Uday and Quasay movie or photos

[kerimek]

Why the movie or photos are not presented yet (about 40hours after the action)? Do you believe that the movie or photos are not modified now? I don´t believe it and many people also. Perfect propagandistic material is in fact lost. Too late... Why?

 

[iansmith]

The picture have been publish today

you can see them at this link (it can be quite graphical for some people).
http://www.cyberpresse.ca/monde/article/1,151,1065,072003,376244.shtml

up to you to decide if its the real person or look-alikes

 

[Monique]

Originally posted by kerimek
Why the movie or photos are not presented yet (about 40hours after the action)? Do you believe that the movie or photos are not modified now? I don´t believe it and many people also. Perfect propagandistic material is in fact lost. Too late... Why?

Why? You want to make sure you have the right person and that it is politically correct to show the pictures of injured dead people, especially faces, in open media right?

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Originally posted by kerimek
Why the movie or photos are not presented yet (about 40hours after the action)? Do you believe that the movie or photos are not modified now? I don´t believe it and many people also. Perfect propagandistic material is in fact lost. Too late... Why?

Why would we fake it when they can just show up and prove otherwise. This would be a fraud too easily revealed. I don't think that given the worst of intentions we would be that stupid. We don't claim Bin Laden is dead; nor Saddam. Why do you think we [the US military and high government] would fake it given the ease of being shown as fools?

 

[kerimek]

USA are in propagandistic or information war,aren´t? In every war is time one of most important factors, isn´t? So my question is why United States allowed formation of enemy´s versions of the action due very long period between the action and photos presentation. Are you really so unprepared for similar situations? It seems me unlikely. Question is not whether the pictures are fakes. Question is, how many Iraqi people have confidence in you information sources after this mysterious delay. I´dont know your TV news but in our main news are faces damaged more than Sons every day. Do you think that people in post-war Iraq will be shocked by faces of two dead criminals?

 

[kat]

kerimek-Considering the outrage Americans felt, the claims of Geneva Convention violations that Rumsfield made when Iraqi's were displaying dead and captured American soldiers on television and throughout the media, I would be more surprised if they did immediately release photo's of the two brothers dead bodies. Imagine the claims of hypocrisy that would be made if they did not at the very least show a reluctance at displaying the photos. As you said, timing is everything...and I think in this case a timely pause and then allowing the Iraqi's to insist on seeing the bodies was the best way to use it as a "propaganda" tool without incurring international criticism.

 

[Monique]

Originally posted by kat
kerimek-Considering the outrage Americans felt, the claims of Geneva Convention violations that Rumsfield made when Iraqi's were displaying dead and captured American soldiers on television and throughout the media, I would be more surprised if they did immediately release photo's of the two brothers dead bodies. Imagine the claims of hypocrisy that would be made if they did not at the very least show a reluctance at displaying the photos. As you said, timing is everything...and I think in this case a timely pause and then allowing the Iraqi's to insist on seeing the bodies was the best way to use it as a "propaganda" tool without incurring international criticism.

Good point!

 

[russ_watters]

Originally posted by kerimek
USA are in propagandistic or information war,aren´t? In every war is time one of most important factors, isn´t?

Don't take this the wrong way, but you live in a place where up until 10 years ago, propaganda was an essential part of every piece of information you ever got from your government. Because of this, you far overestimate the importance of propaganda to the US, both when reporting this war in the American media and when prosecuting the war itself. The US has a free press and freedom of information - our government is open.

The release of these photos CAN be construed as propaganda, and the fact that they are being released at all is highly unusual. Essentially, the US govt is conceding to the Iraqi people's appetite for propaganda. Remember, up until a couple of months ago, they were also(much like the former Soviet Bloc) fed a steady dose of propaganda by their government.

 

[Dissident Dan]

Originally posted by russ_watters
Essentially, the US govt is conceding to the Iraqi people's appetite for propaganda. Remember, up until a couple of months ago, they were also(much like the former Soviet Bloc) fed a steady dose of propaganda by their government.

How do you know that they have this appetite?

 

[russ_watters]

Originally posted by Dissident Dan
How do you know that they have this appetite?

Because the Iraqi people themselves have said so. They have said they wouldn't believe without pictures or video (but of course then they will still assume the photos were doctored as we saw earlier).

The reason is conditioning. They've been fed it for so long they don't know what to do without it. If you lie to a person long enough and prevent them from ever even hearing the truth, eventually they start to believe it. That (and fear) is what held the Soviet Union together. It collapsed when they started allowing people to do things like travel to the west, where they found they'd been living a lie for their entire lives. Thats a pretty devastating thing too.

Immagine being a Soviet citizen who travels to Paris on vacation for the first time in say 1990. Imagine the BEWILDERMENT at seeing all the cars on the street. People dressed well. Supermarkets that have FOOD in them!

This is the kind of thing the average Iraqi is now dealing with. They've lived their whole lives being told that the west is evil and not seeing anything to refute that. And now the west has liberated them. They must be confused as hell.

 

[BoulderHead]

Originally posted by russ_watters
The reason is conditioning. They've been fed it for so long they don't know what to do without it. If you lie to a person long enough and prevent them from ever even hearing the truth, eventually they start to believe it.

Say, this wouldn't happen to be related to brainwashing would it?

 

[russ_watters]

Originally posted by BoulderHead
Say, this wouldn't happen to be related to brainwashing would it?

Not biting.

 

[BoulderHead]

Originally posted by russ_watters
Not biting.

No need, just glad to see we both share a common understanding on reality...