# News Sell me on Kerry

1. Apr 21, 2004

### phatmonky

Seriously. This isn't flamebait, and I am going to read it with an open mind.

Hitting the larger topics (and adding any you wish), let me (and others) know why Kerry is really a better pick than Bush. And this means NO RAMBLING RHETORIC of Bush Bashing. I'm curious as to Kerry's positives over Bush, not why Bush is so evil.

Iraq, economy, healthcare, domestic social structure, terrorism, military, government spending, illegal aliens,etc.

I am more than able to read Kerry's campaign website, but I want to know what the average Kerry voter is expecting of him on these issues.
I'm trying to stomach Kerry in a manner to look at the election with an open mind up until November. I don't want to make a hardpressed decision until election day, in order to keep my eyes open on the issues

2. Apr 22, 2004

Why Kerry? He's not Bush.

3. Apr 22, 2004

### GENIERE

Kerry stands for both sides of every issue. What more could you ask for?

4. Apr 22, 2004

### hughes johnson

Although Kerry has a net worth of $700,000,000.00, he is just an average guy like us. That is because he knows just exactly how tough we have it. He knows how expensive it is to run our fleets of SUVs with the price of gas being so high. He knows how difficult it is for us to afford the fuel for our private Gulfstream 5 jets. He knows how we feel when we fill up the fuel tanks on our huge yachts. He can see how we feel about the rich running our country, instead of average joes like him. He is an enviromentalist. He once even turned down the thermostat at one of his mansions for 15 minutes just to help save our planet. Even though he burns thousands of gallons of fuel oil each year to heat his mansions, he did make this one attempt to make a difference. He cares about minorities. He even actually spoke to a black man once. A black friend of mine met Mr. Kerry once in a grocery store. It was so nice of Mr. Kerry to take the time to stop and talk to him. As Mr. Kerry stepped in front of him in line he actually spoke to him and the cashier. As he rushed past and cut in line he said "Do you know who I am?" Now isn't that nice. Not everyone would do that. He is also a highly decorated war hero too. I suffered several paper cuts and a sore finger myself while in the service and I'm still waiting for my purple hearts. Maybe if I were better connected it would help. Mr. Kerry also has a long record of charitable contributions, he regularly donates as much as$100 a year to charity. He doesn't do this just for the tax break, he really cares about people.

I didn't vote for him in the primary, but I'll vote for him in the general election. That way I can say that I voted against him before I voted for him. Yup, he's the guy for me.

5. Apr 22, 2004

### hughes johnson

Since you are an Australian, your vote will only be counted by Florida democrats, twice.

6. Apr 22, 2004

### phatmonky

See, this is the same rhetoric I'm talking about.
I personally don't like the guy's persona. However, I'm trying to not go the next six months with my mind made up, in case my bias would then lead me to make a candidate out to be better than they are.
However, even TRYING to like Kerry and put him at some sort of neutral ground seems impossible since no one seems to really know what they are expecting him to do.....except not be Bush.

7. Apr 22, 2004

### phatmonky

If nothing else, this cracked me up

8. Apr 22, 2004

### hughes johnson

I'm not even a pro. If this wack gets elected Jay Leno's monologue will be even funnier than it was during the Clinton administration.

9. Apr 22, 2004

### jimmy p

Im not sure it really matters who you vote for. No matter what happens, it's always some goofball in a cheap suit screwing the country up. Who was the last President who really stood out? Don't worry, the above criteria is for politicians worldwide. The last Prime Minister to make a difference here in England was Maggie Thatcher. And that's cos she wore cheap dresses. (actually i thought Maggie did a great job!!)

10. Apr 22, 2004

YOU must research the issues and decide for yourself- JK campaign will not tell you what to think. One thing is certain for me in any case, there is real grave danger for this country if Bush remains in power. Look at Texas for a moment--in a state that voted FDR a landslide, environmental and social structures which were designed to protect the public are destroyed; public institutions are replaced with private enterprises with political connections. It's an old formula- socialize the cost, privatize the profits, and it leaves the NASCAR dads & moms hurting big time.
You left one thing out-- it's a pretty big one. Seeing how it's "Earth Day" !!
Okay, since you asked and I know a little about some of this, I'll try: On Iraq, the position is that the President needs to make an effort to garner real support to the tune of 200,000 to 400,000 NATO troops & UN peacekeepers immediately. This is something GWB's crew has been assiduously avoiding.
On the economy, there would be a corporate tax cut for 99% of US companies that don't ship their jobs overseas. The Kennedy era loopholes that allow them to ship overseas would be closed. There would be a further tax cut for 98% of the middle class, while the tax cut for >>individuals<< making over 200,000 per year would be repealed to balance the budget.

Okay, still with me? On healthcare there is talk of providing public care for 100% of little kids, and some kind of structure for adults although I'm not up on all details of this part.

On terrorism, JK would put resources into actually fighting terrorism instead of busting kids for weed.

11. Apr 22, 2004

### Njorl

Reasons to vote Kerry

1. Sensible economic policy - John Kerry does not believe any one action is a cure-all for any economic problem.
2. Smart on defense - Kerry has been advocating for years against big, boondoggle weapons systems in favor of troop efficiency. Republicans have been hyping Kerry's voting record on big defense systems, but the truth is, all the systems he voted against have been wasteful, taking money away from things that could really help soldiers.
3. Smart on Intelligence - Kerry advocated the cutting of spending on the NRO (satellite based intelligence) in lieu of cutting human intelligence.
4. Integrity - He is an honest man who fights for his principles. He is not afraid to take a stand against his party, or against popular opinion.
5. Mentally equipped for the job - He is not afraid to advocate complex solutions to complicated problems even though this does not make for good sound-bites.
6. Diplomatic - He does not pointlessly antagonize foreign governments or peoples.
7. Professional - Despite being one of the more left-leaning Democrats early in his career, he was always on decent terms with his Republican colleagues.
8. A decorated veteran - While he could have easily avoided service, he served in Vietnam earning a Silver Star, Bronze Star and 3 Purple Hearts. While it may not mean much to many people, it is a good time to have a president who can speak to our soldiers without hypocrisy.
9. Responsibility - If Kerry is elected, we will really know who is in charge.

Njorl

12. Apr 22, 2004

### Staff: Mentor

I've heard that before and its logical, but I won't vote for someone because they aren't someone else. It just feels wrong to me. I will vote for someone I like. Period. And if that means writing in Howard Stern (I might), I will do it.

13. Apr 22, 2004

### hughes johnson

He is anything but honest. He has gotten caught in more lies in 8 months than the legendary liar Bill Clinton told in 8 years.

I'd be a decorated veteran too if I could recommend myself for my own medals for paper cuts, and I had political connections like Tip O'Neil and Ted Kennedy. He didn't even finish his tour of duty like the poor and middle class soldiers did, he went home early. This is not "fighting for his principles" this is fighting to save his own ***, and riding on the backs of the poor and the middle class. The profits he makes from us go to pay for his fuel guzzling gulfstream 5 jet, his yacht, his mansions, and his fleet of SUVs. This is the rich living off of the sweat and blood of the poor by telling us that he is on our side, and we believe him! What a crock.

14. Apr 22, 2004

### GENIERE

Njorl has given reasons perhaps, but not facts.
I’m not aware of a Kerry economic policy. He has stated that he supports Bush’s tax policy except for the “the wealthy American” bit. If he does have a policy, he should submit it to the GAO to test its merit as compared to the president’s policy. The Commerce Department has released its findings re. The economy. It found the economy was in a sharp decline during the last year of the Clinton Administration and reached bottom during the 2nd quarter of the Bush administration while the government was still using the Clinton budget. When Bush announced his tax cut plans, a rebound occurred and, due to the cut, continues to this day. In fact the growth in 2003 was greater than at any point during the Clinton years.
One problem a long serving senator has is that votes cast many years ago are not always relevant to present and may be attacked by an opponent. For that reason I cannot hold Kerry responsible to defense cutting in the ‘80’s. The more responsible question would be to ask what he has done to improve our countries defenses. Asked that way he has failed miserably.
The truth, if one ignores the outrageous support Kerry provided to Clinton’s “criminal vs. terrorist” intelligence barrier is: Kerry introduced a bill on Sept. 29, 1995—S. 1290. The bill sought to cut the intelligence budget by \$1.5 billion over a five-year period. Described by Kerry bashers as “gutting” I would personally only consider it an example of stupidity.
On the contrary, he has proven to bend with the wind. As Howard Dean’s rants re: Bush caused him to be the front runner, Kerry responded in kind and drew away from his more subdued comments. He, like Gore, assumes acting rolls, such as the use of “four letter words” when addressing motorcyclists. I’m sure I need not remind you of the “I voted for it and against it” blather. Quote is not precise.
Very true, I’m sure can provide the most complex solutions we’ve ever endured. One can expect social plans similar to the laughably complex health care plan produced by Hillary Clinton. When has complexity ever been considered advantageous?
When nations and the UN act against the best interests of the US and gain financially by criminal activities in doing so, those nations and organizations should be antagonized to the greatest extant possible. Pointless or deserved?
Let us be a little more up to date. The National Journal, a non-ideological, authoritative weekly magazine found Kerry in 2003 to inhabit the far-left fringe.
Until recently I would not differ with that statement, but it seems all is not yet known. Never the less his service is to be admired. It seems it has unfortunately left him mentally scarred and perhaps not able to make the responsible decisions.
Does anyone doubt that Bush’s policies are his, that the people around him submit to his wishes? Fortunately we’ll never know that about Kerry.

15. Apr 22, 2004

### kat

16. Apr 22, 2004

### The_Professional

I'm sure there's no shortage of ketchup in the Kerry household.

17. Apr 22, 2004

### Chemicalsuperfreak

So let's compare this to Bush, shall we?

Yes, John Kerry's rich. Actually, he married into it, his wife is the one with the money, but that's beside the point.

Bush is rich too. Who's more rich? I don't know, I suspect Bush. Of course Bush is a regular guy. He was born rich. His whole family's rich. Because his dad works for a defense contractor, and Bush started a war based on lies, he's going to be inheriting a bunch more money now too.

Environment? Who's better on the environment? Really? Well, Bush promised on the campaign trail that he would cut CO2 emissions. Of course he broke that campaign promise among others. Drilling in ANWAR, cut down the forests to protect them from fire, Governor of NJ as head of the EPA and had to leave in disgrace. So it's rather obvious that Kerry is better then Bush on the environment. Although I admit that's not saying much.

Minorities? All right. Let's talk about minorities. What do minorities have to say about Kerry vs. Bush. Well, ninety percent of blacks voted against Bush in 2001. I'm sure when Bush went to a white supremacist camp and talked about "taking back america" that didn't help their views. And then there's the muslims, which I expect will be voting for Kerry. And homosexuals. Bush has sure gone after the immigrant vote, but that didn't make his base very happy. So I guess if you care about minorities you'll be voting for Kerry. The bigotted white male vote will be going to Bush. Again.

War hero? Absolutely. Silver star. Bronze star. Couple of purple hearts. He took a lot of shrapnel in vietnam. And if you don't think he deserved the medals then you're being disrespectful to the troops. But I"m sure nobody hear would do that. Bush, of course, used his connections to dodge the draft. Apparently he was AWOL for most of his stint in the TANG. It's known he was grounded from flying, when he didn't show up for his medical. The logical assumption being he wouldn't pass his drug exam.

Charitable contributions? That I don't know much about. Bush has made lots of charitable contributions. Take Enron for example. Ken Lay, who Bush says he never met, got his own desk in the White House. And then there's Halliburton. You know, Cheney's old employer. They got billions of Iraq money and still didn't have to feed the troops.

18. Apr 22, 2004

### Chemicalsuperfreak

Bill Clinton lied about sex. Bush lied about a war that's killed more civilians then Osama bin Laden. What did Kerry lie about?

As for Kerry's service. He took shrapnel in the buttock and his arm. And that was his third purple heart. Where were you wounded in Vietnam? In fact, what service were you in?

Oh, and yes, he was sent home after three months of his tour. Of course that was when he was on his second tour. He completed the entire year of his first tour, so volunteering for the second was above and beyond the call of duty. And was much more then the chickenhawk republicans did.

Last edited: Apr 22, 2004
19. Apr 22, 2004

### hughes johnson

I didn't realize that Clinton lied about sex TOO!

You seem to like this bin Laden guy, maybe you should vote for him.

You do read the newspapers don't you? What DIDN'T he lie about? Mr. Kerry is not your ordinary liar, he seems to enjoy it. He acts as if lying were an olympic event, and Sen. Kennedy is handing out the gold medals again.

I'm not going to brag about my military service in Vietnam on this forum.

Many republicans served in Vietnam without complaining, even though it was the democrats who started the war (again). Many came home in body bags. They didn't have the option to ditty when the going got tough, like Mr. Kerry did, and they didn't come home and whine about it either.

Last edited: Apr 22, 2004
20. Apr 22, 2004

### ShawnD

I really don't read the papers. Can you give some examples?