U.S. Said to Embrace Alleged Nazi Allies

• News
WASHINGTON (AP) - The U.S. government threw moral qualms to the wind in employing ex-Nazis after World War II, contend historians who examined a mountain of declassified papers released Thursday.

The government dishonored the memory of the victims of the Holocaust and American soldiers who died,'' said Elizabeth Holtzman, member of a government-appointed group studying millions of pages of files from that era.

Reinhard Gehlen, for example, was recruited by the CIA after World War II because he was chief of army intelligence for the Nazis on the Eastern Front, where most of the mass killings of Jews occurred. Gehlen was undoubtedly involved in the brutal interrogation of Russian prisoners of war, Holtzman said.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/worldlatest/story/0,1280,-4087967,00.html
I guess it's not really news. Under Project Paperclip, NAZI scientists were taken in by England, Russia, USA, Australia. I think Australia got about a hundred of them.

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hahahah, oh man, the Guardian isn't even trying to hide it's agenda of America bashing anymore.
You are right Adam, all of the allies ended up with scientists afterwards (hitler was screwed in the head, but he sure did employ some genius people!) Too bad the Guardian didn't feel it fit to mention any other country ;)

I am mixed on whether this was good or not. Von Braughn (sp?), maker of the V2 rocket, was technically a nazi scientist, but he wasn't directly involved in anything but rocketry. He later went on to head the program that put our first satellites in orbit.

Staff Emeritus
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Quite apart from the operation paperclip scientists, there were some sleazy deals right after WWII involving upper level Nazi officials. All those gauleiters didn't get to South America without someone in the Allies looking the other way!

phatmonky said:
hahahah, oh man, the Guardian isn't even trying to hide it's agenda of America bashing anymore. You are right Adam, all of the allies ended up with scientists afterwards (hitler was screwed in the head, but he sure did employ some genius people!) Too bad the Guardian didn't feel it fit to mention any other country ;)

I am mixed on whether this was good or not. Von Braughn (sp?), maker of the V2 rocket, was technically a nazi scientist, but he wasn't directly involved in anything but rocketry. He later went on to head the program that put our first satellites in orbit.
This isn't about Nazi scientists but people with blood on their hands apparently. And ofcourse, everyone is out to get you. Come on, this isn't exactly a secret that the US used former Nazis against the communists or anyone who was remotely left.

member 5645
Simon666 said:
And ofcourse, everyone is out to get you. Come on, this isn't exactly a secret that the US used former Nazis against the communists or anyone who was remotely left.
When did I say anything of this?

phatmonky said:
When did I say anything of this?
"The Guardian isn't even trying to hide it's agenda of America bashing anymore."

If it is an objective fact, why is it then America bashing?

Njorl
Simon666 said:
"The Guardian isn't even trying to hide it's agenda of America bashing anymore."

If it is an objective fact, why is it then America bashing?
In the newspaper business, there is a saying, "if it is more prejudicial than probative" it is bias. It does not matter if it is an objective fact.

Is there anyone who cares that doesn't know the US used the Nazis during the cold war? No. There is nothing probative in the story. It is only prejudicial. Yes, it is true, but it is bias none the less.

Njorl

There are new facts in it and such a book is controversial, so it is news material, whether you like it or not and whether some issues were known already or not.

Njorl
Simon666 said:
There are new facts in it and such a book is controversial, so it is news material, whether you like it or not and whether some issues were known already or not.
There might be something newsworthy in the book. If so, the reporter did a very poor job, because there was nothing newsworthy in the article. Other than the names, I had heard it all before.

Njorl

russ_watters
Mentor
Njorl said:
There might be something newsworthy in the book. If so, the reporter did a very poor job, because there was nothing newsworthy in the article. Other than the names, I had heard it all before.

Njorl
In addition, Phat noted the lack of balance - such stories focus on the US (as opposed to calling it a problem common to the allies) for a reason: bias.

I met Werner von Braun in 1972 at the TRANSPO exhibition (Dulles Airport, Virginia). Since then I have heard (The History Channel?) that his slave-driven rocketry program had suffered the greatest per capita deaths of Nazi prisoners by any German forced work projects. If unable to work, they were shot and replaced.

Please correct me if I am wrong. Shudder! That hand I had shaken as a boy! One small step for man, a grim reap for mankind.

kyleb
russ_watters said:
In addition, Phat noted the lack of balance - such stories focus on the US (as opposed to calling it a problem common to the allies) for a reason: bias.

nah, the reson was the story was based on recently declasified US documents, as is clearly stated in the article. but you apparently overlooked this key factor for a reason: bias.

Janitor
That hand I had shaken as a boy! One small step for man, a grim reap for mankind. - Loren Booda
It seems like it was Isaac Asimov who wrote that he was in a social situation where it was expected of him to shake von Braun's hand, and he refused to do so on the basis that he did not want to shake a hand that had shaken Hitler's hand.

It does seem like von Braun came under investigation by the Nazis during the war due to a suspicion that he was using time or resources to look into civilian uses for large rockets, such as planetary exploration.

I too have read a little about the terrible conditions under which the V-2s were built by slave labor. But the decision to do that was surely not made by von Braun himself? He was in charge of the design and testing of the rocket weapons.

Woomera Space Research Facility Took Nazis

I have paper-form documents from the Woomera Space Research Facility from the 60s. The names of some of the scientists on the papers (who were "working" in Australia, and under the guise of "NASA" there) are quite obviously German.

Its no myth...

Njorl
Nommos Prime (Dogon) said:
I have paper-form documents from the Woomera Space Research Facility from the 60s. The names of some of the scientists on the papers (who were "working" in Australia, and under the guise of "NASA" there) are quite obviously German.

Its no myth...
I am no fan of von Braun, but please don't equate all German scientists with Nazis.

Njorl