Understanding 4-Momentum in General Relativity

In summary: So strictly speaking, the conservation of ##p_u## need not imply the conservation of ##p^\mu##. But from a more general standpoint, if you have a general description of how the various quantities in a system are changing with time, then the conservation of any one of those quantities is going to imply the conservation of all the others. So from that broader standpoint, it is meaningful to say that ##p_u## is conserved, even though it may not be strictly true that ##p^\mu## is conserved.What does this energy component include?The energy at infinity includes the energy associated with
  • #1
davidbenari
466
18
Conserved quantities in GR deal with ##p_\mu## not ##p^\mu## and while in Minkowski spacetime its easy to see what each of the components mean (since the metric is so simple) in general relativity I think its not and its starting to confuse me.

Why exactly is ##-p_0## the energy in general relativity? Is this because of the equivalence principle making the analogy to special relativity? What exactly does this energy component include? Only kinematic energy, what else can it include and how?

Also, many terms like ##p_\phi## arent exactly angular momentum even if they are referred to as such. Should I think of this sloppy language like we take generalized momenta in Lagrangian mechanics?

My main dilemma is with respect to the energy component of the four momentum (with covariant indices, that is, as a form)

Thanks.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
  • #2
davidbenari said:
Conserved quantities in GR deal with ##p_\mu## not ##p^\mu##

As long as you have a metric, you can always raise and lower indexes, so this isn't really a meaningful distinction.

davidbenari said:
Why exactly is ##-p_0## the energy in general relativity?

It isn't unless two conditions are met: first, the spacetime must have a timelike Killing vector field, and second, you must be using coordinates in which the "0" basis vector is tangent to the orbits of the Killing vector field. The first condition is necessary for there to be a meaningful notion of "energy" as a conserved quantity; the second is necessary for the "0" component of ##p## to be the only relevant one for the energy.

davidbenari said:
Is this because of the equivalence principle making the analogy to special relativity?

No. It doesn't have anything to do with the EP.

davidbenari said:
What exactly does this energy component include?

The more precise name for it is "energy at infinity", and it is only a constant of motion for geodesic motion (i.e., motion solely under gravity) in a stationary spacetime (i.e., one with a timelike Killing vector field, as above). Heuristically, it can be thought of as telling you how tightly an object is bound: an object in a bound orbit around a massive object will have an energy at infinity less than its rest mass, and the smaller the ratio of energy at infinity to rest mass, the more tightly it is bound. (Conversely, energy at infinity larger than rest mass indicates an object that is not bound at all--it is coming in from infinity and will escape to infinity.)

davidbenari said:
many terms like ##p_\phi## arent exactly angular momentum even if they are referred to as such.

Why do you say "aren't exactly"?
 
  • Like
Likes davidbenari
  • #3
PeterDonis said:
Why do you say "aren't exactly"?
Well ##p^\phi## is ##m\frac{d\phi}{d\tau}##, but if I have some complicated metric then ##p_\phi## won't "exactly" be ##m\frac{d\phi}{d\tau}## (rather it would be some complicated expression with the metric terms), so I don't know why people refer to it as the angular momentum.

PeterDonis said:
As long as you have a metric, you can always raise and lower indexes, so this isn't really a meaningful distinction.

Why do you think its not a meaningful distinction? The conservation of ##p_u## need not imply the conservation of ##p^\mu## so I think they are different in a meaningful way. For me ##p^{\mu}## seems more directly connected to equations of basic physics than ##p_u##.
 
  • #4
davidbenari said:
I have some complicated metric then ##p_\phi## won't "exactly" be ##m\frac{d\phi}{d\tau}## (rather it would be some complicated expression with the metric terms), so I don't know why people refer to it as the angular momentum.

Because angular momentum is not ##m d \phi / d\tau## in general, it just happens to be equal to that in special cases (the same ones where the metric is simple enough that ##p_\phi## is equal to ##p^\phi##).

First of all, there is the same issue here as with energy at infinity: ##p_\phi## is only a constant of geodesic motion if the spacetime has an axial Killing vector field and the coordinates are chosen such that the ##\phi## basis vector is tangent to orbits of that axial Killing vector field. The first condition is necessary for there to be an "angular" constant of motion at all; the second is necessary for the ##\phi## component of ##p## to be the only relevant one for that constant of motion. Given those conditions, the constant ##p_\phi## works like the usual constant ##L## for geodesic orbits in Newtonian mechanics, so it is called "angular momentum" (or more precisely "orbital angular momentum") for the same reasons that ##L## is in Newtonian mechanics.

Second is understanding the correct expression for the angular momentum constant of the motion (and indeed for energy at infinity as well). See further comments below.

davidbenari said:
The conservation of ##p_u## need not imply the conservation of ##p^\mu##

We need to be more precise here about what "conservation" means. Strictly speaking, what is conserved is a scalar quantity, not a "component" of a vector or 1-form; that scalar only looks like a particular component of a vector or 1-form because we chose particular coordinates. But the conservation laws in question are independent of any choice of coordinates, so to really understand them we need to express them in a form that is independent of coordinates.

The way to do that is to use the fact that I've already referred to, that each conserved quantity corresponds to a Killing vector field. So if energy is conserved, that means there is a timelike Killing vector field, which we can call ##T^\mu##. The conserved quantity "energy at infinity" is then simply the contraction ##T^\mu p_\mu##. Similarly, if angular momentum is conserved, that means there is an axial Killing vector field ##\Phi^\mu##, and the conserved quantity "angular momentum" is the contraction ##\Phi^\mu p_\mu##. These expressions are scalar invariants (like any contraction of a vector and a 1-form), so they are true independently of any choice of coordinates.

If we choose coordinates such that ##T^\mu = (1, 0, 0, 0)## (i.e., the "0" basis vector is tangent to the KVF), then we find that ##T^\mu p_\mu = - p_0## (assuming we are using the -+++ metric sign convention). Similarly, if we choose coordinates such that ##\Phi^\mu = (0, 0, 0, 1)## (where the "3" component is the ##\phi## component), then we find that ##\Phi^\mu p_\mu = p_3 = p_\phi##. But those expressions are only valid in the chosen coordinates; they aren't valid generally.

The above should also answer the question of why the conserved quantities are usually written with a lower index, i.e., as 1-form components: because in order to obtain the coordinate-independent scalar invariant, we have to contract the object's 4-momentum with the appropriate Killing vector field. The latter is a vector field (at least in its "natural" formulation), so we have to use the 4-momentum 1-form.

However, it is perfectly possible to swap the indexes using the metric, and write the conserved quantities as ##T_\mu p^\mu## and ##\Phi_\mu p^\mu##. These must be the same conserved quantities--i.e., we must have ##T_\mu p^\mu = T^\mu p_\mu## and similarly for the other one--regardless of what the metric is. This is true of any scalar formed by contracting tensors: swapping the positions of contracted indexes leaves the scalar invariant. That is why I said it doesn't really matter which one you consider to be a vector and which you consider to be a 1-form. Indeed, with the metric, you can contract two vectors, like so: ##g_{\mu \nu} T^\mu p^\nu##. This is still the same scalar as the other two expressions. (Similarly, you can use the inverse metric to contract two 1-forms.) All of these expressions represent the same physics, so there's no reason to worry too much about index placement.
 
  • Like
Likes davidbenari, vanhees71 and Markus Hanke
  • #5
Thanks. I think I've got it now. The thing is the course I'm taking (based on Bernard Schutz's book) only marginally mentions Killing vectors. I guess I'll read more about them as they seem to be really important to this discussion.
 

1. What is 4-momentum in general relativity and why is it important?

4-momentum is a mathematical concept used to describe the motion and energy of a particle in the context of general relativity. It is important because it allows us to understand the behavior of particles in the presence of strong gravitational fields, such as those near black holes.

2. How is 4-momentum different from regular momentum?

Unlike regular momentum, which is a three-dimensional vector, 4-momentum is a four-dimensional vector that takes into account both the spatial and temporal components of a particle's motion. This is necessary in general relativity, where space and time are interwoven.

3. What is the relationship between 4-momentum and energy in general relativity?

In general relativity, energy is a component of 4-momentum. The magnitude of the energy component is equal to the mass of the particle multiplied by the speed of light squared (E=mc²). This means that the energy of a particle is also affected by gravitational fields.

4. How does 4-momentum relate to the curvature of spacetime?

According to general relativity, the presence of mass and energy causes spacetime to curve. 4-momentum is a measure of the momentum and energy of a particle, and thus, it is also a measure of the curvature of spacetime in the vicinity of the particle.

5. Can 4-momentum be conserved in general relativity?

Yes, 4-momentum is conserved in general relativity just like regular momentum is conserved in classical physics. This means that the total 4-momentum of a closed system remains constant, even as the individual components may change over time due to interactions with gravitational fields.

Similar threads

  • Special and General Relativity
Replies
7
Views
1K
  • Special and General Relativity
Replies
3
Views
1K
  • Special and General Relativity
Replies
19
Views
1K
  • Special and General Relativity
Replies
10
Views
2K
  • Special and General Relativity
Replies
11
Views
1K
  • Special and General Relativity
Replies
15
Views
1K
  • Special and General Relativity
Replies
28
Views
481
  • Special and General Relativity
Replies
2
Views
916
  • Special and General Relativity
Replies
3
Views
850
  • Special and General Relativity
Replies
22
Views
1K
Back
Top