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News Shooting at Charlie Hebdo

  1. Jan 7, 2015 #1

    DrClaude

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    There has been a shooting at the offices of the French satirical weekly Charlie Hebdo:
    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-30710883

    It's crazy what some people can come to if they feel their "beliefs" have been "mocked."
     
  2. jcsd
  3. Jan 7, 2015 #2

    Bystander

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    "At least twelve dead?"
     
  4. Jan 7, 2015 #3

    DrClaude

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    Latest news names the journalists/cartoonists Charb (editor in chief publishing director), Cabu and Wolinski among the victims.

    I have no words to express my sadness. This is a great loss. :L
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2015
  5. Jan 7, 2015 #4

    Dotini

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    The statement from the OP article, "The gunmen shouted 'we have avenged the Prophet Muhammad', witnesses say", could be a pointer to the identity and motivations of the killers. But an Australian moderator on another forum said,

    "It should be, but it could also be something dreamed up by an extreme right-wing group to stir up anti-Muslim sentiment in France.

    Okay, that's an extremely unlikely explanation - the point is that we should wait and see what happens before jumping to conclusions. Look at the Sydney siege gunman, who used radical iconography during his attack, but whose motivations had nothing to do with radical Islam."
     
  6. Jan 7, 2015 #5

    DrClaude

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    We won't know the motivations of the killers until tehy get arrested and tried, or they release a statement. But one should use Occam's razor and, if the eyewitness statements are correct, assume that this was religiously motivated. Charlie Hebdo has been targeted in the past.
     
  7. Jan 7, 2015 #6

    Dotini

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    I'm sorry but I must respectfully disagree. Millions of Muslims have fled war and deprivation in the Middle East. They will have many motivations and justifications for their actions, religion being only one.
     
  8. Jan 7, 2015 #7

    Borg

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    I have to agree. I'll have to go with what was reported in the news rather than random internet opinions that strain credibility.
     
  9. Jan 7, 2015 #8
    I am so angry and sad. This along with the North Korea fiasco will be a massive test for the freedom of speech and press in the free worlds.
     
  10. Jan 7, 2015 #9

    lisab

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    This is awful. France 24 reports the terrorists shouted, "We avenged the prophet, we killed Charlie Hebdo!" before driving off.

    They are mistaken.

    Je suis Charlie Hebdo!
     
  11. Jan 7, 2015 #10

    Mark44

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    Sounds religious to me...
     
  12. Jan 7, 2015 #11

    Dotini

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    If they had blown themselves up it would be more convincingly religious. :rolleyes:

    Perhaps it would help to catch them and then find the truth?
     
  13. Jan 7, 2015 #12
    I'm afraid nothing short of events like this will be enough to curtail excessive PC practiced nowadays.

    Religions are not skin color or shape of your eyes. You are not born with it, you accept its ideas - or decline. Religions are sets of ideas, they are ideologies, and they are not all equally good or evil.

    Yet somehow, it is okay to disagree with a political idea (e.g. you can openly critisize Nazism. Or capitalism. Etc), but whenever you criticize a religion, you are labeled "racist".
     
  14. Jan 7, 2015 #13

    DrClaude

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    I don't see what this would have to do with Charlie Hebdo, while I can see why religious fanatics would be angry at them.
     
  15. Jan 7, 2015 #14

    russ_watters

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    IMO, shouting their motivation during the attack is releasing a statement.
     
  16. Jan 7, 2015 #15

    DrClaude

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    Indeed. I have now seen video where they clearly shout "on a vengé le prophète Mohamed" ("we have avenged the prophet Mohamed").
     
  17. Jan 7, 2015 #16

    Dotini

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    Perhaps this article will help to answer your question.
    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-30717728
     
  18. Jan 7, 2015 #17
    Apparently, we are in great danger. Not of being unable to speak freely without running the risk of being gunned down, mind you. We are at great risk of, gasp, "rise in anti-Islam sentiment". It's not allowed to be anti-Islam, you right-wing fascist racist pig you!

    Quote from the article: "many feared for the long-term implications for a French society already witness to a steady rise in xenophobic and anti-Islam sentiment"

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jan/07/charlie-hebdo-attack-turning-point-french-politics
     
  19. Jan 7, 2015 #18

    Bystander

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    "Judge not lest ye be judged by the company of the birds of a feather you flock with."
     
  20. Jan 7, 2015 #19

    Dotini

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    From a friend in Europe I hear,

    - French authorities have identified the 3 terrorists.

    - Their ages: 18, 32 and 34 years old. Two are brothers and supposedly of French nationality.

    - The French edition of Metro reports this.

    - More reports are coming out that 2 of them went to Syria this summer.

    - Brothers are Cherif and Said K. and the youngest is called Hamyd M.

    - Already known by French police and actively involved in recruiting jihadists for the Iraq conflict around 2005. Hamyd M. is a recent arrival.

    - The police also raided a house in the northeast of Paris, Pantin, without any arrests made.
     
  21. Jan 7, 2015 #20
    What a vicious and barbaric attack!

    I wonder if this madness will ever end.
     
  22. Jan 7, 2015 #21
    I'm a bit puzzled by seeing many reactions like yours. Yes, this was a terrorist attack.

    But.

    Every day, something like this happens in other places. Even much worse things happen. Say, Boko Haram killing _hundreds_ of people, and taking women into slavery (!!!). Or North Korea running Nazi-style extermination camps for about 200 thousand of its dissidents (this particular atrocity happens RIGHT NOW as we speak). We do nothing.

    Every time I think about it, it almost hurts. I recall reading documentary evidence about Nazi camps. This was horrible beyond belief. And it happens. Now. Again.

    But people somehow don't get outraged.

    [edit] Somehow it ended up sounding wrong. As if I accuse you of something... didn't mean it this way. Sorry.
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2015
  23. Jan 7, 2015 #22

    nsaspook

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    People are outraged that this medieval behavior happened in a modern western society. The motivational factors for this extreme violence seems completely out of sync with the level of wrong to the attackers for those who believe in basic human freedom of expression in a modern democracy. I'm outraged but not surprised.
     
  24. Jan 7, 2015 #23
    and the list goes on... ISIS almost unprecedented savagery, cleansing entire communities, and making an industry out of sex slaves! Taliban Pakistan massacring 140 school children, and so on. All of them are abhorrent, yet it shouldn't stop people from getting appalled whenever another terrorist attack happens.

    Many people do, including myself.

    No worries. I know what you mean and I didn't feel accused at all.
     
  25. Jan 7, 2015 #24

    Dotini

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    In my opinion, it will not end if this sort of blowback is accepted as an inevitable cost of liberal western European intervention in the Middle East, and welcoming the fleeing victims back in Europe.

    On the other hand, if the blowback is deemed intolerable, there are two obvious ways to end the violence:
    #1. Elect populist politicians across Europe who will shoo out the Muslims.
    #2. Elect another sort of authoritarian regime which enacts Continent-wide blasphemy laws which fully accept the laws and needs of a growing Islamic population in Europe.
     
  26. Jan 7, 2015 #25
    Seriously?! Shoo out the muslims?!

    I can't believe you actually said that.

    People complain that when they criticise Islam they sometimes get labelled bigots. And I agree this is ridiculous. Islam is a religion and it deserves to be criticised, even ridiculed, especially when it inspires some people to behave in this way.

    But electing politicians who would purge the entire muslim population off the continent?!

    Well I'm glad only few europeans think this way.
     
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