Telepathic Guy

  • #1
Stratosphere
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Last night on The Tonight Show, there was a guy by the name of Lior Suchard who did several strange things. He claims to have telepathic powers, which he "Demonstrates". I don't know how I would explain how he guessed the name of that song and how he knew the girls name was Katy, what do you guys think?

http://www.liorsuchard.com/suchard_en.html [Broken]

http://www.zimbio.com/watch/y-pblp9qSLF/Zac+Efron+s+First+Love/The+Tonight+Show+with+Jay+Leno [Broken]

http://www.zimbio.com/watch/-KB1sUdOynQ/Mentalist+Lior+Suchard+Part+2/The+Tonight+Show+with+Jay+Leno [Broken]
 
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Answers and Replies

  • #2
N468989
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There is another one that you can search: Derren Brown
 
  • #3
Chronos
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Allow me to test this by supplying the winning powerball numbers for next week.
 
  • #4
mugaliens
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Barring collusion and good acting on the part of Jay, Zac, and the music leader, it appears genuine.
 
  • #5
FlexGunship
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Barring collusion and good acting on the part of Jay, Zac, and the music leader, it appears genuine.

Genuine what?

James+Randi.jpg

James Randi is not sure if serious.
 
  • #6
mugaliens
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Genuine what?

I said it appears genuine. Stage magicians make things appear one way all the time, when in fact they're doing something different altogether, a fact James Randi knows well.
 
  • #7
Chronos
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I vote for Randi, he is no idiot and has been debunking this kind of crap for decades. He has a standing bet of a miilion bucks that no one can demonstrate paranormal 'powers' to his satisfaction. So where are the takers? The best the failed applicants can muster is - he is not fair. Haha. I'm still waiting on my missing lottery ticket winners. I even promised to spend any such ill gotten gains on humanitarian causes. Bull.
 
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  • #8
FlexGunship
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I said it appears genuine. Stage magicians make things appear one way all the time, when in fact they're doing something different altogether, a fact James Randi knows well.

Hah, sorry. Well, good magicians always appear genuine.
 
  • #9
Curl
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I vote for Randi, he is no idiot and has been debunking this kind of crap for decades. He has a standing bet of a miilion bucks that no one can demonstrate paranormal 'powers' to his satisfaction. So where are the takers? The best the failed applicants can muster is - he is not fair. Haha. I'm still waiting on my missing lottery ticket winners. I even promised to spend any such ill gotten gains on humanitarian causes. Bull.

It's easy to shout "fake fake" but you got to give these guys some credit. Of course they're fake, but there is still a lot of skill in making it look so real. I mean, you and I can't do any "magic" other than to trick a 5 year old.
 
  • #10
N468989
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As everything in science, without the correct test equipment and without knowing what to look for is a difficult task. What if Randi doesn´t use the correct equipment. It's like searching for light with a sound detector.
 
  • #11
FlexGunship
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As everything in science, without the correct test equipment and without knowing what to look for is a difficult task. What if Randi doesn´t use the correct equipment. It's like searching for light with a sound detector.

Maybe. You should try for his prize. Randi's one of the few guys that has earned my respect enough that I (possibly to my own peril) trust him almost blindly. I disagree with him sometimes, but if he says "bunk" I say "how high."
 
  • #12
Ivan Seeking
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I vote for Randi, he is no idiot and has been debunking this kind of crap for decades. He has a standing bet of a miilion bucks that no one can demonstrate paranormal 'powers' to his satisfaction. So where are the takers? The best the failed applicants can muster is - he is not fair. Haha. I'm still waiting on my missing lottery ticket winners. I even promised to spend any such ill gotten gains on humanitarian causes. Bull.

I still haven't seen how his candidates are selected. How many people apply but are rejected by Randi?
 
  • #13
FlexGunship
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I still haven't seen how his candidates are selected. How many people apply but are rejected by Randi?

He used to personally interview each candidate but eventually there became too many so he delegated to a small team. Finally, even the small team wasn't enough (plus it got expensive), so now he requests that claims be verified independently before interviewing anyone.

During the preliminary interview, the claimant must demonstrate his/her claim without any controls or restrictions. Randi or his delegate reserve the right to request a second performance and will usually video tape it from a few angles.

Then, Randi and his team come up with a set of guidelines which are reviewed independently. The formal test itself is carried out with strict controls and neither Randi nor his team are allowed to be present. A mutually agreed upon party carries out the test. If any of the controls are violated the test is thrown out and performed again later.

YouTube has a few videos under the tag of "JREF" and you can see some of the informal tests. Only a few people have ever made it to the formal test and none have passed.

The application has the actual rules (http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/1m-challenge/challenge-application.html).

The FAQ page answers a few gray areas (http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/component/content/article/37-static/254-jref-challenge-faq.html [Broken]).

He also keep a list of all of the applicants (http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/1m-challenge.html).

EDIT: To directly address your question. None are rejected. He accepts all applicants, its just that most of them don't make it very far into the test process.
 
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  • #14
Ivan Seeking
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And his work is published in what journal?
 
  • #15
FlexGunship
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And his work is published in what journal?

You don't have to be published to be investigated by Randi. If he only investigated claimants who were published in peer-reviewed journals he'd probably never test anyone!
 
  • #16
FlexGunship
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And his work is published in what journal?

Oh, wait, do you mean the telepathic guy? Or Randi?

Randi's work has been featured in peer-reviewed publications, but I'm not really sure what journal you get published in for debunking weird claims. In fact, I don't think he does research of any kind that could be published. It's a bit like asking a successful firefighter in which journals he's been published; it's not really a well thought-out question.
 
  • #17
loseyourname
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Telepathy wouldn't allow you to predict winning lottery numbers unless you were in the presence of someone else that knew what they would be. Telepathy is mind-reading, not predicting the outcome of random processes.
 
  • #18
FlexGunship
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Telepathy wouldn't allow you to predict winning lottery numbers unless you were in the presence of someone else that knew what they would be. Telepathy is mind-reading, not predicting the outcome of random processes.

I think Chronos was simply expressing disbelief in a sarcastic or humorous manner; I don't think he was trying to contribute to the discussion.
 
  • #19
loseyourname
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I think Chronos was simply expressing disbelief in a sarcastic or humorous manner; I don't think he was trying to contribute to the discussion.

Yeah, I figured. It's just a pet peeve of mine that every time someone claims to be telepathic, someone will respond asking for lottery numbers. Telepathy seems far more plausible to me than the ability to see the future. Thought at least creates signals of some sort, whether they be electricity in the brain, chemical signals transmitted through the air, or even just body language cues. The future hasn't happened yet.
 
  • #20
FlexGunship
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Yeah, I figured. It's just a pet peeve of mine that every time someone claims to be telepathic, someone will respond asking for lottery numbers. Telepathy seems far more plausible to me than the ability to see the future. Thought at least creates signals of some sort, whether they be electricity in the brain, chemical signals transmitted through the air, or even just body language cues. The future hasn't happened yet.

Eh, should be just as easy to test. Use a deck of 200 Zener cards. Have the guy (or girl!) your testing tell you which card came up. The only difference in the test for psychics and telepaths is how soon they answer: before you look at the card, or after.
 
  • #21
loseyourname
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Eh, should be just as easy to test. Use a deck of 200 Zener cards. Have the guy (or girl!) your testing tell you which card came up. The only difference in the test for psychics and telepaths is how soon they answer: before you look at the card, or after.

Yeah, I was the under the impression that people have done those tests, although I'm not making any claims regarding whether or not telepaths actually exist. I've never looked into it and don't really care. It's more that I don't even see how seeing into the future could be physically possible. I can see how telepathy would at least be possible.
 
  • #22
FlexGunship
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It's more that I don't even see how seeing into the future could be physically possible. I can see how telepathy would at least be possible.

Oh, come on, you don't give the woo-woo community enough credit. If Deepak Chopra were here, he could tell you how we would be able to see the future. Here, let me try:

The future is just the unexperienced present, there is nothing intrinsic to the idea that separates it from our experiential frame. Reality is an internal experience generated by the mind. The mind is not part of reality, reality is part of the mind. An endless ripple of waves on the ocean of the universe. We formally accept that the passage of time is the metric by which we arrange our insight, experiences, decisions, and moods "in order". When we realize reality is internal to the mind and that the mind is internal to the universal consciousness, the experiences of the future can freely be experienced just as we experience the concept of "today".​

<waits for applause>

Mindless drivel, but if I made it into a book, I'd make millions. If only I had no conscience.

EDIT: I had to add some nonsense about "waves." Deepak loooooooves waves.
 
  • #23
nismaratwork
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Oh, come on, you don't give the woo-woo community enough credit. If Deepak Chopra were here, he could tell you how we would be able to see the future. Here, let me try:

The future is just the unexperienced present, there is nothing intrinsic to the idea that separates it from our experiential frame. Reality is an internal experience generated by the mind. The mind is not part of reality, reality is part of the mind. An endless ripple of waves on the ocean of the universe. We formally accept that the passage of time is the metric by which we arrange our insight, experiences, decisions, and moods "in order". When we realize reality is internal to the mind and that the mind is internal to the universal consciousness, the experiences of the future can freely be experienced just as we experience the concept of "today".​

<waits for applause>

Mindless drivel, but if I made it into a book, I'd make millions. If only I had no conscience.

EDIT: I had to add some nonsense about "waves." Deepak loooooooves waves.

Speaking of millions, if you were telepathic, would you go public with it? In a way, that is one of the biggest hits against this kind of thing. Even if you don't become criminal, and it would be sooooo easy without the lottery peeve, I'm pretty sure you'd be snapped up on the grounds of national security.

Oh, and I hope that the quantum universe of our happiness-unconscious-unicorn-joybag gives Chopra something slow and terminal. :biggrin:
 
  • #24
FlexGunship
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I think that everyone has psychic ability, to some extent [some may disagree with that statement or some may agree].

Fascinating. So you are postulating a force, exerted by a brain which acts against material objects? I'm interested to know which force we should attribute this to. The brain seems to be mostly water, fat, and protein. Do you think that an arrangement of non-living water, fat, and protein could also exert a force on things at a distance? Let's develop this idea further.

It is very possible that he could know a stranger's name or information about them, as that is a type of psychic ability, as there are many, ie. medium-ship, intuition, even knowing what time your bus comes every day without knowing the actual time, etc.

Again! Fascinating! Could you imagine if there were even a tiny shred of evidence for this? Unsurprisingly, there is not. How do you think this information could be transferred? By what medium? Maybe the information is encoded into packets of smell and they are processed by olfaction on a subconscious level? If so, then how could a bus schedule be encoded in smell?

I'd love to hear more!

Some people who are famous are very real, for example, John of God in Brazil.

No idea who this is, but I'm 100% willing to take you word for it. Anyone named "John of God" must be legit. You can just tell by the DVD sales (http://www.johnofgod.com/). Anyone who makes that much money can't be lying!

To add, psychic ability doesn't mean you can know the lottery numbers, that seems a bit stereotypical, possible depending on the person, but most people use the ability to help people. For example, palm readers. 95% of them could be "fake" meaning they may have a little ability or none and use it for their benefit. Just an example. This is just my opinion, thank you.

You're welcome. Thank you for sharing with us. May I suggest nocturnal fencing, since you seem to enjoy "taking stabs in the dark" so much.
 
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  • #25
FlexGunship
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Some people who are famous are very real, for example, John of God in Brazil.

John of God claims: "15 million healed in his 35 year practice." If you assume that he works 8 hours a day, 5 days a week, takes no lunch break, and NEVER FAILS, then that means he heals someone every 17 to 18 seconds.

"What's wrong? Okay. Bam! Healed. How do you feel? Okay, good. Next! What's wrong? okay. Bam..."

Just confirming the diagnosis would take about 5 seconds, and then confirming that the healing took place is probably another 5 seconds. Leaving him about 7 or 8 seconds to heal a person.

This is assuming he never fails, always succeeds, takes no lunch breaks, and has never had a vacation in 35 years.

EDIT: Ooooooor... he's a dirty liar who deceives people for money and fame.
 
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  • #26
mugaliens
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Do you think that an arrangement of non-living water, fat, and protein could also exert a force on things at a distance?

Sure. Happens all the time, electrochemically, when I type, scratch my nose, or wiggle my toes. :)
 
  • #27
FlexGunship
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Sure. Happens all the time, electrochemically, when I type, scratch my nose, or wiggle my toes. :)

Okay, obviously not what I meant!

I'm asking our friend lj19 to compare (and contrast) a living brain and a dead brain. The only difference is persistent electrochemical activity. I would guess that "psychic abilities" (telepathy, precognition, etc.) are not electrochemical in nature.

On that point, specifically, I'm asking lj19 to comment. He has this wealth of wisdom and knowledge (of which science knows nothing about). This is our chance to have it shared.
 

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