Searching for the call for Kerry's DD SF-180

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In summary, John Kerry's op eds are beginning to question the media's silence on his confusing stories about his time in Vietnam. Too bad Zero's not here to cry that the Media leans towards the conservatives!
  • #1
kat
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I guess I'm not the only one...Op Ed's are beginning to question the media's silence on Kerry's confusing stories... Too bad Zero's not here to cry that the Media leans towards the conservatives!

Where's my colleagues' interest in Kerry's war records?
Even when he's caught in a lie, media aren't scrutinizing him same way they did Bush
By LEE CEARNAL


The same news media that demanded George W. Bush release his National Guard records — and went over them with a microscope — have shown an appalling lack of interest in John Kerry's military service. And as it turns out, there are far more legitimate questions about the latter than the former.

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Kerry has made his four months and 11 days in Vietnam the central theme of his presidential campaign. This is entirely understandable given his 20 years as the Senate's leading dove. He needs the cover that Vietnam can give him.

Just last week, one of his more fatuous claims came a cropper. Beginning in 1979, with an op-ed for the Boston Herald, Kerry has claimed repeatedly that he spent Christmas Eve of 1968 on a secret — and illegal — mission in Cambodia aboard his swift boat.

"On more than one occasion, I, like Martin Sheen in Apocalypse Now, took my patrol boat into Cambodia. In fact, I remember spending Christmas Day of 1968 five miles across the Cambodian border being shot at by our South Vietnamese allies who were drunk and celebrating Christmas. The absurdity of almost being killed by our own allies in a country in which President Nixon claimed there were no American troops was very real. But nowhere in Apocalypse Now did I sense that kind of absurdity."

He repeated the story again in 1986, on the Senate floor: "I remember Christmas of 1968 sitting on a gunboat in Cambodia. I remember what it was like to be shot at by the Vietnamese and Khmer Rouge and Cambodians, and have the president of the United States telling the American people that I was not there; the troops were not in Cambodia. I have that memory which is seared — seared — in me."

He added a fantastic detail in a 2003 Washington Post profile: "A close associate hints: There's a secret compartment in Kerry's briefcase. He carries the black attaché everywhere. Asked about it on several occasions, Kerry brushed it aside. Finally, trapped in an interview, he exhaled and clicked open his case.

" 'Who told you?' he demanded as he reached inside. 'My friends don't know about this.'

"The hat was a little mildewy. The green camouflage was fading, the seams fraying.

" 'My good luck hat,' Kerry said, happy to see it. 'Given to me by a CIA guy as we went in for a special mission in Cambodia.'

"Kerry put on the hat, pulling the brim over his forehead. His blue button-down shirt and tie clashed with the camouflage. He pointed his finger and raised his thumb, creating an imaginary gun. He looked silly, yet suddenly his campaign message was clear: Citizen-soldier. Linking patriotism to public service. It wasn't complex after all; it was Kerry.

"He smiled and aimed his finger: 'Pow.' "

This story was repeated early this year, in the fawning biography written by a Boston Globe reporter. Problem is, it's not true. His own crewmates say they were not in Cambodia on Christmas Eve. Even Kerry's own diary entry for that day says he was at his base in Sa Dec, 55 miles from the Cambodian border. In his biography of Kerry, Douglas Brinkly quoted the relevant passage: "Visions of sugarplums really do dance through your head and you think of stockings and snow and roast chestnuts and fires with birch logs and all that is good and warm and real. It's Christmas Eve."

With their man caught in a lie, Kerry's handlers last week floated a new version — he was near Cambodia.

"During John Kerry's service in Vietnam, many times he was on or near the Cambodian border and on one occasion crossed into Cambodia at the request of members of a special operations group operating out of Ha Tien.

"On Dec. 24, 1968, Lt. John Kerry and his crew were on patrol in the watery borders between Vietnam and Cambodia deep in enemy territory. In the early afternoon, Kerry's boat, PCF-44, was at Sa Dec and then headed north to the Cambodian border. There, Kerry and his crew along with two other boats were ambushed, taking fire from both sides of the river, and after the firefight were fired upon again. Later that evening during their night patrol they came under friendly fire. . . .

"Kerry's was not the only United States riverboat to respond and inadvertently or responsibly cross the border. In fact, it was this reality that led President Nixon to later invade Cambodia itself in 1970."

This won't fly either.

"Watery borders between Vietnam and Cambodia?" The Mekong River does not form a border between Vietnam and Cambodia.

"Inadvertently?" Strange, considering that his memory of that Christmas Eve 1968 was "seared" into his memory — including the fact that Nixon was lying about U.S. forces' presence there, even though Nixon didn't even take office until mid-January.

There is no evidence whatsoever that Kerry ventured into Cambodia during his abbreviated tour in Vietnam. No orders, no after-action reports, no confirmation from others, nothing.

To have been caught in Cambodia would have been an international embarrassment and a court-martial offense. The border was clearly marked with warnings signs and patrolled by a PT boat to ensure that no allied boats crossed it. (Yes, allied special-ops forces were operating in Cambodia. But they were not inserted there by something as obvious and slow-moving as a swift boat. They were ferried in by helicopter.)

As to the truth of this tale, there is only Kerry's word, which the press seems quite willing to take, to the extent of not reporting on the controversy at all. It is not a trivial matter. Kerry has pimped the story repeatedly in an effort to paint himself as a stand-up eyewitness to events that were both illegal and, in his view, immoral.

And that's not the only issue that reporters are curiously incurious about. At least one of Kerry's Purple Hearts has been challenged by his unit's medical officer, who notes that the wound was barely visible and was treated with a Band-Aid. Some questions should also be asked about his Silver Star: Should shooting a wounded, fleeing Viet Cong in the back — as justifiable as it was as an act of war — be worthy of the nation's third-highest award for courage?

To those of you who say such questions are unseemly, consider that John Kerry's principal claim on the presidency is that he served four months and 11 days in Vietnam. OK, fine. Let's examine the records — all the records, which, unlike Bush and contrary to popular perception, Kerry has not released — and have a debate. We would be if it were George W. Bush. The media would see to it.

Cearnal is the special projects editor at the Chronicle. A former Marine helicopter pilot, he served in Vietnam from mid-1968 through mid-1969. Readers may e-mail him at lee.cearnal@chron.com.
http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/editorial/outlook/2740155
 
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  • #2
Oh my God, he's Bill Clinton.
 
  • #3
JohnDubYa said:
Oh my God, he's Bill Clinton.
Kerry did, at least, go to Vietnam. I'll give him that much.
 
  • #4
I can't seem to find the specific thing you're looking for, but if you look on John Kerry's website he's got tons of records etc. from his military servive.

Official Naval Records: http://www.johnkerry.com/about/john_kerry/military_records.html

After-Action Combat Reports:
http://www.johnkerry.com/about/john_kerry/combat_reports.html

Command History for Coastal Division 11 for 1969
http://www.johnkerry.com/about/john_kerry/command_history.html
 
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  • #5
I still can not understand how Bush the moron can attack Kerry on his military records. The freaking chicken**** coward didn't even go. He hid in the guard. In fact he was able to get in the guard ahead of many other men who were on the waiting list to get in because his daddy was senator. LOL only 1 person ever remembers Bush ever fulfilling his duties in the guard. Bush will go down as the bigest failure in the history of the United States.
 
  • #6
I still can not understand how Bush the moron can attack Kerry on his military records.

To my knowledge, he isn't.

The freaking chicken**** coward didn't even go.

Man, you must have a particularly low opinion of Bill Clinton. :)

In fact he was able to get in the guard ahead of many other men who were on the waiting list to get in because his daddy was senator.

Oh, really? Are you SURE about that?
 
  • #7
I can't seem to find the specific thing you're looking for, but if you look on John Kerry's website he's got tons of records etc. from his military servive.

Just not the ones relevant to this discussion.
 
  • #8
The 180 is a release of all military records. Bush signed his after being requested to by the media, where is the media clamour for Kerry to sign his 180 and release ALL of his military records as opposed to the select records he's posted on his site?
 
  • #9
JohnDubYa said:
Just not the ones relevant to this discussion.
Oh well, I didn't read through every single record posted on that site, so I didn't know which was relevant or not. You sure none of them might answer your question?
 
  • #10
kat said:
The 180 is a release of all military records. Bush signed his after being requested to by the media, where is the media clamour for Kerry to sign his 180 and release ALL of his military records as opposed to the select records he's posted on his site?
Wouldn't it be great if he didn't release all his records becuase it turns out he never really committed war-crimes and just made that whole thing up in front of the senate hearing? :rofl:
 
  • #11
wasteofo2 said:
Wouldn't it be great if he didn't release all his records becuase it turns out he never really committed war-crimes and just made that whole thing up in front of the senate hearing? :rofl:
We already know that at least some of the testimony at the senate hearing was fabricated, including some of the so called "vietnam vets". I don't really think that is what one would expect to find out through his records at any rate. I think some of the vets who served with Kerry would like to have just have the truth out, maybe have his records vindicate them in some way, show that Kerry was dishonest and not the hero he says he is..particularly those men who served their full year and feel that they really earned their medals and those who refused medals for injuries greater then Kerrys' etc. *shrug*
At any rate, if the media can be at all impartial it should be calling for a 180 from kerry just as it did for Bush..and let the "cards" fall where they may.

Although, there's been some speculation that the holding out on releasing his records is a big scheme...to create a big build up and then when Kerry finally signs the 180...there will be no great revelations to be found in his newly released records...and then he can say "see, I told you so"... :tongue:
 
  • #12
About the media not seeking Kerry's full disclosure of military records:

I don't think the media as a whole is leaning left or right. Certainly you have Fox News leaning to the right, Air America leaning to the left etc., but the majority I feel isn't necessarily treating either candidate particularly special. I think the problem is just that the media sucks. Every Republican can point out times when Bush's been criticised harshly and Kerry hasn't, and every Democrat can point out times when Kerry's been criticized harshly and Bush hasn't (while Kerry's record is infact being scrutinized and is one of the biggest news items out there right now, no one is making any sort of issue of GWB's lack of service). I think the media is just lazy and would rather talk about Kobe Bryant and Scott Peterson than politics, and will only do any investigations or demand things of public figures if there's a huge outcry for them. It would be best if the media demanded Kerry release all his military records, and there are tons of other records that the Bush campaign could release as well, but if few care about it (regardless of it's importance), the media won't do it.

Sadly, it makes sense. If only a small of the population really cares about some records, and if you get those records, only a small amount of people will be interested in watching/reading/listening to your report about it, but if you talk about something a lot of people are interested in, like whose wife is the bigger ***** or who used the f word, then you're garunteed a bigger audience.
 
  • #13
Oh well, I didn't read through every single record posted on that site, so I didn't know which was relevant or not. You sure none of them might answer your question?

You posted the link. Shouldn't you be the one to examine the material to see if it is relevant to the discussion?

...no one is making any sort of issue of GWB's lack of service

As if they haven't in the past?
 
  • #14
wasteofo2 said:
Wouldn't it be great if he didn't release all his records becuase it turns out he never really committed war-crimes and just made that whole thing up in front of the senate hearing? :rofl:
That would be a very twisted irony.
 
  • #15
JohnDubYa said:
You posted the link. Shouldn't you be the one to examine the material to see if it is relevant to the discussion?

As if they haven't in the past?

I posted the link so that kat, and anyone else interested, could look through Kerry's military records and try to find things they might think haven't been released. I was trying to supply people with a way to possibly get some questions answered.

Certainly Bush's lack of service has been talked about, but he's not getting any slack now and he hardly did anything, wheras Kerry's getting all this crap and he volunteered to serve in vietnam, it just seems very one-sided.
 
  • #16
Certainly Bush's lack of service has been talked about, but he's not getting any slack now and he hardly did anything, wheras Kerry's getting all this crap and he volunteered to serve in vietnam, it just seems very one-sided.

First of all, Bush received flak over his National Guard service for four years. Remember the AWOL story? But the stories have basically dwindled because there appears to be little evidence to substantiate them -- not to say that they are false, but you can go on innuendo only for so long. Four years from now the swift boat issue will no longer be discussed to any serious level.

These attacks by individual organizations are nothing new. I remember Catholic priests trying to instill the notion that Reagan would initiate Armagedon if elected. Also, there was a similar strategy to claim that Bush Sr. ditched his plane too early, leaving his crewmen to die in the crash.
 
  • #17
On the title subject, the SF180 is just the request for the real document, the DD214. And Kerry's DD214 is already public record; at least people online are citing it. See today's Daily Kos. So all the hooh-hah about the SF180 is just more obfuscation.
 
  • #18
selfAdjoint said:
On the title subject, the SF180 is just the request for the real document, the DD214. And Kerry's DD214 is already public record; at least people online are citing it. See today's Daily Kos. So all the hooh-hah about the SF180 is just more obfuscation.
The DD214 is just the discharge papers. With the SF180, you can request the full service record.

http://contacts.gsa.gov/webforms.nsf/0/6A748D94A429DE1085256CB10043FB7B/$file/sf180_f.pdf
 
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  • #19
just because he's a liring scum bag, is that really any reason not to vote for him?
 
  • #20
Well, I guess that is up to each individual person. But the truth needs to come out, only because Kerry has made such a big deal out of his service record.
 
  • #21
devil-fire said:
just because he's a liring scum bag, is that really any reason not to vote for him?
Well, I don't know - was it a reason not to vote for Clinton?

...then again, considering Clinton's vote count in his first election, maybe it was. :wink:
 

1. What is the DD SF-180?

The DD SF-180 is a form used by the United States Department of Defense to request military records, including discharge papers, for current and former military members.

2. Why would someone need to search for the call for Kerry's DD SF-180?

There are several reasons why someone may need to search for the call for Kerry's DD SF-180. This could include verifying a military service record, obtaining benefits, or conducting research on a particular veteran.

3. How can I search for the call for Kerry's DD SF-180?

You can search for the call for Kerry's DD SF-180 by contacting the National Personnel Records Center (NPRC) in St. Louis, Missouri. They have the official records for all military personnel and can assist with your search.

4. Is there a fee for requesting the call for Kerry's DD SF-180?

There is no fee for requesting the call for Kerry's DD SF-180. However, there may be a fee for obtaining copies of the records, depending on the purpose of your request.

5. How long does it take to receive the call for Kerry's DD SF-180?

The amount of time it takes to receive the call for Kerry's DD SF-180 can vary. It depends on the current workload of the NPRC and the complexity of the request. Generally, it can take up to 90 days to receive a response.

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