Republican Debate: Who Impressed You?

[DoggerDan]

Cain made a few mistakes in the early debate regarding foreign policy. However, I think people are receptive to his honesty regarding the matter. He didn't try to spin his behavior and instead went to work learning more about the subject. He's another candidate that would be enhanced/completed by an elder statesman running mate.

He's got my attention. I appreciate his straightforwardness and matter-of-fact way of looking at the issues.

 

[DoggerDan]

If he had held elected office, any office, I think he'd be leading the field now in popular polls as well as that Florida straw poll.

Given the sad state of affairs in American politics, that's probably to his advantage, particularly if he's elected.

 

[BobG]

Some candidates just don't handle debates well.

Rick Perry:


He just isn't good enough in debates to make a good case for himself.

Apparently he had the ability to destroy the able K. B. Hutchinson in the Governor's primary race, but he's not showing much debate strength here so far.

While he's definitely not helping himself in the debates, his performances apparently aren't bad enough to destroy his campaign. He still leads in the polls, but his margin has decreased from 12 points to 7 points.

http://www.pollingreport.com/wh12rep.htm

Gingrich is definitely on the upswing and Cain's ratings have even improved. Apparently, people have given up on the 'hope' that Palin will run and Paul supporters are begginning to admit he isn't really a viable candidate.

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

Bachmann blames Arab Spring on Obama's 'weakness'
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44726590/ns/politics-decision_2012/"
I suppose Bachmann is no longer a serious contender so this doesn't matter much any more. I have always advised policitions you can't do yourself harm by saying bad things about foreigners and you can't help yourself by saying good things about them. Bachmann understands this. Most Americans hear the words blame and Arab in the same sentence and count it wisdom.

 

[mheslep]

While he's definitely not helping himself in the debates, his performances apparently aren't bad enough to destroy his campaign. He still leads in the polls, but his margin has decreased from 12 points to 7 points.

http://www.pollingreport.com/wh12rep.htm

This week down by four. Cain into third place.
http://www.pollingreport.com/wh12rep.htm

 

[Borg]

This week down by four. Cain into third place.
http://www.pollingreport.com/wh12rep.htm

I read that list too fast. For a moment, I thought that Freddie Kruger was in the running. Not that it would be too surprising this year.

 

[mheslep]

I would like to see former Gov. Gary Johnson higher on the list. He seems to have the best performance record in office, both in terms of economic results and for doing what he said he would do.

“My next-door neighbor's two dogs have created more shovel-ready jobs than this current administration,” he shot back.

Any residents of NM, then or since, care to comment? The man was twice elected Governor in a blue state and produced an excellent record. Why does a back bench congress woman like Bachman take a higher rank in the polls? I want a recount.

According to one New Mexico paper, "Johnson left the state fiscally solid," and was "arguably the most popular governor of the decade . . . leaving the state with a $1 billion budget surplus." The Washington Times has reported that when Johnson left office, "the size of state government had been substantially reduced and New Mexico was enjoying a large budget surplus."

Johnson positions
Fiscal:

• End excessive spending, bloated stimulus programs, unnecessary farm subsidies, and earmarks.
• Reassess the role of the federal government and identify responsibilities that can be met more efficiently by the private sector.
• Recognize that you can't have limited government at home, but big government abroad.

Foreign policy:

• With Osama bin Laden now killed and after 10 years of fighting, U.S. forces should leave Afghanistan's challenges to the Afghan people.
• Saddam Hussein has been out of power in Iraq for nearly eight years. America must leave so Iraq can have a chance to grow into a responsible member of the world community.
• Without a clear goal for our military actions in Libya, fighting rages on, and the American people are footing the bill.
• Decades after the collapse of the Soviet Union, American troops remain scattered throughout Europe. It is time to reevaluate these deployments.

Immigration:

• Simplify legal immigration
• Tackle illegal immigration

Works for me.

 

[Char. Limit]

Bachmann blames Arab Spring on Obama's 'weakness'
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44726590/ns/politics-decision_2012/"
I suppose Bachmann is no longer a serious contender so this doesn't matter much any more. I have always advised policitions you can't do yourself harm by saying bad things about foreigners and you can't help yourself by saying good things about them. Bachmann understands this. Most Americans hear the words blame and Arab in the same sentence and count it wisdom.

Sad, isn't it?

 

[Ivan Seeking]

With all of the talk about Chris Cristie I was wondering if he may reconsider. He was just on Piers Morgan who asked if he was 100% certain that he won't run in 2012. Cristie stated clearly that he is 100% certain that he won't run. That was just after saying that he is brutally honest. So that seems to make it final.

So far, I really like Cristie. I don't know a lot about his policies yet but I like him personally. And in however many interviews I've seen with him, perhaps a half dozen or more, he hasn't said one thing that made me cringe as I do with most Republican candidates these days.

 

[WhoWee]

With all of the talk about Chris Cristie I was wondering if he may reconsider. He was just on Piers Morgan who asked if he was 100% certain that he won't run in 2012. Cristie stated clearly that he is 100% certain that he won't run. That was just after saying that he is brutally honest. So that seems to make it final.

So far, I really like Cristie. I don't know a lot about his policies yet but I like him personally. And in however many interviews I've seen with him, perhaps a half dozen or more, he hasn't said one thing that made me cringe as I do with most Republican candidates these days.

I think he needs to finish his first term as Governor - same with Rubio (Congress).

 

[Ivan Seeking]

I think he needs to finish his first term as Governor - same with Rubio (Congress).

I can imagine him being the next Republican that gets my vote. However, I would be concerned about his weight. For a man his age, that much extra weight calls into question, in a real sense, his longevity. He should go on a serious diet.

He reminds me of John Goodman when he played Speaker of the House, in the show, The West Wing. Cristie has that same pervasive, commanding, voluminous presense. Ironically, too much weight loss could detract from that.

 

[DoggerDan]

I've noticed how Cain is holding his own, but behind Romney. Yet the only polls I've seen compare him against other Republican candidates.

Do you think the Republicans realize that if Romney wins the primary they'll probably loose the race, but if Cain wins the primary they'll probably win the race?

The best party candidate isn't the most popular one in the party, but the one who stands the greatest chance of defeating the other party's candidate.

 

[WhoWee]

I've noticed how Cain is holding his own, but behind Romney. Yet the only polls I've seen compare him against other Republican candidates.

Do you think the Republicans realize that if Romney wins the primary they'll probably loose the race, but if Cain wins the primary they'll probably win the race?

The best party candidate isn't the most popular one in the party, but the one who stands the greatest chance of defeating the other party's candidate.

Why do you think Cain is more electable than Romney?

 

[mheslep]

I've noticed how Cain is holding his own, but behind Romney. Yet the only polls I've seen compare him against other Republican candidates.
...

Cain's at least tied with Romney, with a couple polls showing Cain in the lead, 26 to 24%.
http://www.newsmax.com/InsideCover/cain-romney-polls-2012/2011/10/05/id/413390

 

[Proton Soup]

not that i think she's got a snowball's chance, but Bachmann is apparently a regular recipient of contributions from the Koch Brothers, who are finding themselves under quite a bit of fire at the moment because of their Iran deals.

http://www.opensecrets.org/pacs/pacgot.php?cmte=C00236489&cycle=2008

and Iran ain't even the half of it: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-10-02/koch-brothers-flout-law-getting-richer-with-secret-iran-sales.html

lots of old stuff, and apparently this is being timed for the political cycle. but sure to be poison for many a candidate and issue affected by these guys.

 

[mheslep]

not that i think she's got a snowball's chance, but Bachmann is apparently a regular recipient of contributions from the Koch Brothers, ...

$5000 for this election cycle? So?

 

[Proton Soup]

$5000 for this election cycle? So?

how much does it cost to corrupt people?

 

[DoggerDan]

Why do you think Cain is more electable than Romney?

In the republication primaries, he's not.

In the general election, he is.

 

[WhoWee]

In the republication primaries, he's not.

In the general election, he is.

I know what you meant - "electable" implies success in the general election. Accordingly, I'll restate my question with greater specificity - why do you think Cain is more electable than Romney in the general election against the current President (Obama)?

 

[skippy1729]

...I'll restate my question with greater specificity - why do you think Cain is more electable than Romney in the general election against the current President (Obama)?

1. Impact on the African-American vote. One third of Obama's margin of victory was due to increased African-American turnout (see table 1 of http://poq.oxfordjournals.org/content/73/5/995.full.pdf+html). Even if this increased turnout was not a one time event, it is inconceivable that Obama could hold on to 96% of the African-American vote against Cain.

2. Romneycare, anti-abortion credentials and his religion will cause a small percentage of the Republican base to stay home. I have made the acquaintance of evangelicals who do not consider Romney a Christian and will not vote for him. There are extremists in every direction.

3. Cain is direct and up-front in the presentation of his ideas. Romney dances like a politician (as does Obama).

4. The 2008 election shows that experience as an elected does not carry too much weight. Cain's executive experience is comparable to Romney's and both exceed Obama's.

5. Romney and Obama come off as elitists, Cain does not.

Skippy

 

[Char. Limit]

He's the CEO of a corporation. How does he NOT come off as elitist to you?

They're kind of, you know, the elite.

 

[Proton Soup]

He's the CEO of a corporation. How does he NOT come off as elitist to you?

They're kind of, you know, the elite.

friends of mine used to talk about Sam Walton driving up to his stores in his old ford pickup. the employees loved the guy. this was back in the days when walmart was pushing made-in-the-usa products, too.

there's lots of non-elitist CEOs out there.

 

[skippy1729]

He's the CEO of a corporation. How does he NOT come off as elitist to you?

They're kind of, you know, the elite.

For me, an elitist is someone whose self-perceived image of their superiority oozes from every pore of their body. It has nothing to do with money. It is the "I am better and smarter than everyone else" attitude. I am not talking about confidence, I am talking about arrogance.

Skippy

 

[WhoWee]

For me, an elitist is someone whose self-perceived image of their superiority oozes from every pore of their body. It has nothing to do with money. It is the "I am better and smarter than everyone else" attitude. I am not talking about confidence, I am talking about arrogance.

Skippy

I get that vibe from the current resident of 1600 Pennsylvania Ave.

 

[mheslep]

He's the CEO of a corporation. How does he NOT come off as elitist to you?

No.

Cain was born in Memphis, Tennessee, son of Luther Cain, Jr. and his wife Lenora Davis. His mother was a cleaning woman and his father, who was raised on a farm, was a chauffeur. He grew up in Georgia. Cain graduated from Morehouse College in 1967 with a Bachelor of Arts degree in mathematics, and received a Master of Science degree in computer science from Purdue University in 1971, when he was also working full-time in ballistics for the U.S. Department of the Navy. As a civilian ballistics analyst, he was responsible for developing fire control systems for ships and fighter planes.

No scholarship to elite private prep schools in Hawaii, no Ivy League. There is however one thing that strikes me as arrogant about the man, and only one: why can he not be bothered to run for some lower state or federal office first? Where did he draw the go-directly-to-the-Presidency card?

 

[Vanadium 50]

why can he not be bothered to run for some lower state or federal office first? Where did he draw the go-directly-to-the-Presidency card?

Hi did. He ran for senator and lost.

 

[WhoWee]

Romney/Gingrich 2012 is looking better by the day! Newt even specified (on CNN to Blitzer 10/5/11) the answer would'nt be "no" to a VP offer if he doesn't win the nomination.

 

[Proton Soup]

i'm really liking the alligator idea. in fact, i would go further and have sharks with laser beams patrolling the coasts.

http://thinkprogress.org/politics/2011/10/06/334170/herman-cain-top-10/

if he won the nomination, i think the Reps would have to spend a lot of time coaching him.

 

[mheslep]

Hi did. He ran for senator and lost.

Thanks, I missed that, which changes my opinion for the better.

 

[BobG]

i'm really liking the alligator idea. in fact, i would go further and have sharks with laser beams patrolling the coasts.

http://thinkprogress.org/politics/2011/10/06/334170/herman-cain-top-10/

if he won the nomination, i think the Reps would have to spend a lot of time coaching him.

I don't think alligators would survive in the Southwestern United States. They're not very aggressive, anyway. They would only attack people wandering too close to their eggs.

Cain doesn't know the difference between alligators and crocodiles!

Actually, even crocodiles would require a pretty expensive moat. The moat would have to be a mini-habitat. But the mini-habitat wouldn't have to be maintained all that well, because crocodiles don't mind brackish water.

 

[WhoWee]

CNN commentators are tripping over one another trying to discredit Romney - only enforces my opinion of the best ticket - Romney/Gingrich 2012!

 

[Proton Soup]

CNN commentators are tripping over one another trying to discredit Romney - only enforces my opinion of the best ticket - Romney/Gingrich 2012!

eh, i didn't watch the post-debate stuff. couldn't help but chuckle at how Perry is such a hothead, tho. Perry goin' down! and Romney... the man's a damn good liar, smiling the whole time.

i think i wouldn't mind seeing Paul with somebody like Gingrich. he's a bit of snake, but a damn smart one at least.

 

[WhoWee]

eh, i didn't watch the post-debate stuff. couldn't help but chuckle at how Perry is such a hothead, tho. Perry goin' down! and Romney... the man's a damn good liar, smiling the whole time.

i think i wouldn't mind seeing Paul with somebody like Gingrich. he's a bit of snake, but a damn smart one at least.

If I were Gingrich - I'd look directly into the camera and speak soft and clearly and say - I'm the only candidate on this stage that would make President Obama wish he were debating someone else.

 

[DoggerDan]

I know what you meant - "electable" implies success in the general election. Accordingly, I'll restate my question with greater specificity - why do you think Cain is more electable than Romney in the general election against the current President (Obama)?

Since you're putting it that way, in the form of a hypothetical yet improbable (due to current two-party system rules) three-way election, I think the republican vote would simply be split between Romney and Cain, while the full measure of the Democrat vote would go to Obama.

On the other hand, let's assume Clinton and Obama both ran against Cain and Romney. Who might win then?

Haven't a clue.

Getting back to reality, I think it's important to work within the actual structure, and doing so, my original point stands in that I believe people need to determine what's most important to them. Is it the election of their candidate of choice? Or is it to ensure their party's candidate gets elected?

That's where things get complicated, and depending on one's goals, one's choice may be dependent on the candidates in the other party.

 

[WhoWee]

Since you're putting it that way, in the form of a hypothetical yet improbable (due to current two-party system rules) three-way election, I think the republican vote would simply be split between Romney and Cain, while the full measure of the Democrat vote would go to Obama.

On the other hand, let's assume Clinton and Obama both ran against Cain and Romney. Who might win then?

Haven't a clue.

Getting back to reality, I think it's important to work within the actual structure, and doing so, my original point stands in that I believe people need to determine what's most important to them. Is it the election of their candidate of choice? Or is it to ensure their party's candidate gets elected?

That's where things get complicated, and depending on one's goals, one's choice may be dependent on the candidates in the other party.

Actually, I didn't intend to mean a 3 person race - a breakout candidate Cain running on the TEA Party or other ticket would split the vote.

I was asking who has a better chance of beating Obama head to head as the Republican candidate - Romney or Cain?