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To Those Who Don't Believe Alien Abductions Are Occurring

  1. Dec 22, 2003 #1
    For your entertainment:

    To Those Who Don't Believe
    Alien Abductions Are Occurring
    By Jim Mortellaro

    It has come to the attention of this writer, that some folks don't believe in the Abduction Experience. I speak, of course, of Alien abductions. To wit, aliens abducting humans for purposes of (ostensibly) some sort of genetic experimentation; genetic, since the alien species seem to dwell on our reproductive organs. In the nearly 58 years I perceive I've been abducted, from the age of about two years, they've never looked at my heart, lungs or for that matter, my rear end. The latter being something laughable among those who would deride those who claim the experience.

    Of course, there is no way by which I or anyone else may prove that we've had such experiences. Whilst I've been regressed by the best of the abduction researchers, namely Budd Hopkins, and since other rather famous and well respected researchers have examined my case and determined that it certainly appears to be true, there are still those who deny us our truth. It is you to whom I address in this piece.

    Complete text at http://www.rense.com/general46/dont.htm
  2. jcsd
  3. Dec 22, 2003 #2

    Ivan Seeking

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    uh oh!

    This does not help your case one little bit. How do you know this isn't just made up? We have no significant information; just a story.
  4. Dec 23, 2003 #3
    Which is why I said: "For your entertainment."
  5. Dec 23, 2003 #4


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    From "The Kids in the Hall",

    Alien: "We've been abducting and anally probing these humans for decades now, and the only thing we've learned is that one out of ten enjoys it."

  6. Dec 24, 2003 #5
    And interesting read, very entertaining.

    For those who take this seriously, note the underlined word "regressed". Regression Therapy is a New Age psychotherapy. While some psychotherapies are very effective (such as cognitive therapy), Regression Therapy is rejected as an effective means of treating a patient in Psychology.

    To add to that, there is no such thing as "repressed memories". However there is a very real phenomena called "False Memory Syndrome", so its always good to keep an eye out for quacks.
  7. Dec 24, 2003 #6

    Ivan Seeking

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    Re: Re: To Those Who Don't Believe Alien Abductions Are Occurring

    How do you defend this? My understanding is that repressed memories may not always be reliable, but they can exist.
  8. Dec 24, 2003 #7
    Amnesia is certainly a very real phenomenon. Whether or not repressed memories exist may depend on how you define it.
  9. Dec 25, 2003 #8
    Re: Re: Re: To Those Who Don't Believe Alien Abductions Are Occurring

    A little bit of Psychology...

    Most people confuse what are called "Suppressed Memories" with "Repressed Memories".

    A Suppressed Memory is the deliberate conscious of excluding undesirable memories or thoughts from one's head.

    A Repressed Memory is the unconscious exclusion of unpleasant memories from the conscious mind.

    Part of the confusion comes from the fact that "Conscious Repression" is a technical term for Suppression.

    More of the confusion comes from the fact that Supression and Repression are often used synonomously in everyday language.

    Very few Psychologists would deny Suppression (also called Conscious Repression). While the number of thoughts per day a human has is disputed (see Google Answers - Thoughts Per Day... some of the numbers range from 10,000 to 600,000), it no secret that most thoughts occur with any deliberate direction. In that, a few unwanted thoughts will creep in every now and then, and its very possible to shut those thoughts out (called Supression). Its possible for a person to actively shut out thoughts of trauma or past abuse, but that is not same as "forgetting". However in that deliberately silencing your thoughts, those thoughts of unpleasant occurrences can and do spontaneous "pop up out of nowhere".

    However, Repression is slightly different. Repression is an unconscious occurence where a person just forgets trauma. Everything from child abuse, to car accidents, and even war could be forgotten. Repression works like amnesia in a sense.

    Why is Repression rejected?

    1. One of the Psychologist Lenore Terr, she developed what in Psychology is called "Dissociative Theory". While she had legitimately good intentions, her Dissociative Theory of Repression was based on speculative evidence, it was essentially an unscientific theory. Much of what we know today conflicts with Terr's Dissociative Theory, so its proper to put that theory in the "Unsuccessful" drawer.

    2. Another reason why Repression is rejected is due to the fact that there is little to no scientific evidence that memories can be repressed.

    3. Repressed memories are thought to be the cause of everything from depression, anorexia, schizophrenia, insomnia, impotence, ADD/ADHD, and a whole host of other psychological disfunctions. However, there are no logical connections to repressed memories and any of the diseases named or unnamed.

    4. Oops! During Repressive Memory Treatment, some patients were dishonest. (The dishonesty is described in Psychology as an irrational form of "pleasing the Psychologist"... this dishonesty is nothing pathological, in fact most people have probably told stories to their friends that werent true either to impress them or to fit in or simply to fill in the silence that occurs during conversation... in Psychology, a bit of "pressure" is on the patient, that patient may lie... I forget what the technical term is called, I'll probably remember it when I wake up in the morning...)

    5. The Psychologists involved in Repressive Memory Therapy often make premature judgements to the nature of memories recovered during the therapy.

    6. Away from the Psychology, onto a bit of Neurobiology. In the brain is what is called the "corpus callosum". It is a set of 300 million fibers which connect the two hemispheres of the brain. It is also responsible for internal monologue (otherwise known as "thoughts"). To keep the description as short and easy to understand as possible: There is no mechanism that would account for the unconscious exclusion of memories.

    As to Repressive Memory Therapy, that is a dead (and potentially dangerous) psychotherapy. It is the one, as described above, makes presumptions that Psychological ailments are caused by repressed memories. Its dangerous because it can lead to False Memories Syndrome. The false memories can manifest into sexual abuse that never happened, alien abduction that really werent, or even Satanic Rituals that never occurred. I am aware that hypno-therapy and Repressed Memory Therapy to recover lost memories is not viable evidence in the Court of Law of the United States, I believe it was banned in the UK as of 1995 as well.

    To put it bluntly: The only way you will forget a tramautic event is if you are rendered unconscious while it occurs.
  10. Dec 26, 2003 #9

    Ivan Seeking

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    I knew a girl who started dating a skydiving instructor. She was a naturally daring person and wanted to jump ASAP! Rather than undergo all of the training for a solo free jump, she wanted to jump in tandem with her boyfriend. As they prepared to exit the plane, he asked her if she wanted to "just" jump, or if she wanted to tumble. Without hesitation she replied: Tumble!

    Out they went. She doesn't remember a thing between exiting the plane, and hitting the ground.

    I have talked with veterans who talk of memory repression; one Vietnam pilot in particular who entered something called [I think] a hot box. This is where a large perimeter of anti-aircraft weapons are positioned so that any passing plane is met with fire from all sides. He remembers seeing the sky ahead full of bright dots; as opposed to streaks. He knew that this meant that all of the fire is coming right at him! He remembers nothing from some time shortly after this until he landed back at the base with a shot-up F4.

    Also, don't we sometimes unintentionally modify memories to forget painful details? This also seems like a form of memory repression.
  11. Dec 26, 2003 #10
    Those are not examples Repression.

    When you are having lots of fun, or in great terror, photogenic memory becomes an inessential function. This is not repression nor is it comparable to repression, its the fight or flight response and its relationship to the Amygdala.

    The way human memory works, it does not store every thing that ever happens. There is not predictable pattern to things we remember, however we know we are more likely to remember things if there is long durations of emotion. If there are spikes of sudden fear or excitement, the memories will be fragmented (as all memory is), but not lost. Its possible to forget things over time, but that is not repression either.

    I dont know of any such mechanism outside of False Memory Syndrome that could account for that...
  12. Dec 26, 2003 #11

    Ivan Seeking

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    So you are saying that the two people in my example could never recover the missing memories of the events that they obviously experienced?
  13. Dec 26, 2003 #12
    They could create new memories that correspond to those events.

    But those memories would only be extrapolations of what they believe they should have remembered.
  14. Dec 26, 2003 #13

    Ivan Seeking

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    How do we know this?
  15. Dec 28, 2003 #14
    1. No, I am saying the examples you gave were not cases of Repression.

    2. Why do expect those people would have memories of events (i.e. The period of time while falling through the air, and the soldier incidence).

    3. People are not expected to remember everything. I probably wouldnt remember at all the last time I checked the mail, but that is not an instance of repression.
  16. Dec 28, 2003 #15

    Ivan Seeking

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    In these cases what strikes me is that it is possible to forget or not remember something that one has experienced. If this is true, and if these "memories" can be retrieved, I don't see any fundamental difference between these stories and "forgotten alien abductions"; assuming these abductions really happen.

    As for having memories of the events, the girl might have effectively blacked out. Her boyfriend couldn't see her, but after landing it was more like she was in shock than passed out. As for the pilot, he flew his plane home. Clearly he was conscious; at least this much is certain.

    To me the similarity between these stories and those of abduction are strong. All involve psychological trauma accompanied by lost or a lack of memories of the events. If these events could be recalled by some technique, I would see no significant differences between these and so called repressed and recovered memories; whatever we might call the mechanism for the loss and recovery of such.

    I really don't think we know enough about the brain to conclude that these events produced no memories. We can only say that if they exist, we don't know where in the brain they are found, or why they are obscured from conscious thought.
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