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docnet
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In your own words, why do humans look for and prefer symmetries in mathematics, physics, philosophy and in general?
Human brains developed to improve reproductive success. This requires recognizing prospective mates.docnet said:In your own words, why do humans look for and prefer symmetries in mathematics, physics, philosophy and in general?
Klystron said:We may be suffering from observer bias. Two eyes; we see two eyes; we see with two eyes. The brain has two hemispheres. The body exhibits bilateral symmetry. We observe symmetry; so, assume Nature must be congruent?
It would not be surprising if animals of a species preferred others in the species that are more symmetrical in appearance.bhobba said:It is possible that could be answered by biological psychology, but right now I don't think anybody knows why. The related question is why does nature prefer it?
BillTre said:This could well be selected for, as a way to find better quality mates (which is assumed to be behind a lot of sexual selection).
docnet said:In your own words, why do humans look for and prefer symmetries in mathematics, physics, philosophy and in general?
etotheipi said:It is because people try to look for non-existent meaning in what is a purposeless and messy existence!
Personally, I look for asymmetries.docnet said:In your own words, why do humans look for and prefer symmetries in mathematics, physics, philosophy and in general?
The challenge isn't finding meaning and purpose. We're pretty much swimming in an ocean of that stuff. The challenge is making sense of it, interpreting it, and not being overwhelmed by it.etotheipi said:It is because people try to look for non-existent meaning in what is a purposeless and messy existence!
Jarvis323 said:The challenge isn't finding meaning and purpose. We're pretty much swimming in an ocean of that stuff. The challenge is interpreting it and not being overwhelmed by it.
If there is no meaning in anything, then what is your basis for concluding that there is no meaning in anything?etotheipi said:Nah, I was saying the exact opposite! There is no underlying meaning; we have at best an operational understanding of the universe, and questioning why things are the way they are is a wooly philosophical question.
Nature doesn't care how you interpret it, and neither should we. That symmetries are maybe "visually appealing" is nothing more than a gimmick; it's just because people like pretty-looking things.
Jarvis323 said:If there is no meaning in anything, then what is your basis for concluding that there is no meaning in anything?
I meant, what do you mean there is no meaning?etotheipi said:What?
Jarvis323 said:I meant, what do you mean there is no meaning?
The world can be cruel, and I'll admit that my life has been like a nightmare at times. But there is a whole lot to be enamored with in the world. We don't necessarily need a well defined grand purpose. Enjoy the weather, watch the birds and insects, breath in the air, interact with your environment, exercise the mind, and try to stay healthy. If it's your environment that is getting you down, then try to change it, or try to find somewhere better. Or try to see things from different perspectives, and try to recognize and appreciate the things you take for granted.etotheipi said:Life is just a cruel joke, nothing is important and we'd be better off if nothing ever existed
Astronuc said:Personally, I look for asymmetries.
etotheipi said:{snip}
Nature doesn't care how you interpret it, and neither should we. That symmetries are maybe "visually appealing" is nothing more than a gimmick; it's just because people like pretty-looking things.
Isn't that a meaning?etotheipi said:Jarvis323 said:I meant, what do you mean there is no meaning?
Life is just a cruel joke, [...]
Klystron said:Ah, but artists often emphasize asymmetry in their compositions. The vase is depicted at an angle. The painter places the principle point of interest off-center according to arcane formulae. The center cannot hold. An Amazon covers one breast. Batman gets boring but the Joker entertains with the unexpected, like Dickens's more eccentric characters. Glaze runs willy-nilly down fine porcelain.
If this contradicts my post in the "Inadvertent Plagiarism" thread, that people prefer the familiar; this seeming contradiction supports the argument that the eye is drawn to the exception, the unusual, to (slight) imperfections.
Even the Batman reference? I was agreeing with your secondary point about beauty with a barrage of asymmetric examples from Art.etotheipi said:Sorry, I have no idea what any of that means
What does it mean for a "center" to "hold"?Klystron said:The painter places the principle point of interest off-center according to arcane formulae. The center cannot hold.
I was employing a poetic reference from Yeats:etotheipi said:I don't understand what you mean...What does it mean for a "center" to "hold"?
Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity
Not all paintings, surely. Your first two selections suffice to emphasize mild asymmetries in art.etotheipi said:But I found many paintings where the focus is in the centre, so I don't know what you mean saying the painter cannot put the focus in the centre?
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Symmetry is important in science and nature because it helps us understand and describe the world around us. It allows us to identify patterns and relationships between objects and phenomena, and it also helps us make predictions and solve problems.
Symmetry is closely related to the laws of physics. Many of the fundamental laws and principles in physics, such as conservation of energy and momentum, are based on the idea of symmetry. Symmetry also plays a role in the development of theories and models that help us understand the behavior of the physical world.
Living organisms exhibit symmetry because it is an efficient and effective way to organize and maintain complex structures and functions. Symmetry also plays a role in the development and growth of organisms, as well as their ability to adapt and survive in their environments.
Symmetry can be found in many aspects of nature, from the microscopic level to the grand scale of the universe. Some examples include the bilateral symmetry of animals, the radial symmetry of flowers, the fractal symmetry of snowflakes, and the symmetrical patterns in crystal structures.
Symmetry is often associated with beauty because it is aesthetically pleasing and can evoke a sense of harmony and balance. The symmetrical patterns and structures found in nature are not only functional, but also visually appealing. This is why symmetry is often used in art and design to create visually appealing compositions.