERlY is reckless, everyone on the road expects you to drive properly so they can anticipate what you will do. If you're randomly coasting to a stop from way out no, your not driving properly. It doesn't matter if you're saving money protecting the forest or the bears; it's all about safe-driving.

Where are you from I might add because if you drive slowly as you've been saying you will get pulled over and given a ticket where I'm from (around Toronto).
You may not believe it, or want to poke fun at it by trying to make it look like I'm lying but that's the facts.

As well no I wouldn't consider myself a reckless driver as I don't even drive. Nice try on the 'your only defensive because you do it.' As well I can speak my opinion here since I have friends who are currently in police foundations, friends who have already graduated police foundations, and friends who are part of the police force. As well this exact topic (people driving slowly) came up in one of my law class debates.

 

[TurtleMeister]

I've never seen minimum speed limits posted for streets with red lights. I think that aggressive driving is far more of a safety issue than is driving too slow (on these types of roads).

http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/people/injury/enforce/aggressdrivers/aggenforce/define.html

Some behaviors typically associated with aggressive driving include: exceeding the posted speed limit, following too closely, erratic or unsafe lane changes, improperly signaling lane changes, failure to obey traffic control devices (stop signs, yield signs, traffic signals, railroad grade cross signals, etc.).

It's very annoying when I encounter drivers who zigzag in and out of lanes just to gain a few car lengths. Really, how much difference will it make in the time it takes for them to reach their destination? However, it is also annoying when I encounter drivers who are driving too slow. But this is not unsafe, unless I make it unsafe by doing the things listed in the above quote.

 

[Sorry!]

I've never seen minimum speed limits posted for streets with red lights. I think that aggressive driving is far more of a safety issue than is driving too slow (on these types of roads).

http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/people/injury/enforce/aggressdrivers/aggenforce/define.htmlIt's very annoying when I encounter drivers who zigzag in and out of lanes just to gain a few car lengths. Really, how much difference will it make in the time it takes for them to reach their destination? However, it is also annoying when I encounter drivers who are driving too slow. But this is not unsafe, unless I make it unsafe by doing the things listed in the above quote.

I'm pretty sure it's called impeding traffic. If you cause yourself to become an obstacle to other cares and impede the flow of traffic you can get a ticket.

I've looked it up not only is it something that the OPP/regional ontario police forces enforces it is also found all over the states mostly for the highways but it doesn't mean the law isn't there for in cities/towns it only means that the police of these areas are less likely to enforce it.

 

[TurtleMeister]

Yes, I can agree that if you make yourself an obstacle for no reason then that is a problem. You just have to use some common sense. A guy slowing down or drifting to a red light is not impeding traffic. Look at it this way, if you rear end the guy who do you think will get the ticket? If you race to get around him and cause an accident, who do you think will get the ticket? I don't think making the claim that the other guy was impeding traffic will work as your defense.

 

[TheStatutoryApe]

I'm coming off arrogant and selfish because I won't accommodate what I deem as reckless driving... ?

Driving properly requires that you "accommodate" poor drivers. That does not mean that you ought to drive improperly yourself of course, there are other ways of preventing issues. If you have people continually champing at the bit and swerving around you at high speeds when you are coasting at below the speed limit then maybe you should speed up a bit. I coast up to red lights as well but I normally drive at or just above the speed limit and my car stays at about the speed limit as I coast to the light. It may start dropping off more when I am nearly at the light. Personally my car does not like to accelerate from a slow coast so I always try to make sure that I am either at a complete stop or still at a decent clip before the light changes. I do not generally have people swerving to get around me except the crazies driving 90+ on the freeways.

Its the responsibility of everyone on the road to prevent accidents not just to drive as they see fit, including those who see fit simply to drive by the rules. If you say to yourself "well I'm driving properly and they are not so if they get in an accident it will be their fault" then you are not thinking properly. Yeah, if they plow into your car or side swipe you while driving stupid then it is their fault. But you will still have a wrecked car in the shop and possibly injuries. Is being able to say you were driving properly and its all their fault going to erase that? So if you can reasonably (<---before you choose to respond to this please remember this word) change your driving habits to accommodate these people and so reduce the likelihood of an accident would that not be better than being in a hospital and being able to say that it was supposedly all their fault?

Some behaviors typically associated with aggressive driving include: exceeding the posted speed limit, following too closely, erratic or unsafe lane changes, improperly signaling lane changes, failure to obey traffic control devices (stop signs, yield signs, traffic signals, railroad grade cross signals, etc.).

When you are driving the speed limit and the person in front of you is driving bellow the speed limit you are likely to wind up rather close to their bumper before you are able to adjust your speed properly for a safe following distance unless of course you just slam on your brakes and come quickly to a slower speed which is at least as unsafe as following closely behind someone. And if this person is going to slow for your taste and you decide to get around them your now slower speed due to being behind someone driving under the speed limit makes your lane change into a lane with traffic going at the speed limit (probably also with the people approaching behind you changes lanes to not be behind the slow person) inherently less unsafe.

 

[leroyjenkens]

Who is drunk and how is driving PROPERLY reckless?

You said people who drive like me are the main cause of a lot of accidents. Do you have any stats to back that up, or do you just say stuff like that for effect?

Driving IMPROPERlY is reckless, everyone on the road expects you to drive properly so they can anticipate what you will do. If you're randomly coasting to a stop from way out no, your not driving properly. It doesn't matter if you're saving money protecting the forest or the bears; it's all about safe-driving.

If I take my foot off the gas at a stop light, it's not random, is it? Yes, "randomly" taking my foot off the gas and coasting would be improper. But since I don't do that, I'm not driving improperly.

Where are you from I might add because if you drive slowly as you've been saying you will get pulled over and given a ticket where I'm from (around Toronto).

Florida.
I never said I drive slow. Where are you pulling that from? And even if I did drive slow, if I'm not driving under the minimum, there's no reason I would get a ticket.
But if I go to Toronto, I'll remember not to drive slow. As ambiguous a statement as that is, I appreciate it.

You may not believe it, or want to poke fun at it by trying to make it look like I'm lying but that's the facts.

Well I believe you, there's minimum speed limits. But what exactly would the cop be pulling you over for if you're not going below the minimum? Is there a minimum speed limit in Toronto, or do you not know what the minimum is until you get a ticket for it?

As well no I wouldn't consider myself a reckless driver as I don't even drive. Nice try on the 'your only defensive because you do it.'

I'm not trying to insult you, but you seemed to get defensive and really adamant about it. And saying my driving style is ridiculous, without even giving me a reason why.

As well I can speak my opinion here since I have friends who are currently in police foundations, friends who have already graduated police foundations, and friends who are part of the police force. As well this exact topic (people driving slowly) came up in one of my law class debates.

You can speak your opinion regardless of all that. I welcome anyone's opinion. But it seemed rather irrational to say my driving style is ridiculous when I believe it's completely logical. Could you explain why you think it's ridiculous?
Ridiculous is a strong word. By saying it's ridiculous, that's implying my driving style is completely backwards and needs an overhaul to rectify it. Or were you just saying that for effect?

I'm pretty sure it's called impeding traffic. If you cause yourself to become an obstacle to other cares and impede the flow of traffic you can get a ticket.

If you going the minimum impedes traffic, then they need to increase the minimum. It's as simple as that. It's the burden of the city to fix that problem, not you.

Driving properly requires that you "accommodate" poor drivers. That does not mean that you ought to drive improperly yourself of course, there are other ways of preventing issues. If you have people continually champing at the bit and swerving around you at high speeds when you are coasting at below the speed limit then maybe you should speed up a bit.

I don't go much below the speed limit when coasting up to the red light. I know some of you are picturing me poking along at 10 MPH. If the speed limit is 45, I don't even get down to 30 before hitting the light. That's not slow enough to warrant some of the behavior I've seen.

But why is it my responsibility to speed up when someone wants to speed around me recklessly? I could speed up and people would still be doing it.

I coast up to red lights as well but I normally drive at or just above the speed limit and my car stays at about the speed limit as I coast to the light.

I do too. It's just that I know the timing of the lights on my way home from work, so if I'm 100 yards from this specific light, I know I can take my foot off the gas and about the time I reach it, it'll be turning green. I don't get down too slow, but normally people go about 10-15 MPH above the speed limit, so of course that's too slow for them.

Its the responsibility of everyone on the road to prevent accidents not just to drive as they see fit, including those who see fit simply to drive by the rules. If you say to yourself "well I'm driving properly and they are not so if they get in an accident it will be their fault" then you are not thinking properly. Yeah, if they plow into your car or side swipe you while driving stupid then it is their fault. But you will still have a wrecked car in the shop and possibly injuries. Is being able to say you were driving properly and its all their fault going to erase that? So if you can reasonably (<---before you choose to respond to this please remember this word) change your driving habits to accommodate these people and so reduce the likelihood of an accident would that not be better than being in a hospital and being able to say that it was supposedly all their fault?

You're completely right. And I do a lot of things that prevent accidents. Like if I'm about to change lanes and I see in my rear view mirror some maniac coming up behind me about 100 MPH and changing lanes, I'll just stay in my lane and let that guy pass. Legally I could just let him hit me or cause a huge accident with someone else and it wouldn't be my fault, but I don't want to deal with that. I'd rather just honk my horn and call him some names.
I've also been forced to run red lights because as I'm coming up to the light, a guy is like 2 inches from my bumper. If I stopped, he would hit me. They intimidate me into running it, which of course, they do too. I could have stopped and caused an accident, but again, I don't want to deal with that.
That's one reason cops need to crack down on tailgaters. Speeding is looked at as like the number one thing cops will give you a ticket for, but sometimes speeding isn't really that big of a deal. If you've got an open road and you go like 60 in a 45, that's not NEARLY as dangerous as tailgaters and those people who change lanes 2 inches from your bumper while speeding up behind you.

When you are driving the speed limit and the person in front of you is driving bellow the speed limit you are likely to wind up rather close to their bumper before you are able to adjust your speed properly for a safe following distance unless of course you just slam on your brakes and come quickly to a slower speed which is at least as unsafe as following closely behind someone. And if this person is going to slow for your taste and you decide to get around them your now slower speed due to being behind someone driving under the speed limit makes your lane change into a lane with traffic going at the speed limit (probably also with the people approaching behind you changes lanes to not be behind the slow person) inherently less unsafe.

You can see when you're coming up on someone who is going slower than you. It's not like you can only recognize their speed when you get 10 inches from their bumper.
That's what I hate, people come speeding up behind me going over the speed limit, then slow down really quickly right before they smack into me. They saw my car there, but to me it looks like they tried to intimidate me into going faster, or to make me change lanes.
But that's the thing, some people will speed up behind you and right before they hit you, they change lanes. How do I know who is and who isn't going to do that? So if I change lanes for this guy speeding up behind me, he may change lanes too, thinking I'm going to stay in that other lane.
People, inexplicably, don't realize that other drivers don't know their intentions. For instance, sometimes I'll be merging onto a highway and someone will give me like 2 inches to get in. I don't know his intentions, so I'm wary of getting over until he sits there for a few seconds indicating he's not trying to speed past me.
I'm a courteous driver, so I give people like 10 feet to get in, so they know my intentions.

 

[BobG]

everyone on the road expects you to drive properly so they can anticipate what you will do.

The communication part of driving is the key. It's the reason for a lot of our traffic laws. Everyone knows who gets to go first, and who has to yield, etc. Just remember that the intent of the laws are more important than the laws themselves.

If you're driving the speed limit in the left lane of the interstate, it's you that's doing something that other drivers don't anticipate. If you stop at a yellow light in Monday morning rush hour traffic, expect to hear cars skidding behind you as all 20 cars behind you are in total shock at what you just did.

There's two parts to learning how to drive: learn the laws; learn the local driving rythyms. They don't always coincide and obnoxiously taking the position that every other driver is wrong for failing to anticipate that there might be one driver that adheres religiously to the law is driving improperly.

That has little to do with the original post, since typing what a person does at stoplights isn't sufficient to give a good picture. Passing at a stop light could be a reasonable action or an unreasonable action. There isn't enough info to tell.

None the less, the frequency of problems a driver has is an indication of whether he's driving 'properly'. Infrequent problems are due to jerks that fail to fit into the local traffic environment. Frequent problems are an indication that you might be the jerk.

 

[leroyjenkens]

If you're driving the speed limit in the left lane of the interstate, it's you that's doing something that other drivers don't anticipate.

And convenient store robbers don't anticipate the clerk to fight back, that doesn't mean the clerk is wrong. People who are speeding are breaking the law, not the person going the speed limit. Heck, the guy going the speed limit is close to breaking the law himself. Any faster and he's breaking the rules.
The speed limit isn't a suggestion. Because people so often go faster than the speed limit, everyone tends to disregard it. People have even created the myth that you're "allowed" to go 5 over. That's just simply not true. You can technically be pulled over for going 1 MPH over.

They don't always coincide and obnoxiously taking the position that every other driver is wrong for failing to anticipate that there might be one driver that adheres religiously to the law is driving improperly.

Think about what you're saying. You're saying I'm supposed to anticipate that everyone else won't anticipate what I'm going to do. 100% of the anticipation is suddenly on me. No one else is held responsible for not anticipating something?

None the less, the frequency of problems a driver has is an indication of whether he's driving 'properly'. Infrequent problems are due to jerks that fail to fit into the local traffic environment. Frequent problems are an indication that you might be the jerk.

That's not necessarily true. It's not that simple. A lot of other people may have just as many problems, they're just not as vocal about it as I am. I have a friend who doesn't do the coasting up to red lights thing, but he complains about traffic more than I do.

The only way to tell who is at fault is to analyze each specific incident. If each one indicates that the other people are at fault, then the sheer quantity of problems doesn't change that fact.
There isn't a giant grey area with traffic laws, where you're allowed (or expected) to bend certain laws and break others.
It's pretty bad when someone who follows the rules is deemed a jerk.

 

[Sorry!]

While the speed limit is the 'limit' your suppsoed to go on these roads you're actually supposed to go with the flow of traffic. Did you ever go through driving school? This is one of the most important things they teach you and it's always repeated again and again; do not disturb the flow of traffic.

 

[Tobias Funke]

Kind of off topic, but wouldn't it be nice if bike riders stopped at red lights like they're supposed to? I don't know why they get mad at me for walking in front of them when they should be stopped.

 

[DaveC426913]

Kind of off topic, but wouldn't it be nice if bike riders stopped at red lights like they're supposed to?

AHAHAHA! While we're at it, wouldn't it be nice if the Moon were made of gold?

 

[BobG]

Kind of off topic, but wouldn't it be nice if bike riders stopped at red lights like they're supposed to? I don't know why they get mad at me for walking in front of them when they should be stopped.

Communication! Communication! Communication!

A broomstick through the front spokes will communicate your feelings a little more effectively than getting run over will.

And the best part is that bicycle riders rarely carry guns. Of course, the worst part is that you just armed them with a broomstick and he's probably in a lot better shape than you. He's going to catch you eventually and do really bad things to you with that broomstick.

 

[leroyjenkens]

While the speed limit is the 'limit' your suppsoed to go on these roads you're actually supposed to go with the flow of traffic. Did you ever go through driving school? This is one of the most important things they teach you and it's always repeated again and again; do not disturb the flow of traffic.

This contradicts what the police enforce. They have speed traps where they pull people over one by one. There's a road on the way to my gym and the flow of traffic is always above the speed limit. They'll have cops hiding in one of the side streets with a radar detector and they'll pull tons of people over one by one. I'm never speeding, or at least not as much as the other people, and I never get pulled over.
When's the last time you've heard of someone getting a ticket for disturbing the flow of traffic?

 

[turbo]

When's the last time you've heard of someone getting a ticket for disturbing the flow of traffic?

Want to test this? Try driving 45 mph on an interstate highway. 20mph under is a whole lot more disruptive than 20 mph over because people don't expect it, and they'll close on you very quickly.

 

[Monique]

Want to test this? Try driving 45 mph on an interstate highway. 20mph under is a whole lot more disruptive than 20 mph over because people don't expect it, and they'll close on you very quickly.

Legal minimum speed is 40 mph on interstate highways right? It may be disruptive (mainly because people are driving faster than the max speed), but it doesn't break a law.

 

[turbo]

Legal minimum speed is 40 mph on interstate highways right? It may be disruptive (mainly because people are driving faster than the max speed), but it doesn't break a law.

At least in Maine, I believe the legal minimum on I-95 is 45 mph, except in severe weather conditions. You can and will be ticketed for that kind of violation. "Driving to Endanger" is a pretty broad offense with a wide range of penalties (at the discretion of the judge and with the input of the officer) and it doesn't require you to drive at excessive speeds to earn the fine.

Drive that slow on the Mass Pike, the NJ throughway, etc, and the troopers will get quite creative about issuing citations. If you are not driving at least 5-10 mph over the posted limit, they will see you as an obstruction to the orderly flow of traffic. It's perverse, but speed limits are not enforced consistently from state to state.

 

[leroyjenkens]

At least in Maine, I believe the legal minimum on I-95 is 45 mph, except in severe weather conditions. You can and will be ticketed for that kind of violation. "Driving to Endanger" is a pretty broad offense with a wide range of penalties (at the discretion of the judge and with the input of the officer) and it doesn't require you to drive at excessive speeds to earn the fine.

Drive that slow on the Mass Pike, the NJ throughway, etc, and the troopers will get quite creative about issuing citations. If you are not driving at least 5-10 mph over the posted limit, they will see you as an obstruction to the orderly flow of traffic. It's perverse, but speed limits are not enforced consistently from state to state.

That's entrapment.
If they don't want people going 45, it's THEIR responsibilty to raise the minimum speed limit. Them telling you that you can go 45, then ticketing you because you do so is criminal.
Honestly, I'd have to see proof of this before I believe it. You can't expect people to break the law to avoid breaking a different law.
And just because everybody is going that fast, doesn't mean a cop won't single you out.

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

Drive that slow on the Mass Pike, the NJ throughway, etc, and the troopers will get quite creative about issuing citations. If you are not driving at least 5-10 mph over the posted limit, they will see you as an obstruction to the orderly flow of traffic.

NJ Turnpike? I don't recall seeing a posted minimum anywhere in NJ, but there are portions of the state I haven't been to yet. A few years back they increased the upper limit on I-295 from 55 to 65, but not on all portions of the highway. You need to keep your eyes open for the changes and that seems to me more dangerous than it needs to be. When they upped the limit, there was a stern warning from the governor that going even 1 mile over the new limit would result in a ticket. That never occurred (except for that profiling thing) and it is rare to see anyone doing less than 70. Many do 75.