Number of Female Programmers: US & Worldwide - Answers Here

[lisab]

Something seems strange to me. A lot of males says females progies are practically non-existent while females says they are pleniful.

Maybe women programmers are only visible to women programmers.

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

I think there should be more women in programming. I was recently complaining about the lack of women in my field when my wife overheard. She takes a dim view of my generous nature. She says that while it is interesting to note the phenomenon, it is pointless to do anything about it. A more important issue is whether equivalent pay is received for equivalent work. This is not the case among males alone nor among females alone and this is as it should be in a free society. However, discrepencies in compensation between males and females as groups is prohibited by law. While I prefer fewer laws rather than more, I see no need for the discrepency and so consider this law less harmful than most.

 

[Math Is Hard]

Maybe women programmers are only visible to women programmers.

We have a secret hand signal.

 

[CRGreathouse]

A more important issue is whether equivalent pay is received for equivalent work. This is not the case among males alone nor among females alone and this is as it should be in a free society. However, discrepencies in compensation between males and females as groups is prohibited by law. While I prefer fewer laws rather than more, I see no need for the discrepency and so consider this law less harmful than most.

I don't favor laws of that type (though I am a *strong* advocate of equality, de facto as well as de jure), but my desire for more women in programming would probably encourage me to forsake my principles in this case. :uhh:

 

[mheslep]

I'm female and I've done programming in school ...

Then is that you above MIH?

 

[ideasrule]

However, discrepencies in compensation between males and females as groups is prohibited by law. While I prefer fewer laws rather than more, I see no need for the discrepency and so consider this law less harmful than most.

If female programmers are generally less skilled or less passionate about CS than their male counterparts, what logical reason is there to give them the same salary? You could use a hand-waving argument regarding "equality", but males and females are clearly not equal in almost every respect. Interest in physics and CS is one of them.

Now, mind you, I'm not saying that female programmers aren't as skilled; I simply don't know whether that is true. If it's true, however, and if a company decides it's true, arguments involving equality are moot.

 

[fileen]

If female programmers are generally less skilled or less passionate about CS than their male counterparts, what logical reason is there to give them the same salary? You could use a hand-waving argument regarding "equality", but males and females are clearly not equal in almost every respect. Interest in physics and CS is one of them.

Now, mind you, I'm not saying that female programmers aren't as skilled; I simply don't know whether that is true. If it's true, however, and if a company decides it's true, arguments involving equality are moot.

The stereotype that women are less skilled or less passionate about fields like computing or engineering probably has a lot to do with why women avoid those fields. I don't know what its like in computers because although I have an interest I have very little skill, however I know in the horse business which is my specialty, there is a lot of sexism in certain areas. For example, in racing. Most tracks refuse to install a ladies change room, and force female jockeys to change with men. The fact that there is often one woman for every 25-30 men leads to a very uncomfortable change room for everyone involved. Female jockeys have a very hard time getting jobs, and have to perform amazingly to get much attention. A lot of this has improved over time, but the reality is that the stereotype and discrimination is there. I worked a lot with race horses in preparation for the track, and after 2 or 3 run-ins with owners, jockeys and other trainers I quickly got the message that I would never belong or be respected because I was a woman. The owners were only comfortable with me working their horses if they knew I was being overseen by a man. I know that although there are many reason I don't wish to be involved in that business, the sexism is a huge part of it. I have no interest in getting to to a field where I have to fight for my position or respect because of my sex. Whether is exists or not, a perceived sexism in the field may be turning women of from careers in computer science. Sometimes one bad experience is enough to give a person a bad taste. I remember in high school there was a very clear line between the guy classes (computing, tech, etc), the girl classes (vocals, psychology, etc) and the smart vs non-smart classes. My last year of high school I had a few "friends" refuse to associate with me because I took physics for university prep (how I ended up on this forum) along with calculus, biology and chemistry. I just wanted to get into university, but the "smart kid" stereotype put me in a subgroup that I couldn't seem to get myself out of. I know that most adults don't behave so immaturely, but experiences like that may cause a person to focus their studies in different areas. A woman who takes computers in high school and feels social pressures (whether real or imagined) may decide not to proceed with those courses later.

 

[lisab]

If female programmers are generally less skilled or less passionate about CS than their male counterparts...

Please post a valid source showing that this statement is true.

 

[rootX]

Please post a valid source showing that this statement is true.

If female programmers are generally less skilled or less passionate about CS than their male counterparts, what logical reason is there to give them the same salary? You could use a hand-waving argument regarding "equality", but males and females are clearly not equal in almost every respect. Interest in physics and CS is one of them.

...

Interest in physics and CS is one of them.

You quoted the wrong part I believe.@general:
Last time, my friend wanted to be a female because of 20 male : 1 female ratio in our class and males going crazy when comes to helping females. Some just need to bring some tears and get >5 males helping them. Just few moments after, I saw another friend printing some pages for a girl who couldn't get the printer working and asked him for help. When I asked that guy to print some papers few weeks earlier his response was that he don't have enough money in his account :p

 

[lisab]

Last time, my friend wanted to be a female because of 20 male : 1 female ratio in our class and males going crazy when comes to helping females.

Wow...your friend wanted you to be a female ?

 

[rootX]

Wow...your friend wanted you to be a female ?

Sorry, I meant he wanted to be a female and his comment came few moments after a girl brought some tears and guys started helping her out.But no one was willing to help him.

 

[lisab]

Sorry, I meant he wanted to be a female and his comment came few moments after a girl brought some tears and guys started helping her out.But no one was willing to help him.

Ah, I understand now.

I never cried in school, and I never saw any of my fellow female students cry. In fact I never remember even asking anyone for help, and I never remember seeing any of my (very few) fellow female students play "helpless victim" to get help. All were very smart, strong, and capable. So your experience is nothing like mine.

 

[berkeman]

Now this is a question that not only bugs me but all the other male programmers I know in South-Africa (I do'nt know how it is in other countries): How many female programmers are there? And how and at what age do they get interested in programming?

I have heard that most female programmers are asian and that there are'nt that much in the US but I don't know if this is true.

I would like to know this because it would be nice to have someone who won't get bored if I start talking alorithims and procedure and could actualy understand what I am saying.

So if you are/are intersted in programming or you know a female programmer let me know in this post.

Well, now that the teeny-boppers have chimed in, here's a dose of the real world.

At my company, around half of the programmers are very talented women (with the other half being very talented males). All the way from startup through successful company, it's been about 50-50. And not based on quotas and such -- when you are a startup, the only things that matter are super productivity and working well under pressure.

Real world. Get used to it.

 

[ideasrule]

Well, now that the teeny-boppers have chimed in, here's a dose of the real world.

At my company, around half of the programmers are very talented women (with the other half being very talented males). All the way from startup through successful company, it's been about 50-50. And not based on quotas and such -- when you are a startup, the only things that matter are super productivity and working well under pressure.

Real world. Get used to it.

That's rather inconsistent with what most people here have said about female programmers. Can somebody else who works in a software firm comment?

 

[berkeman]

That's rather inconsistent with what most people here have said about female programmers. Can somebody else who works in a software firm comment?

Maybe inconsistent with the teeny-bopper males, but things are results-oriented here in Silicon Valley. Maybe some more comments from Si Valley?

 

[rootX]

Maybe inconsistent with the teeny-bopper males, but things are results-oriented here in Silicon Valley. Maybe some more comments from Si Valley?

You should provide some credible source to back up the claim that woman have equal share in the Silicon Valley programming jobs, or please elaborate.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/11/24/BULF149J4V.DTL&type=tech

Yes I would agree that women are equally capable. There is no difference between productive men/women.

Personally, I am unconcerned about the participation of men/women in technological sector.

 

[rootX]

Ah, I understand now.

I never cried in school, and I never saw any of my fellow female students cry. In fact I never remember even asking anyone for help, and I never remember seeing any of my (very few) fellow female students play "helpless victim" to get help. All were very smart, strong, and capable. So your experience is nothing like mine.

I don't think any of them is in the top 10% of the class (But we did have quite a lot girls from other years/classes in the Dean's Honors list etc). They don't play "helpless victims" intentionally but just are helpless victims unfortunately. I wish my class had smarter girls.

 

[Math Is Hard]

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/11/24/BULF149J4V.DTL&type=tech

This article is about senior management jobs at tech companies, not necessarily programming jobs.

 

[kldickson]

If female programmers are generally less skilled or less passionate about CS than their male counterparts, what logical reason is there to give them the same salary? You could use a hand-waving argument regarding "equality", but males and females are clearly not equal in almost every respect. Interest in physics and CS is one of them.

Now, mind you, I'm not saying that female programmers aren't as skilled; I simply don't know whether that is true. If it's true, however, and if a company decides it's true, arguments involving equality are moot.

You can't generalize from the group to an individual.

This is a sexist assumption to make.

 

[kldickson]

In addition, there is no indication that female programmers are less skilled than their male counterparts in physics and computer science.