1. Limited time only! Sign up for a free 30min personal tutor trial with Chegg Tutors
    Dismiss Notice
Dismiss Notice
Join Physics Forums Today!
The friendliest, high quality science and math community on the planet! Everyone who loves science is here!

Students failing their first course of Algebra

  1. Apr 6, 2016 #61
    1 hour.

    By the way, the worksheets were all on unit conversions, and we got 20-30 problems a day that looked like this:

    10 kilograms=_____ grams
    3 centimeters=_____ kilometers
     
  2. Apr 6, 2016 #62

    ProfuselyQuarky

    User Avatar
    Gold Member
    2016 Award

    So that's just being drilled . . .
     
  3. Apr 6, 2016 #63
    True, but some people still didn't get it, so the teacher kept on teaching us the same lesson.

    But going back to the topic of the thread, the moral of the story about 7th grade science is that everyone has different needs, however only serving the needs of those who need more is not the right thing to do. What I did love about 7th grade science is that later in the year the teacher let me do an independent project on chemistry and physics. So, I tonight myself field theory. Naturally, being in 7th grade, I got it all wrong, but without doing that I could not have been where I am now, and I'm pretty sure I've got most of it. Self studying math completely (without help) is a horrible idea, but what I'm trying to say is that students need to be brought to their level, and not brought down to where the average to lower student is.
     
  4. Apr 6, 2016 #64

    symbolipoint

    User Avatar
    Homework Helper
    Education Advisor
    Gold Member

    Easy to say that, but in reality, you WILL find some students who are very confused about unit conversions, lesson singular or plural, irregardless of familiar ratios or unfamiliar ratios for conversions. (but to be honest, I had seen that difficulty mostly in students who never passed an Algebra 1 course).
     
  5. Oct 12, 2016 #65

    mathwonk

    User Avatar
    Science Advisor
    Homework Helper

    Generalizations about American education are difficult to get correct in my opinion. America is very diverse, and very accommodating to people of all backgrounds. When I graduated from a PhD program I had possibilities of teaching in Oregon, New York, North Carolina, and Georgia. By then I had taught in Utah, and Washington, (and later taught in North Carolina). I chose Georgia because it was near my home where my aged mother lived, and they offered me what sounded at the time like a better position. I was stunned by the low level of preparation of my students there, compared to those in Washington and Utah, but if I had chosen a position say at Columbia in New York, assuming it had materialized, I might now be raving about the high level of the stiudents' preparation.

    I don't know much about Belgium but I have recently read some studies about the different levels of high school programs available and not all (BSO?) are academically oriented. Moreover it is not clear that immigrants, even second generation ones, achieve the same level of academic progress there as do native born citizens and their children. In the US we sort of throw everybody in the same classroom, often until college, and regardless of interest or natural bent, and the results admittedly are quite mixed.

    I suspect we in the US have much to learn from many other more successful countries, but we may have perhaps different challenges. One person who has excelled at helping students who were failing begin to succeed is Uri Treisman, Reading his essays has given me some insight as to maybe why I failed so miserably in my first attempt at college.

    I went from a weak high school background in the southern US to a strong college in the north. I was used to being the best and being surrounded by low achieving peers. So I dismissed all attempts by the school to offer tutoring and help, and avoided studying together with my fellows. This was disastrous in a college where the other students were actually much stronger than I was and could have helped me enormously. The good news was that the college was used to this phenomenon and did not give up on me and other such strugglers right away, but gave us a second chance.
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2016
  6. Nov 30, 2016 #66
    I think it is unrealistic and unfair to students to expect them to all meet a universal standard. I like the German system in which there is tracking from a young age, because in most cases it is not hard to figure out how difficult an academic program a young person can succeed in. In Germany so far as I know they still use the three-track system, plus a 4th track for those who have special needs. I think the results of the German system speak for themselves. Put a kid into an educational track he or she can do well in, and everyone is better off.
    Concerning algebra, in my opinion not only algebra but geometry and even some types of arithmetic are beyond some students, while a few will find these subjects very easy. Most are somewhere in the middle of that particular curve. I'm not sure how we could change this.

    According to this New York Times article, failure in algebra class is reported as the number one reason for dropping out of high school.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/29/opinion/sunday/is-algebra-necessary.html
     
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2016
  7. Dec 1, 2016 #67

    Stephen Tashi

    User Avatar
    Science Advisor

    I agree. In my teaching days, I encountered students who made an effort, but just couldn't do algebra. Those were rare cases in the general population of students, but they do occur. A frustrating aspect of teaching such students is that they often can learn rote procedures, but get completely lost when when you explain things using even moderately sophisticated reasoning.

    Society's problem with educational standards is complicated. A person is required to attain requirement X. But perhaps he can do job Y without being able to do X. And yet perhaps the ability to do X correlates with his ability to do job Y even though it isn't a component of job Y. Employer's needing job Y want X to be a requirement because it makes it easier for them to identify people who can do job Y.
     
  8. Dec 16, 2016 #68
    This year I have privately tutored a Grad 9 student for maybe 10 hours just to pass one test and give him a sense of accomplishment. Another Year 11 student went from treating algebra as hieroglyphics to getting 75% in physics.

    These at-risk students often need intensive tutoring that I can not give in a class of 25.

    In Australia there is, along with textbooks and pracs that are used across the country. There is no point in duplicating curriculum in different localities.

    http://www.australiancurriculum.edu...nce/physics/curriculum/seniorsecondary#page=1
     
Know someone interested in this topic? Share this thread via Reddit, Google+, Twitter, or Facebook

Have something to add?
Draft saved Draft deleted