Unscientific American | The way we are taught science in school from grade school to college

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  • #51
PeterDonis
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I do know the answer and actually it's really easy to show, there is nothing complicated about it, but it just drives me crazy when people just can't simply say I don't know.
Wait a minute. Earlier you said:

if an electrical engineering graduate still has questions about ohm's law (I'm not the only one, in fact I'm in the same boat as 99% of the people I know)
So do you know or don't you?

And even earlier, you also said:

I'm not a student anymore, I can look them eye to eye.
So let me get this straight: you're not a student any more, you're not paying any of these teachers to teach you, you're just asking them questions, why, exactly? To yank their chain? If you're not their student, why do you think you're even entitled to the time of day from them, let alone answers to whatever questions you feel like asking? And it's even worse if you already know the answer, because then the only possible motivation I can see is that you want to mess with them.

From the way you're describing this, my wonder is not that you're not getting answers to your questions: my wonder is that you're not getting responses more pointed than "I don't know." Like, for example, "Go and find out for yourself."
 
  • #52
PeterDonis
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I'm asking a simple question. I'm not asking to be spoon-feed.
But you said you already know the answer (post #45, which I quoted in my last post just now). So why are you asking the question?
 
  • #53
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I'm not asking for experiments, I"m asking for REASONING.
Then I disagree completely with your position. I do not see this as a weakness in science education in general. I am sure a few deficient teachers exist in this regard, but it is a minor issue compared to the lack of teaching students to use the scientific method itself.

Do you have any actual published evidence that supports the idea specifically that a lack of reasoning is a problem in American schools or that schools with more reasoning emphasis perform better in some way? Frankly I am skeptical of the idea, it certainly doesn’t mesh with my experience or views on the topic.
 
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  • #54
russ_watters
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Why not give us the explanation for ohm's law directly. Why go to hypotheticals. I clearly stated ohm's law will be our standard and everyone has feel short as of now. I'm asking a simple question. I'm not asking to be spoon-feed. If you don't know the answer, don't lecture me. Just say I don't know.
Actually, I don't see that you have asked any specific questions about Ohm's law. So why don't you please do that; in the appropriate technical forum, and we'll see where that question goes.
 
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  • #55
russ_watters
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So let me get this straight: you're not a student any more...
Just to go back further for additional attempted clarity, the OP says:
"...from grade school to college..."

So the goalposts have moved (or contracted...).
 
  • #56
janda3
So let me get this straight: you're not a student any more, you're not paying any of these teachers to teach you, you're just asking them questions, why, exactly? To yank their chain? If you're not their student, why do you think you're even entitled to the time of day from them, let alone answers to whatever questions you feel like asking? And it's even worse if you already know the answer, because then the only possible motivation I can see is that you want to mess with them.

From the way you're describing this, my wonder is not that you're not getting answers to your questions: my wonder is that you're not getting responses more pointed than "I don't know." Like, for example, "Go and find out for yourself."
So let me get this straight. You expect students to not question you when they are student. Then when they graduated and are curious about things that didn't make sense and they feel more confident that then can ask deeper questions you close you're door and say you don't work for free. You're really showing you're true colors.

But you said you already know the answer (post #45, which I quoted in my last post just now). So why are you asking the question?
To prove the point that most people can't even explain the basics and how unscientific how science classes have become.


Actually, I don't see that you have asked any specific questions about Ohm's law. So why don't you please do that; in the appropriate technical forum, and we'll see where that question goes.
The point isn't to discuss ohm's law. The point is that such a it's simple law and you guys are having a hard time explaining it (i.e you don't know the basics).
 
  • #57
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The point is that such a it's simple law and you guys are having a hard time explaining it
I already told you that this is not the place for us to explain Ohm’s law. That is in the technical forums. If you wish to issue that as a challenge to this community then do it in the right place.
 
  • #58
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I do know what Ohm's law says and I do know how to use it. It's really more of what does it mean. Like what is current and and what is a voltage.
All you have to do is look up how these terms are defined. For example, current is the flow of electric charge across a surface. In essence this is the number of electrons flowing across a conductor. You could just as easily as I did look up the definition of voltage.

I do know the answer and actually it's really easy to show, there is nothing complicated about it, but it just drives me crazy when people just can't simply say I don't know. They just insist that ohm's law is true without themselves being able to prove it (another word is that they have faith, although they probably don't like that word).
I doubt this is the case. I already showed you how you could verify Ohm's Law, and you gave a weak excuse of not wanting to use modern electrical measurement tools.

Why not give us the explanation for ohm's law directly.
I already did, in post #23.

It really seems here that you have made up your mind, and are obstinately refusing to listen to the answers to the questions you've asked. Your refusal to listen seems more faith-based thann logic-based.
 
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  • #59
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At this time we are going to close this thread until such time as some actual evidence supporting the claims by the OP can be produced. If such is provided then we will start a new thread for that discussion as this one has become rather dysfunctional.
 

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