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News State attorney launches bizarre Internet war on openly gay college student

  1. Sep 29, 2010 #1


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    http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_upshot/20100929/us_yblog_upshot/state-attorney-launches-bizarre-internet-war-on-openly-gay-college-student;_ylt=AhXNSpSGQD8oYgT.j_UZkXtH2ocA;_ylu=X3oDMTVyZGQ0ZG50BGFzc2V0Ay9zL3libG9nX3Vwc2hvdC8yMDEwMDkyOS91c195YmxvZ191cHNob3Qvc3RhdGUtYXR0b3JuZXktbGF1bmNoZXMtYml6YXJyZS1pbnRlcm5ldC13YXItb24tb3Blbmx5LWdheS1jb2xsZWdlLXN0dWRlbnQEY2NvZGUDbXBfZWNfOF8xMARjcG9zAzYEcG9zAzYEc2VjA3luX3RvcF9zdG9yaWVzBHNsawNtaWNoc3RhdGVvZmY- [Broken]

    Don't the actions of Shirvell, the assistant state attorney general for Michigan amount to hate mongering?

    Watch the interview Anderson Cooper has with Shirvell.
    Last edited by a moderator: May 5, 2017
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  3. Sep 29, 2010 #2
    I'm very surprised people around here are standing for this. Ann Arbor is a very very (very) liberal town, although Michigan's government is full of pushovers who wont take actions against fellow officials unless enough people starting breathing down their necks *cough*Granholm and Kwami*cough*.
  4. Sep 29, 2010 #3
    What a troll, though I already knew that government lawyers are corrupt and insane. o_O
  5. Sep 29, 2010 #4


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    Maybe I've overlooked something while skimming, but it doesn't look like hate-mongering. It just looks like the usual garbage about politics you see on internet forums.
  6. Sep 29, 2010 #5


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    Except this is an assistant attorney general making insane personal attacks on a college student because he's gay.

    You must have overlooked something. Most attoney generals don't paste swastikas over the face of college students and call them Satan's Representative, stalk them and their friends, and show up at the student's house carrying hate signs.

    Did you watch the interview?
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2010
  7. Sep 29, 2010 #6
  8. Sep 29, 2010 #7
    The comments on video boards across the Net are dumping accusations about Shirvell's own sexuality.
  9. Sep 29, 2010 #8


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    I think it does go beyond garden variety internet forum politicking and crosses into actual mongering. Whether it is hate he is mongering or something else, I don't know yet, but when you dedicate an entire blog to attacking one person (or group of people), as opposed to posting incidental thoughts on some forum, that counts to me as a propaganda campaign aimed at provoking a reaction of some kind.


    * a person who kindles hatred, enmity, or prejudice in others

    * a propagandist who seeks to provoke hatred and prejudice, esp. against a minority group or groups

    (asterisks are links to definitions)
  10. Sep 29, 2010 #9
    well, it would be too easy to make some judgements based on stereotype.

    but, this thing appears a bit crude and contrived, to me. sometimes the best way to promote a candidate is to set up a false scenario where it appears they are being attacked.
  11. Sep 29, 2010 #10


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    Tthe guy is the sitting president of a student government. It's not like he's running for Congress or something.
  12. Sep 29, 2010 #11
    yeah, i don't get it either. maybe some kind of fraternity thing? it would be easier to accept if Shirvell has been politically active in a similar way in the past.
  13. Sep 29, 2010 #12


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    Why do you assume he hasn't done this before? It's really hard to find anything one way or the other since everything on google is about this latest incident
  14. Sep 29, 2010 #13
    thanks for digging that up.

    why? his attacks just seem really low-brow. it's hard to imagine that this is the work of a state attorney. is his work this crude? bizarre is certainly the right word.
  15. Sep 30, 2010 #14
    I wonder if this AAG has a little crush that he doesn't know how to deal with? It wouldn't be the first time hatred was the result of unwanted feelings surfacing. It really doesn't matter WHY at this point... the man needs to be fired for what he's done, but also because any time a gay individual is involved in a case with Shirvell, it's going to be an issue.

    Really, what a pathetic human being, followed closely by the Michigan AG who's letting him keep his job.
  16. Sep 30, 2010 #15


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    Just a Jack Thompson wannabe.
    Last edited by a moderator: May 5, 2017
  17. Sep 30, 2010 #16


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    Mike Cox Slams Andrew Shirvell For Blog - Chris Armstrong Watch

    He also discussed a few scenarios where it would become appropriate to fire Shirvell. The article doesn't mention them, but they aren't hard to guess. If Shirvell identifies himself as the Assistant Attorney General in his comments, then he's speaking as a representative of the government and he can be fired for his speech.

    Even though it's not hard to identify public officials when they make public speech (which his blog and facebook comments are), as long as he's speaking solely on his own dime, then he's legally safe (at least theoretically - there's actually mixed results as to how well that has worked out for other people).
  18. Sep 30, 2010 #17
    Don't slam him, fire him. End of story. Anything less is just running at the mouth. In theory Shirvell might be safe, but if fired he wouldn't have a chance in hell of winning a lawsuit to regain his job.
  19. Sep 30, 2010 #18

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    Enough said? Exactly what are you saying here, waht?

    Are you saying that Shirvell is perfectly within his First Amendment rights, enough said?
    Or are you saying that Christians have no First Ammendment rights, enough said?
    Or are you saying something completely different, enough said?

    In any case, I would say not near enough said.

    The First Amendment does not exist to protect benign speech, insipid speech, or speech with which almost everyone agrees. It exists to protect ugly, distasteful, politically charged speech with which almost everyone disagrees. There are limits to ones' First Amendment rights, and being a government employee does place some additional restrictions. However, the discussion in this thread is not whether Shirvell has crossed the boundary between protected and restricted speech. The discussion is just on the fact that Shirvell's speech is ugly, distasteful, and stupid. Yep, it is, and so what?
  20. Sep 30, 2010 #19
    The first amendment doesn't guarantee the right to a job. NOBODY is arguing he should be fined or arrested for his speech. I argue that his actions show immaturity and a lack of character, and the state has a right to base employment decisions on that.
  21. Sep 30, 2010 #20
    wait a minute, you're saying to fire him because you think you can get away with it?
  22. Sep 30, 2010 #21
    I'm saying that in addition to his obvious mental issues, lack of restraint and maturity, and other good reasons to fire him, he ALSO wouldn't have a chance to regain his job. I'm emphasizing the absurd decision of the AG to retain someone (while clearly pushing for him to voluntarily resign) he calls a grunt, immature, etc. So no, I'm not saying just do it because you can "get away with it", which by the way implies that firing him would in some way require less than honest tactics. Is that what you're trying to say?
  23. Sep 30, 2010 #22
    yes, i think you clearly called for using less than honest tactics.
  24. Sep 30, 2010 #23


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    It seems that the assistant DA is hiding behind his religion to justify attacks on a gay man. What would happen to him if he started harassing and personally attacking the student body president because he was black (instead of gay)?

    I find it offensive in the extreme that it is (apparently) permissible for a public servant to publicly discriminate against anybody due to their sexual orientation. He should be out the door already. Michigan does not yet have a law that includes sexual orientation in the list of criteria that define "discrimination" though such laws are becoming more and more common.
  25. Sep 30, 2010 #24
    What tactics?
  26. Sep 30, 2010 #25
    Shirvell invoked his religion, which agrees with the trend across this country that this particular religion is against any sort of gay rights, let alone marriages. I believe that a slight perturbation towards fundamentalism is what motivated Shirvell to go off tangent and attack someone.

    But I agree with you that my first post is ambiguous. It was typed on the fly.
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